: Once Upon A Time, A Gamer Schemed

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Once Upon A Time, A Gamer Schemed

I took a risk last week and posted something rather personal, something I would never have tried if I thought the community here would just laugh at the entire situation. And although I wasn't surprised at the encouraging replies, I was surprised at the number of responses. As Arnold said, it was epic! So I suppose you guys wouldn't mind hearing about the Part 2...

The part 2 started only a few hours after the encounter depicted in the previous piece. The girl in question called me, and it was one of the more bizarre conversations I've ever had...with anybody. As a general side note, I believe the art of conversation is a dying trait amongst humans, and I find it most disconcerting. Many people I met have difficulty meeting your eye, they mumble, they shift about awkwardly, and they can't maintain the simplest discussion for more than a few minutes. I attribute this to the electronic age, where there's increased communication, but the quality of that communication has suffered greatly. Simply speaking normally to someone almost seems like a sad and depressing impossibility...which is one of the reasons I liked this girl in the first place. I thought charm, in both men and women, died some time back in the late 19th century, but she always had a ton of it. Perhaps best of all, she was quick-witted, which meant our conversations were more like Sports Night and less like an athlete interview on ESPN.

Anyway, she called me in a lame effort to apologize for the appalling behavior of Mr. Pretentious Jackass, which made little sense. She was on board with his blatant insults in the store - clearly - so why should things change an hour later? And furthermore, what's the point of meeting for a drink so she can "apologize appropriately?" None of this holds up to a standard logic and/or common sense breakdown, and she threw the "I guess I just don't know what I want" cop-out, which I've never accepted from anyone in any walk of life. I understand emotional confusion. I understand difficult decisions. I understand not leaping about haphazardly without thinking. But she has already made decisions and she has already determined that I'm not worthy of her attention. Just because she made a mistake and she may have realized that the guy she's with now is a colossal moron, doesn't change the fact that I didn't measure up initially. Hence, I have little to no sympathy for this plea; this thinly veiled train of thought designed to make me entertain thoughts of forgiveness.

This was my state of mind when I met her for that drink a few nights ago. But as I sat there, listening to her convoluted and unconvincing train of thought, I began to reflect on something Arnold and I spoke about (half-jokingly) after the first situation. He's not around right now; otherwise, I would've told him before I wrote this - we're pretty good about listening to each other's stories - and maybe have come to some new conclusions. But anyway, he figured it'd be a damn good idea to adopt a mode of biblical-esque revenge: if she wants me back, I wouldn't go back...but just to piss that guy off, I'd still sleep with her. Now, I do have a firm sense of morality, but this often fluctuates with the push and pull of the reality we inhabit. In all honesty, my reality is now this: a jackass with an ego the size of Wisconsin essentially poisoned and stole away a very good woman (poisoned beyond repair, I fear), and justice dictates that he shouldn't escape without suffering consequences. My fist down his throat is great for the short-term but awful for the long-term (don't need an arrest record, thanks), sooooo...

But of course, I could only consider this plan of action if I perceived the door was open at our meeting. And as rambling and falsely apologetic as she was - continually ignoring the fact she effed up - it was clear that said door is indeed open. Or, if not open, at least unlocked. But before I ask what you all think I should do, please bear in mind that I will get nothing out of this besides revenge. I have no interest in rekindling anything with this woman, and I really don't care what the hell she does. So remember, if I do this, I'd be hurting Mr. Pretentious Jackass (which I have absolutely no problem with), but I'd also be hurting her. So I suppose the sub-question is, should I really lay half the blame on her? Does she deserve the hurt I'm going to inflict? And don't think I won't read the responses; I do value feedback, and I wouldn't post this unless I did.

Lastly, I'd like to leave you with this. Down through history, men and women have fought a pitched battle that never ends, and the prize that can never be claimed may indeed be a lie. The idealistic concept of love, devised almost entirely by the imagination of literary masters who could allow our innermost thoughts and desires to explode in vibrancy on a simple sheet of paper, may, in truth, be fictional. Perhaps we're hindered and haunted by a romanticized vision of a wonderful concept, a concept that human weaknesses and deficiency can't allow to exist. Nevertheless, we can never kill that notion, and there's a reason why: the world instantly becomes almost intolerable without it. Hence, it may be more about survival than anything else.

12/5/2008 Ben Dutka

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Comments (160 posts)

recks1jtp
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 10:54:41 PM
Reply

"Search your feelings, BEN, you can't do this. I feel the conflict within you. Let go of your hate." -Luke Skywalker

It doesn't seem like the end will justify the means in this case. It's not worth hurting her to get to him, especially if you wouldn't hurt her in any other situation. Take solace in the fact that the door IS in fact open (or at least unlocked), and it's open under his watch. And that's something he'll never have over you. Be the better man. His time will come, arrogant prick that he is...

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Bugzbunny109
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:48:30 PM

Yea Ben, i agree with recks1jtp. It would be psychedelic to get back at Mr. Pretentious jackass but if its gonna hurt the girl, I suggest you dont. SHE doesn't deserve THAT kind of castigation........ or does she *Evil smile* just kidding :)

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NealRad
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 10:58:32 PM
Reply

The guy deserves what SHOULD be coming to him. You gotta go for it man. Don't ever let someone insult you or what you do without getting back at them. Although I do feel bad for this lady you are talking about. You could potentially hurt her and what could be a sweet friends with benefits kinda thing =]. Maybe this is a good point for you decide to totally end it, or get the last laugh. Buttttttt.... If she's hot and you got the chance go for it man. Who knows maybe she WILL change and leave that tool and come back to you and you will accept her back =] But anyways, just go for it Ben. But, what do i know im just 15 years old hehe.
Good luck my man

Last edited by NealRad on 12/5/2008 11:01:35 PM

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John Shoemaker
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 10:58:58 PM
Reply

I wouldn't do it. In all honesty it wouldn't be right.
You would hurt him, which is fine by me. But you would hurt her. Someone who I can tell doesn't really do much for herself if she is influenced by those kinds of people. And by sleeping with her you would not only be putting the thought into her head, you would be hurting her because you don't want to be with her anymore. That isn't the right kind of hurt.

If you really want to do something. Revenge sort of speak, then I would go with something else. Technically, if he hits your first, you can hit him back in self defense. But how far you beat his ass is up to you. And whether or not they charge you for anything.
Or just kick his ass in a race.

Last edited by John Shoemaker on 12/5/2008 10:59:58 PM

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BikerSaint
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:08:56 PM
Reply

My take.....by her not stepping up to the plate when the "ambulance chaser" thought he could diss you, she's just as at fault as he was.

She needs to grow a back-bone!!! There's not much worse than spineless jellyfish(no disrespect to any jelly's of the ocean variety).

I'd take the high road(my version,LOL)
"Wham, Bam"(but with a....)"No thank you mamam".......right after.

But just make sure you put a copy of the sex tape on U-Tube first.

Payback's are a bitch!

Last edited by BikerSaint on 12/5/2008 11:15:36 PM

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blitz30952
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:16:31 PM

I agree with Mr BikerSaint,
She needs to grow a backbone and leave you alone whilst you Ben should not hurt her just to get to "Mr. Pretentious Jackass" even though he sooooooooooooo deserves it (I'm surprised you didn't floor him after what he said to you...)

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Qubex
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:55:50 AM

blitz30952... I don't think Ben would react irrationally in a silly situation... if the chance is there, step back, think about what you are about to do before doing... If your life is threatened obviously most people who can, who are quick enough, will probably react, and usually resort to some sort of violence... if pushed!

Q!

"i aM hOMe"

Last edited by Qubex on 12/6/2008 2:56:19 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:04:47 AM

Yeah, see...backbone. MORE women should have that, goddamnit.

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blitz30952
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 5:26:48 AM

heehee, thanks for advice Qubex.. kinda reminds me of this acronym i was taught in primary school - WITS
Walk away
Ignore
Talk to someone about it
.. can't remember the S though :P...

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lolrrodlol
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:27:29 PM
Reply

First let me say I find it rather amusing to read something like this on a gaming site.

Now as for your big decision, I earnestly recommend you do it. She fu**ed you over, and she's clearly not the girl you once thought she was. She deserves what she's got coming to her, so go ahead and fu** her (in every sense of the word) and that a**hole as well.

They not only insulted you and laughed in your face on multiple occasions, but they also fu**ed with you in a more personal way. It's time to return the favor, and to make the a**hole look like a fool.

I am admittedly a proud and somewhat vindictive person, and I tend to take any insult quite personally. So this is all based on how I would feel if I was in your situation, you may not take it as seriously. Of course I also don't know all the details. The point is, this is just my two cents, but I do genuinely mean it based on what you've told us.

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Qubex
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:58:00 AM

lolrrodlol... I don't think what you have written is sensible advise!

Q!

"i aM hOMe"

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Jojoman
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:45:55 PM
Reply

Forget what it would mean to Mr. Jackass or her for that matter...

What would it mean to you? I can't judge your desicion and say wheather it's right or wrong.
Only you know which desicion you can live with and which one is worth it to you.

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eaglebaize
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:49:19 PM
Reply

:( I really would recommend that you don't do that to her, dude. Sure, that guy's a cocky jerk, but haven't we all met at least one of those in our lives? It's (usually) not good to let your anger get the best of you, and in this case, I believe it isn't the answer. However, it's your choice and your life, not mine.

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inkme101
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:49:48 PM
Reply

i'd do it. she didnt mind running to him.she let him brainwash her theyre both guilty i say give em both what they got comin. and if ya do then take pics, get it printed on a christmas card and send it to the jackass. and bam 2 birds 1 stone. but thats just my opinion, unfortunately im quite evil. so maybe dont take my advice. but god would that be funny, not to mention very fulfilling on your end.

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Reccaman18
Friday, December 05, 2008 @ 11:50:11 PM
Reply

Revenge is always sweetest when it is planned. But, karma (if you believe in it) will eventually take care of everything. They will get theirs in due time.

Last edited by Reccaman18 on 12/5/2008 11:54:34 PM

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:17:08 AM

Agreed. One must also make sure not to be in the same "vacinity" when the sh*t hits the fan.

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:04:53 AM
Reply

Anyone see that movie where Jack Nicholson stars as this novelist? In one seen, a receptionist walks up to him for a signature and asks him about how he is able to understand women so well. He responds, "Simple. I think of a man, and then deprive him of reason and accountablility." As chauvinistic and politically-incorrect as it sounds, it's true. Women are wired differently. Twenty-five percent of her time, more or less, she IS biologically predisposed to being less rational than a male genetic counterpart of herself. What does that mean? If a man and a woman make the same mistake, a man is more blameworthy.

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:03:48 AM

After offering an answer to your first question, I must say this. All kidding aside, although it maybe forgotten in an MTV culture that values bling-bling and bootycalls, Chivalry ain't dead. Your nobility will be your praise in victory, and best defense and mercy during the darkest hour. Don't let go of it for anything or anyone. It will reward you in good times and compensate you if you are harmed, even if it's a long time coming.
And Love occurs when you care for someone more than your own self. But it does not occur without happening both ways. Infatuation may happen both ways, but it does not stand the test of time. Lastly, be selfless, and the opportunity will present it self to you, be it in love, or war. The catch is, you can't do it for yourself.

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MirrorSoul
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:06:03 AM
Reply

I say do it Ben but dont burn the bridge fully down....you could get more from that connection later on. Burn the bridge but leave a couple planks up for future use lol!!

Last edited by MirrorSoul on 12/6/2008 12:06:14 AM

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MirrorSoul
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:06:04 AM
Reply

lol!!

Last edited by MirrorSoul on 12/6/2008 12:06:25 AM

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JaXXX
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:20:01 AM
Reply

To my mind Ben she opened(or unlocked) that door herself while in a relation with that prick, so i dont think it will hurt her but it will surely piss of the jackass, just like u want it to be)))
So yeah go for it

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Zaben
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:29:19 AM
Reply

My vote is no. Spending anymore time with her would just be a waste. You could be doing something much more productive, such as playing video games or watching TV. If you really want to then go right ahead but do you want to look back on this day in the future and wonder just how much you hurt this girl?

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Jed
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:30:30 AM
Reply

"if she wants me back, I wouldn't go back...but just to piss that guy off, I'd still sleep with her."

I was rolling after I heard that.

I can't really say what I would do in that situation, so there is no way I can say what you should do. Just think about this, How will you feel after that? I'm sure it would be great to get back at the jackass, but how would you feel about hurting the girl? She obviously feels bad about what happened, even though she let it happen. She did make an effort to apalogize, however half-assed and stupid it was. She did make the effort.

Whatever you do decide to do, you have to tell us what happens.

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aaronisbla
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:48:23 AM
Reply

honestly ben, i don't think you should do it unless she is worth getting back together with.... and if she is hawt, in this case i think she is.

I think sleeping with her just to make him mad would only last for so long, he might be cheating for all we know. However, if you really like this chick, do it AND get her back, that would hurt more in my opinion

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NealRad
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:48:33 AM
Reply

I dunnoo, maybe you should win her back over. She sounds like an innocent lady that would be great company if pointed in the right direction. Her mind is tainted with that guy. Maybe it was meant to be. The awkward encounter was meant to happen.win her over. She cleary misses you is she wanted to hang out and apoligize. get her back Ben=] or take my previous advice and just ravage her and screw em over=]

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:52:02 AM
Reply

Thanks much guys.

But I have to add an unexpected twist: the woman in question currently sleeps about eight feet behind my on my living room couch. She stopped over on her way back from a club with friends...wanted to talk. NO, nothing happened. We talked. She fell asleep.

I'm going to bed now. MY bed. Arnold is gonna laugh when he reads this... This night is going to test my patience; I can already tell. Is "patience" even the right word? Christ. I dunno. Tired. Later, gents.

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/6/2008 12:52:48 AM

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SHADOW [Moderator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:14:33 AM

BEST COMMENT OF THE DAY. (and techinically it is still yesterday here on the west coast). Hands down.

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Itdoesntmatter
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:49:36 AM

8 feet?? Have you heard any funny noises between her and the jackass? lol

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WelcomeOblivion
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:52:09 AM
Reply

Revenge is an endless circle. If you get back at him he's going to want to get even with you.

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Wage SLAVES
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:03:22 AM
Reply

Ben, that is classic gentleman. Wouldn't have expected anything less. Guess what. She'll remember that and it will be emblazoned in her mind. Your gonna be that guy that knows how to listen. Exactly what the ladies LOVE...best of luck what ever you decide from here on...

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Sir Shak
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:11:03 AM
Reply

i think in your head you have made the decision but are struggling with your morals.
you should go for it because that guy has made it clear that he thinks he is more of a man than you are and the girl concurred with her silence .
the fact that you poured your feelings out to complete strangers the other day tells that you were really hurting .
this guy needs to be taught a lesson so he would think twice before being an asshole to someone else from now on.
and even if you dont hurt the girl yourself,you think this guy is going to be true to her ? she got herself into this and is gonna get hurt one way or the other.
so i say take your revenge cause its sweeter than people make it out to be.

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Qubex
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:02:34 AM

No, I think all of this is immature... Ben should just let it go!

Q!

"i aM hOme"

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NealRad
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:23:19 AM
Reply

She misses you. She could be getting tired of that idiot. Give her a chance mate.

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:31:07 AM
Reply

Ben, you kicked yourself for giving your hand the other day in the mall. Now you're giving your living space. Very accomadating... I hope she hasn't read this stuff. Out of precaution, delete everything...except for all the game-related stuff, ofcourse :)

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Scarecrow
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:34:16 AM
Reply

Revenge is sweet!
Mercy is for the weak

You ask me not only does HE deserve this, but so does her.

Just make sure you've made up your mind that you'll never like her again.

By the way I agree with everything you said 'bout communication and how talking to people these days is like doing push-ups(which people naturally hate).

No longer are people interested in other people's views, ideas, ways of being. These days they want the other person to be perfect or they can just go back to their DIGITAL lives and find their perfect guy/girl there.

Anyway Arnold could best advise you, imo.
Me? I would so take revenge

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:34:53 AM
Reply

Somehow I missed your original story and have just been able to catch myself up..

It is painfully obvious she still digs you. You were the one who broke it off which means she wasn't ready to give up on you. She was the one who got your attention in the mall. Then got in touch with you to apologize. From the sounds of it, she doesn't agree with pretentious jack-ass' behavior but tolerates it since he is a colleague.

I agree that the art of conversation is a dying art, but lets not forget that communication is the real reason for a conversation. I mean really getting your point across to someone and you really getting their point. (The latter being the one MOST people miss) Your IQ's and your wits are equally matched and I'm sure you had some decent times together. That unfortunately is one piece of the puzzle. I've come to realize after going through a divorce and finding my one true love that if your interests, ideals, goals, and IQ are not aligned it just wont work. From your description it sounds like you have already decided she isn't the one.

Now Ben, you must have gave it to her right if she has gone through the trouble of getting your attention twice. I don't see any harm in obliging. You are a single guy with no ties to anyone, whats the harm in giving it another try? I'm not saying she is a piece of meat, if you are going to go through with it you should at least try to really communicate with her. Maybe you missed something? At the very least, there is no harm in a booty call when you are on the market.

I apologize for my poor grammar and writing. I'm a doctor not an author and it's quite late. ;)

Last edited by JPBooch on 12/6/2008 1:38:37 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:07:21 AM

See now, that sounds like the simple logic and reasoning of a veteran in the world of relationships. I'm NOT one, so this helps. I will have to decide for myself if she's worth going after a second time - and you're right; I've basically made my decision on that - but I'd be interested to know what makes her...um...gravitate towards me. When, by all rights, she shouldn't be doing that.

It's just this change of heart in her that has me puzzled and annoyed. I'm not buying her apology (or her apology for the other guy), so it's hard...

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recks1jtp
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:22:38 PM

Maybe her change in heart has come at realizing who the pretentious jackass really is, and what she gave up in follwing him in the first place...Ben, don't sacrifice who you are. If anything, that's what drew her to you in the first place, and that's what has brought her back. It's just the peer pressure of her "peers" that's clouding her mind. The moment you give up to these a**holes and play their game, is the moment they win.

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Joe_III
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:38:18 AM
Reply

I'm probably going to end up getting banned for this, but it needs to be said:

To anyone who tells you to go for it is a chickensh** whose closest experience to a relationship was getting frisky with the family dog late one night. It's a**holes like you that cause all the problems in this world.

As for you, Ben:

How can you deplore the degradation of society and then come up with this kind of sh**? I am truly embarrassed on your behalf.

If you're trying to show the guy who the man is, this won't be a real effective process because he'll see it more of a failing on her end than a strength on yours.

Grow a pair and step up to him if you feel you have something to prove. You don't have to fight to show him who's boss, but you can easily do so in a way that won't hurt a girl.

Have sex with the chick if you want, but do it cuz you want to, not because messing with the girls head and her relationship is going to make you more of a man. Because you wouldn't be.

I might have thought of things like that fleetingly when I was in high school, but even I have outgrown things like that.

A man should be willing to get stabbed to avoid harm to a woman (or child) and call it a fair trade.

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/6/2008 10:30:25 AM

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Joe_III
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:44:19 AM

After all, this guy is a lawyer. You know how easy it is to mess with a lawyer? If he lived in cali for example, you could get him in loads of trouble. With his bar number alone, you could wreak massive havoc.

In most states, all you woudl have to do is just simple file a suit saying he gave you incorrect legal advice informally, scream about it some on consumerist.com, and his firm would most likely dump him for someone with more experience in a second in this economy. If he's a solo practitioner, its even easier. Throw in a BBB complaint with the rest and some craigslist shoutouts, and he'll probably lose half his business...

Why mess with the girl? If you're still having security issues concerning her, then figure out a better way to deal with them...

Last edited by Joe_III on 12/6/2008 1:44:45 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:11:46 AM

First of all, I believe you said at one point you were married...? If so - and I don't want to insult any other married individuals in here - than I can understand your vehement reply. I have the feeling my married friends would respond similarly.

However, I believe that when men get married, they're far more ready and willing to make excuses for women's misconduct. They're more willing to heap all blame, even if it's not necessarily deserved, on the man's shoulders. I'm not sure if this is due to years of giving way to a woman or what, but I sense this from married men. In the world of the single people, women sleep 'em and leave 'em on a daily basis, and while I KNOW she didn't do this to me, I wouldn't necessarily do it to her, either.

Some women get what's coming to them. I just don't know if she's guilty. That's the issue.

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Itdoesntmatter
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:43:39 AM
Reply

Even though general rule of thumb would have it that revenge is a horible word, I would say go for it. I don't think you'd be hurting her because it's not like she has no clue what she wants and she's basically passed on both of you. My vote is for YES and send him a personalized video of the whole thing.

Funny how this site has turned from a gaming blog into a Dr. Phil blog....but I like it lol (this coming from someone that almost never posts)

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SHADOW [Moderator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:35:36 AM

Uh oh. You used the word blog. Ben hates that word. LOL. Anyway just as a kind of aside... while I loved this two-part post you've put up Ben, it definitely doesn't help the "we are not a blog" argument. But PSXE is not a blog, just for the record.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:12:41 AM

We're NOT....A....!

Eh, it's okay. Thanks, Shadow. :)

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Advent Child
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:53:02 AM
Reply

I'm sorry but I agree with the guys who say don't do it. I personally think you would hurt her way more than you would hurt him. The guy is a jackass and will probably remain so and will probably be mostly unfazed that one of the flavors he is tasting right now is soured. She is going to feel a lot more pain than I think she deserves. Don't do it man.

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Qubex
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:04:38 AM

Another "don't do it" individual... great stuff Advent Child; as it should be!

Q!

"i aM hOMe"

Last edited by Qubex on 12/6/2008 3:05:08 AM

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Sir Shak
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:09:31 AM
Reply

do whatever you feel is right but dont let that guy get away....find some way to break that piece of s*** and make him cry like a b**** .
but as i said before , this girl has dug herself a hole.
and joe, no one is talking about gallantry hear....we just want this guy to suffer cause all of us have come across a guy like this in our life....the chick is just collateral damage and no one is talking about hurting her physically.

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Dystopia
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:11:07 AM
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Ben don't do it please, revenge is never an option for anything. You can beat the Jackass up if you want but don't do anything to the girl. If anything the torture of losing you will eat her up with time. If anything that's a better revenge than sleeping with her and destroying her emotionally. Do the right thing and leave the girl alone but deal with the Jackass. Somewhere out there in a galaxy far far away Yoda would be proud if you make the right decision.

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slayerkillemall
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:20:05 AM
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i have no sympathy for sluts,so i say go for it.

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Bugzbunny109
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:42:48 PM

sluts? dude...... not cool

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WorldEndsWithMe
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:21:59 AM
Reply

It has already been decided, I've dealt with anough weasels in my time to know how to make them into dicks so that the girl just leaves him. Once he finds out she spent the night at your place (no matter if nothing happened) it will stick in his mind and drive him insane.

Back to the original post, I say you can go for it with no guilt whatsoever. She clearly wants it, the light is on, she's holding open the door, and the doormat says "Welcome Ben Dutka"

Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 12/6/2008 2:22:23 AM

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Qubex
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:06:16 AM

If he is a nutter; he could hurt the girl in some way... I think its best nothing is said and Ben walks away...

Q!

"i aM HoMe"

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ImBack
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:37:07 AM
Reply

Deleted by a moderator.

SHADOW [Moderator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:20:13 AM

And... banned. Congratulations I believe you are the first person to post 4 bannable messages without ANY of them actually making it through approvals. Seriously, what an accomplishment. I love a panzy man that needs to spread his slander in the dead of the night when he thinks no one will catch him. But night is the time when shadows are king. (that last sentence was purely for King James' amusement)

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FLYING_APE
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:35:39 AM

Your wose then me bro lmao

Nice blog ben :)

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FLYING_APE
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:36:22 AM

WTF did he say anyways rofl

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Jed
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:47:23 AM

He is a jackass that keeps signing up with different names and leaving malicious comments

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Jed
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:46:06 AM
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what a cliffhanger...

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FLYING_APE
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:37:25 AM
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I think you should go for revenge god will forgive you if there is one

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JoshBall
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:43:45 AM
Reply

Hey Ben, just read both of your posts

hmmm

At first i think you should spend a real lot of time with her, to make him insanely jelous and if she stays around more without nothing happening, he could presume that something HAS happened and that would tie his head in knots. As for sleeping with her rofl i'll have a think about it for you hahaha!

=]

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karneli lll
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:07:29 AM
Reply

You lower yourself to the jerk's level then you too will be a jerk. As for the gal, dont you think having a jerk for a boyfriend is punishment enough?

Last edited by karneli lll on 12/6/2008 5:08:12 AM

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dillonthebunny
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:11:28 AM
Reply

Ive slept with all my Ex's (not while in another relationship) and I can tell you its just not worth it.

You dont need to lower yourself Ben, take the higher ground and maybe be her friend.. but with everything in your sights dont give up anything you want back, and im not talking about material goods here.

you'll do the right thing, and if you dont then you will learn from it.. its a win win situation.

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Ed_Wayne
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:32:46 AM
Reply

Only bang her if you have a camera to record it with. Then you can mail a tape to the jackass. THAT would be hilarious. Oh and who cares about the girls feelings? Hurt them both.

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HUSO
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:52:01 AM
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Ben, i believe its time u forgive and forget. from wat i read, the Jackass dude is the one to blame and clearly u and this lady friend have quite a unique connection, one that u might not see everyday. the 2 of u could work this out. Don't u think that'd hurt the jackass dude more ?? the fact that him butting in couldn't do much to keep u guys apart for long. i believe that would be more of a slap for him, and u'd have a bigger fight on ur hands when he experiences it. would even make the entire event more interesing ;)

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tramp
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:04:00 AM
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i wouldnt,this could very easily biuld a bad rep for you and hurt any chance of the "One" getting to you.
i'd bring her down the long garden path,and refuse to sleep with her until she breaks up with that twat(make sure he knows it's you).then just say "No" .this way you are getting fair justice for breaking them up,like that twat did you.

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aaronisbla
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:16:16 AM
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Like it was said, i think the damage to this man is already done with her staying over there. you know how we men get so jealous, him finding out she stayed there overnight would be enough.

It can't all be her fault, there was maybe a misunderstanding plus i think that guy is to blame, dont take it all out on her., i really think you 2 should work it out, seriously.

oh yea, make sure she NEVER sees this crap alright? especially if things work out for you 2, erase this and all replies to it haha

Last edited by aaronisbla on 12/6/2008 6:16:38 AM

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LightShow
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:38:47 AM
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If he's a pretentious Jackass, you think he's gonna get all broken up if his Girl sleeps with her ex? All it's gonna do for him is solidify his opinion gamers are just big kids, which will be evidenced by they way you go about revenge.

The ultimate revenge would be for her to leave him for you, but you just explicitly stated you have no notion of entertaining that possibility. What I would do is take the sensitive road, explain that you really WANT to start up something again, but that your afraid her opinion of you and your profession has been twisted by Mr Pretentious Jackass.

She'll either confirm or deny, and you can play it by ear from there. Girls are fickle creatures. They often make several wrong decisions before settling on a right one.

contrary to us guys, who just go for it and hope for the best.

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Jackyl
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 7:15:24 AM

Gotta say, being cheated on has got to be a blow to anybody's ego. Especially if they consider the person they are cheated on with so much lower than them.

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LightShow
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 8:27:06 AM

depends on how much of a jackass he is, but I see your point =D

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Jackyl
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 7:04:40 AM
Reply

Hey Ben,

First time poster, long time reader. Tried last week to sign-up but some website errors delayed my confirmation email. Blah, blah, blah.

Anywho...

This is truly a convoluted predicament you are in, and there certainly isn't any easy answer.

First there is the obvious "high road" you could take. While it might not sound appealing now to seek revenge, this isn't something that you would likely look back on and kick yourself for not going through with it. Certainly is more likely that you might regret it later if you do go through with it. It could have possible consequences in future relationships should it ever come up.

Now, it isn't like I've never sought revenge myself. I've pulled the old ball sweat on the moron boss' coffee cup. In that case (and a few others) it has never been anything I've regretted and makes for a fun anecdote. Sometimes revenge is just a lesson for well-deserving idiots.

Now that brings me to another point. Is she deserving of this? Possibly. You seem to speak pretty highly of her. Yet, how weak minded must she be to buy the bull her coworkers had been spewing? Either she isn't as intelligent and strong as you think or despite what she has ever said to you she has always actually agreed with her coworkers and friends about you and your work. If such is the case, either way makes consideration of her feelings seem less necessary.

Now I am curious about should you go through with it how would the other guy find out? You going to personally rub it in his face or expect her to tell him at some point? Either way if you do it, from the reactions of the nameless hordes, you'd quite likely piss many of them off.

As it is, who cares about the opinions of strangers. The yay-ers or neigh-ers. It's really all about you, the factors involved, and the immediate to long term consequences, positive or negative.

And thus concludes my first post.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:17:08 AM

I'm glad you've finally decided to join us, and we always appreciate long-time readers. :)

All good questions, all of which went through my head last night. The question really DOES revolve around whether or not I pronounce her guilty, and thereby deserving of any pain I may inflict. Then there's the issue of this jackass. As Joe said above, it really is quite adolescent and even trite to get back at a jerk by sleeping with his girl. But I think we all know it's more complicated than that, especially in regards to the girl in this scenario.

What you mentioned is the crux of the confusion concerning her, though: I never thought she'd be weak-minded enough to bend to a colleague, or even a friend. So now I'm wondering if she ACTUALLY bent...or if she's permanently bent. That type of thing. I need to know.

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Mole
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 8:34:35 AM
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Just read this and your prior inner thoughts...you are 6'3" and 230...dude ever thought of putting the wheaties DOWN??? Andre the giant mean anything???

Nah just playing honestly as long as YOU are happy, that is all that matters...still though I really thought you were a skinny twig with bottles for glasses. LMAOo. We all have our path to take, my father and brother took the business road, I'm an engineer, sucks donkey balls now because of the RECESSION but I wanted to design houses and engineering was the path suggested.

Don't worry about people's pithy thoughts, always do you, if you can look in the mirror and know you have enjoyed your work then it's all good. Besides like you said you had her before him, he might be a rebound dude. Be happy.

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 8:38:49 AM
Reply

Find out what she thinks she really wants and let her know up front that you don't think it would work out between you in the long run. It sounds like you have a lot of electricity together were you might make this into a regular booty call. Jackass is lacking...you need to fill that void for her. Women are no different then men when it comes to sex.

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bearbobby
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 10:25:31 AM
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I say leave it be. Probably not worth the time and emotional effort to rekindle a relationship that has been tarnished. If a primary passion of yours (gaming) is considered immature or beneath her, then the fundamentals of the relationship probably aren't strong enough to survive even if you did get back with her.

As for the hurt she and the nerf-herder caused you, revenge isn't the answer. Instead try and find your Zen. Remember man, "the Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners."

Fu** it, Dude, let's go bowling.


Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/6/2008 11:17:57 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:17:46 AM

LOL

Now THAT'S funny. :) As much as I don't really want to be compared to the Dude, I have to admit, that philosophy is now MINE: "The Dude abides." ;)

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/6/2008 11:18:19 AM

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:04:32 AM
Reply

You see Ben? Take solace in the fact that God still doesn't like ugly. Jackass has already lost. You don't even have to say anything to him, you know the real score. And, to be honest its better that way. I had a similar situation with my fiancee. She was paralegal for a law firm I refer patients with and we hit it off at a Yankee game. We have been joined at the hip for the past 5 years, but I came to learn that the lawyer she worked with was her ex-boyfriend and he was just as much a butt hole as this guy. She left that job to work with me and he is on the record as saying that he couldn't compete with me because he saw how great I treated her.

Now getting back to your current predicament, Are you sure you are through with this girl? She may just want a booty call but there might still be something there.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:20:04 AM
Reply

Thanks to all for the thoughtful comments. I knew I could count on you! Anyway, I haven't really decided what to do just yet.

As for last night, I slept where I was and she slept where she was. She went home a few hours ago after we talked a bit more. I won't really get into details but the saga continues...she dropped this "friends" thing on me and wants to "hang out" tomorrow.

...lies. But...we'll see.

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:45:48 AM

friends huh....yeah ok.

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m2tbo
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 12:28:28 PM

Screw the friends thing. You should let her know exactly what you want. A random encounter with an ex is turning into an ongoing drama. If you want to bang her without a relationship, maybe she is open to it, then you both can have some fun while getting back at mr. pretentious. Other than that I would cut off communication until the next random encounter.

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NealRad
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:26:12 AM
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maybe ben is talking it out with her right now at his place as we post..... or maybe he just bangin her. Hmmmmm...

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NealRad
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:27:40 AM
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nevermind

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The_R0gue_Ninja
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:46:24 AM
Reply

You know, a lot of people on here have said things like: "Revenge is sweet", "Mercy is for the weak", and so on and so forth. Conversely, some others have said: "Don't do it", "Be strong", ect. I do not side with either of those parties. Ben, I believe the decision is yours to make. I can only give my opinion of what I would do in your situation.
Referring to your first article dealing with Mr. Pretentious Jackass. When you saw the Girl in question at the mall with Mr. P, and he made that underhanded, insidious comment towards you, I admired the fact that you wanted to rip his vocal chords, yet simply walked away. You see, I believe he made that comment, because he wanted you to hit him. He wanted to prove that you ARE a "boy playing with toys", by provoking you to violence against him. However, you completely wiped the floor with his proverbial ass. Not saying, or doing anything back to him made you, and makes stronger than him. In his convoluted mind, he probably did realize this, but disregarded it for his pompous, "I'm better than everyone", ego.
In regards to the situation in this article, I believe the same actions should, or in this case, shouldn't be taken. Yes, revenge against Mr. Pretentious Jackass would be nice, but you'd just be proving his point. That you are a "boy with his toys", who has a chip on his shoulder because he made a low-blow comment toward you. Personally, and this may sound a little cliché, but I think that treating her with grace is the best solution, and the one action that requires the MOST strength on your part. It would be easy to enact revenge, but it requires true character to withhold your wrath. Besides, her fate shouldn't be decided on the actions of her bastard-boyfriend. She is a woman after all, and easily prone to the voice of an alluring Lawyer (who makes a living off of morphing people's minds to their will).
As I have said before, Ben. The decision is yours to make. I only propose that you think loooong and hard about what you will do.

Good luck, dude.

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The_R0gue_Ninja
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:47:48 AM
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.........Wow, I didn't mean for my post to be THAT long, lol.

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Phoelix
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:48:03 AM
Reply

What Mr. Pretentious Jackass did was childish.

And, in my opinion, so is your plan for revenge.

If you follow through with it, I believe that you'll consummate the idea Mr. PJ has about video games being childish. He'll just believe all the more fervently that anything related to video games is an inferior activity.

Is that the message you really want to send?

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:16:09 PM
Reply

This whole story really was never about Mr Pretentious JackAss, it was really about Ben and this woman. Jackass is just a minor supporting character to the reason Ben decided to call it off with her. If the guy was cool it would at least make it a harder decision to get back with her but being that he is a butt hole it just means he has no bearing on it.

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HighLife
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 12:32:15 PM
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Ben you need to ask yourself if this would really make you feel better in the long run or the short term. You can look at is he has your "leftovers" anyway, you have been there done that.

Good Luck making your mind up.

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Saber1989
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 1:39:00 PM
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I say punish her in bed, give her a little spanking lol
awesome, not really a gaming issue but about a true gamer, interesting nonetheless

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cheng
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:15:54 PM
Reply

on ur 1st post "it was my ex, who was looking all radiant in a bright red sweater, tight-fitting jeans, and long black hair held back in a loose ponytail. The cold had reddened her cheeks and two thoughts hurtled toward each other in my head, on a deadly collision course. Thought 1- "Damn, she looks great." Thought 2- "Damn, when she turns to walk away, I'm going to trip her." The result? The two thoughts collided and I was left smiling and shaking her hand like an accommodating idiot."--Ben, u still care about her in some way, n u wouldn't put up this post n the one b4 if u have truly 4got about her because ur THINKING about her.Next u said "I was left smiling and shaking her hand like an accommodating idiot"--maybe its just me but it shows even more that u do care about her, u still care about how she sees u, otherwise u woulnt mind looking like an idiot, i mean of course u would mind if ur looking like an idiot in front of anyone BUT ur not gonna remember it for long at all(probably 2 mins for most) if u look like an idiot if front of ur...grandma?right? its been some times now n u still remember that, u know wat i mean man... On the girl's side, yes her mind maybe poisoned beyond repair but she is only a woman made up of flesh n blood like everybody else and as "The_R0gue_Ninja" said:"She is a woman after all, and easily prone to the voice of an alluring Lawyer", and woman is also a human which is allowed to make mistakes, please DON'T let ur hatred blind u, if u truly do it, not only ur gonna make urself suffer(YES believe me u will) but u will also make her suffer(by destroying her mind, by crushing her hopes of getting back together wit u),so instead of making mr PJ suffers,ur making urself,mr PJ and that girl that u still care, suffers n i really believe u dont wanna do that. everyone makes mistakes, n EVERYONE deserves a chance,if u truly want mr PJ to suffers, simply prove hes wrong, prove ur NOT a 30 years old with a mind of a 12 years old who play games all day long(which i believe u have done just that), she will see it believe me... i think shes THOSE type of girl who chooses REAL careful when it comes to boyfren as she sees him as a potential husband, n USUALLY these girl go for doctors,lawyers,pilots, business man etc(i think its a trend which blinded loads of girls), so if i'm the girl, i MIGHT actually pick the lawyer because i feel that if i form a family with him, he can provide shelters,foods etc to me n my kids,thus make me feel secure...BUT if my memory serves me right, SHE CAME UP TO U, n now shes calling back, hoping to ease up ur feeling, n let u know wat shes thinking, its obviouswat she wants man... its so PAINFUL to watch a potential(a high one) couple breaks up JUST because of some insecure-whos-shame of-man's unworthy words, n if u truly sleep with her just to get back at mr PJ, i'm sorry to say this but wat's the difference between u n mr PJ,UR NO BETTER THAN MR PJ, why? because at least MR PJ go for the one he loves, with an extremely dishonourable/despicable way, n he dissed u because hes FEAR of losing her, so he needs to do something to make sure he looks better than u but we know well that hes no match for ya,size or mentally,the question is: wat did u do? did u even try to assure her? make her feels secure?show her whos the beter man?(we all know ur the better 1 of course but its useless if she doesnt c it god damn it!!!)woman needs something to make them feel secure n its up to us man's actions to show them wat we're capable of(like protecting them n able to stand up for ourselves etc etc etc). A chinese expression for ya: Settle Men's problem BETWEEN MEN ONLY, do not unleash ur wrath to the other's family(wife/woman and his kids if he has one), especially if u still CARE about her...in the end of the day, i'm with the_rogue_ninja, treat her with grace n let mr PJ's karma befall onto him...
dont know if u'll ever c this post Ben but PLEASE, dont hurt her/urself, act like a true man n leave the girl outta ur problem wit mr PJ, n i'm sure U WILL BE THE WINNER IN THE END!!

ok i'm going to watch resident evil:degeneration now, take care Ben.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:16:59 PM

Well, that's one big wall of text (may I suggest breaking it up into paragraphs next time?), but it is helpful. I realize I'd be lowering myself to get back at some guy I don't really even know, but it really is more a matter of her, right now. I do agree with the Chinese saying, though.

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SHADOW [Moderator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:53:37 PM

My god sir. Let me introduce you to my good friend the enter key. He is know as Return by some. He is extremely helpful in the area of word processing and in some cases online conversating. When you are typing something long readers (and authors) often find it helpful for the large amount of text to be split into sections called paragraphs. Paragraphs split the authors thoughts into categories. It helps with orginazation and helps prevent the user from getting lost in the lines of text.

I hope this helps you in you and your keyboard's future adventures.

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coldbore
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:18:34 PM
Reply

may i recommend a good hitman for "Mr. Pretentious Jackass" XD or you could always do a burnout for like half an hour in fornt of his house at 2 a.m with your 350z XD

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ArnoldK PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:39:37 PM
Reply

My suggestion to Ben last night was: hit it, and then drop the "I just don't know what I want" line on her. But I guess I'm just an assh*le like that.

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Scarecrow
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:36:19 PM

Arnold is my kind of person hehe
I mean seriously, girls don't think twice 'bout rejecting a guy or messing with his feelings.

Why should we feel all sympathy for them all of a sudden.

Specially they're not together anymore.

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:04:49 PM

Lol. I highly doubt she'd get it , though, and the point would be lost on her. Women are too self-centered that way. She just think you'd be playing hard-to-get.

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Aftab
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:45:03 PM
Reply

I'd take the "friends" opportunity as a proving ground any day over an embarrassing bout of inebratiated passion. But utimately, a relationship worth having allows people to start anew. Fresh, without any creeping thoughts, and hidden agendas lurking dormant in the back of one's mind, as long as lessons are learned and old habits don't bring back the past. Then the mind is clear so that you can tackle your other concerns in life, and give your all to each other without hesitation.

As shocking it is to see the girl turn up at that hour of the night, I've seen that scenario play out quite a few times. The fact is the girl is confused, which is natural. She even got you swaying! Do I care for her? Does she need me? Can I redeem her? Can I redeem myself? Is this possible, is this feasible? Or Is this the perfect moment of revenge? Is this my lot in life? Or should expect more from life? She's wasting her time. Don't let her waste yours to. I'm not saying not to give the time or the day, but be the gentleman that you are, show the care with reserve, don't absorb any negative karma, and then go after what you really need. Something's always better out there, and going back to this can only be out of desperation. If I'm not mistaken dude, you're over 30, and don't have time to participate in their teen antics. Your a decent man, a selective guy, which allows you to enjoy your memories, your life nobly and without regrets. Those people get by in life by forgetting the past, and each other.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:09:54 PM

Good post, but you hit the nail right on the head: "...and then go after what you really need." Ah, but what IS that? It's something I need to figure out, I'm sure.

The one thing I hate more than the "I don't know what I want" from a woman is my own indecision based on the same matter...I just don't use it as a smokescreen. As for negative karma, I'm afraid I've got too much of that dealing with this situation already. I need an exorcism...and a shower. ;)

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:07:29 AM

What one needs, granted is a lot of things in one package... but at no point should any one of those take precedence over "peace of mind". Nothing's worth trading in for that. The moment one feels that being encroached upon, that is the cue to GTFO, gracefully, ofcourse. This is why certain delectable beverages and activities that involve a particular kind of Tom-foolery can be quite counter-productive, because they momentarily suspend you of those "reigns" which one needs for self-guidance in those situations. "Loosening-up" is finding peace of mind, not escaping from it.

Ofcourse, the confusion happens when one doesn't have peace of mind to begin with...and that involves a few things which primarily begin with responsiblites (family, financial, social, physical, and yes, spiritual). Some of those are under your control, while others are not (and ironically are a Catch-22 that involve that significant other). So the trick is to master what is in your control, first. Find certainty, harmony in those, and adequate balance. Get your groove on, get in the zone, achieve your zen, etc. Especially essential to this is SLEEP, Mr. Dutka, and non-work related down-time.

Regarding one's work, goals, aspirations, and other things that determine your culture and life-style, these things, of course, come into consideration about compatablity to A CERTAIN EXTENT. As long as you are paying your bills honestly, don't worry about visualising the hypothetical dinner party with housewifes bragging over wine glasses, unless you wish to get someone particularly from that crowd. A good woman will stick by you through anything and anytime, especially if you're a good man.

Regarding "negative karma"...dude, years of that curse can be removed by a few moments involving correction of one's intention, and a couple acts of heart-felt, SELFLESS, kindness (any of these involving the woman of interest is highly discouraged and DOES NOT COUNT). Get to it and don't sweat it. Be one with your universe, and the rest will be astonishingly, self-automated. Peace out.






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somethingrandom
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:47:52 PM
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I don't comment on rumor and speculation. Sorry about the random-ness of that statement. I just thought it'd be funny.

(off-topic) BTW, I saw the first live showing of All Nightmare Long at the Metallica concert last night!!!

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Jed
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:52:59 AM

you lucky bastard

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JPBooch
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 2:47:58 PM
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I had another thought on this subject that may be useful for you also Ben. You are an artist, your way of thinking, preferences, and decisions are very much different than that of a person who deals with law. She probably finds you fascinating in that regard. Also, women have a tendency to like the "badboy". You don't play by normal societal rules, you love what you do and you do what you love. There aren't many people in this world who can honestly say that. I would lump you in that badboy category for those above facts.

As far as Mr PJ, deep down you probably intimidate him and he's obviously jealous of a guy who is doing what he loves. I wouldn't so much as hate him but feel sorry for him.

Last edited by JPBooch on 12/6/2008 2:48:25 PM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:12:28 PM

It's possible. She may have had a certain attraction to me because I'm a stark contrast to what she may be used to. She very much liked to put the title of "writer" next to my name, and tell people about it.

As for PJ, I really don't think he's intimidated by any of that, unfortunately. He WILL be intimidated by me if strange sh** happens, though.

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Bugzbunny109
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:56:53 AM

Lol @ JPbooch- I was thinking the same exact thing.

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BikerSaint
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:08:05 PM
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Arnold, I resemble that remark too, so "1 thumbs up" for you!

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Joe_III
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:43:55 PM
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Yeah, I am married, but it's not so much that as much as I'm more of an old-fashioned Southern man. Most of my ethics and values come from my grandparents who've lived in Louisiana since the 40's...That and and my Persian grandparents.

And in any way, society would be a lot better if men were held to a higher standard they are now. While Chivalry's rules no longer apply for the most part, the general lack of respect for others that went with it is my fundamental issue with this problem.

And no, I'm not saying give the woman a pass. If you want to get your revenge on her, that's fine, go for it. I can't say I've never hurt a woman (emotionally) intentionally due to my own pettiness at the time. We've all done that at some point.

But unless I misread your post, you weren't doing this so much for revenge against your ex as much as trying to prove something to her current boyfriend. I'm just saying that that is something that is better done without causing the huge amount of collateral damage to her.

Last edited by Joe_III on 12/6/2008 3:44:38 PM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:04:52 PM

Perhaps. I agree that it's just a matter of perspective, and I really don't want to hurt anyone or prove anything to anybody...but I feel an emotional attachment to both people involved in a certain way, and I'm just trying to reconcile those feelings.

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Joe_III
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:29:10 PM

I can undertand being bitter/frustrated/upset at the whole situation, and it is your choice to do what you will. I understand you want people to see you worthy, but I highly doubt that there is much you can do to make this particular guy know you're better than him. Hell, he'd probably call Jesus out for playing with Lincoln Logs rather than doing real work.

I would just say that in my own personal experience while doing these kinds of things felt good at the time, I look at them now with regret.

From most of your other posts and conversations, you seem to be fairly well content with who you are and what you have.

If that is really true, then why do you feel a need to prove your worthiness to these people?

And if it isn't, then wouldn't your efforts be better spent improving the things about yourself you feel need work?

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:27:09 PM

Well, like I've said before, I really think it's less about "proving myself" and more about revenge. I really don't care what he thinks about me, but I have to admit, I want him to know what it feels like to suffer (at least a little). Silver spoon in the mouth, Yale law, Benz, Armani, blah blah blah.

It just...IRKS me.

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tlpn99
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 3:54:21 PM
Reply

So Ben when's the wedding lol ? Only kidding dude, seriously do what you feel you should do.

If you hit the guy and end up with the girl then so be it. (although girls don't tend to like this)

If you simply just end up back with the girl then so be it.

Just know this we will always be here for you no matter what you do.

Take care man, life's a real bugger sometimes.

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BikerSaint
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:02:24 PM
Reply

HeyJoe3,
I guess your comment concerning assholes was directed at me too, making me one of those assholes you were so "soapy at the mouth" about.

Well guess what, you are f*cking "correcto mondo"..... I "AM" an asshole, & f*cking proud of it!!!!!

At least I show my true colors, unlike some little computer commando puke with a "2 raisin sack", using his fingers to piss all over the keyboard!

I imagine from some of your earlier tech comments, that you seem to be savy enough to also get my address in New Jersey from my IP, so if you're feeling froggy, and like they say in the "motel 6" commercials....."come on over, & I'll leave the lights on for ya"!

So either come see me Mr big mouth, or if not, then please, please, continue to go outside & impress all the lil jailbaits, by how well you've been writing your name in the snow.

In other words, "Go ahead now, run along outside and........piss off!

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The_Chimeran
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:17:19 PM
Reply

Okay I just have to say that I'm starting to like how easy it is to personally connect with you guys about this stuff. especially seeing Arnold as a person rather than a writer. But as for your dilemma Ben, I'd say no. Simply cause I've learned that what you do once always comes back around. So "messing" with her now would probably make Mr.Pretentious Jackass (Mr.PJ) jealous but now you gotta deal with this girl. And sounds like your quick to shove her aside, which will do much more harm. And harm that really can't be foretold until it happens. And I really believe all of this is for the girl rather than Mr.PJ. So basically, do it if you got a point to prove to this girl. And don't do it if your trying to detach from her.
Also Ben it seems like all of this is getting out of hand with the posters so maybe a little bit more moderation or well idk.

Last edited by The_Chimeran on 12/6/2008 4:18:33 PM

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Joe_III
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:56:12 PM

QFT.

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cheng
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 4:43:14 PM
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@ ben- i rarely put up any post longer than 5 lines so pls excuse me for my bad english n bad writing skills...hope i dont sound harsh(but truthful words are usually harsh)...

i know it!! somebody loves FF tactics can't be a bad man lol...but seriously, i'm very glad to know ur not about to do something stupid that can cause a life-time regret for you, all the best for you, the girl and arnold.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:28:04 PM

It's true! All FFT lovers are good people. :)

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Shatterday
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:17:51 PM
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Relationships are absolutely tricky... I played the tug of war game with a girl not too long ago and actually ended up with a disorderly conduct to show for it.

Ben, I don't know you. I most likely never will. While I want to sit here and tell you to f*ck the sh** out of that girl... I'm not going to. You will regret it. Despite the fact that you say you don't care care about her at all, you will regret it.

You were in a relationship and although you can lose feelings for people they're always going to have a tiny tiny bit of your heart. Every encounter with someone changes you, even in the smallest ways.

If you'd like a story to back it up.. I dated a girl and I broke up with her. We were going to try again when she met this new guy and so I backed off because I knew it was a long shot. Well she came back to me a month later, and ended up going back to him. He got her pregnant. A few months later she calls me, she had left him "can you come over" almost banged blah blah blah, he comes over, we get in a fight "my childs in there" blah blah blah, the cops came and make him leave. I left because i figured if I banged a pregnant chick I would probably BE Satan. $104 fine and a disorderly conduct. Me and the girl don't talk anymore, when she was probably one of my best friends. It sucks.

Don't be Satan Ben.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:13:20 PM

Satan, I do not want to be. ;)

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Deleted User [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 5:45:55 PM
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Ben its obvious you are a square. This HO doesnt want you she is just using you. If you cant see that you will forever be walked on and taken advantage of.

She does not want you. If she says she just wants to be friends, trust me, thats all she wants to be. I know it hurts and you think she's lying because you really hope she wants you back, but the quicker you face the truth the better off you'll be.

Edit: Oh and get off this high school sh*t man. How old are you? You 30+ you too old for this teenage "she wants me back and I dont know what to do" sh*t. I've never seen a grown man with relationship problems similar to a high schoolers and then post it over the internet. Time to grow up buddy.

Last edited by n/a on 12/6/2008 5:50:22 PM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:12:48 PM

...aren't you the trolling xbot who I've already warned?

Thanks, but as humble as I almost always am, after reading that mess, I'm fairly confident I know more about interpersonal human relationships than you could ever hope to know. I'll pass on your advice.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 6:24:27 PM

LOL Don't worry; she's no gamer, and neither is he.

Forgiving myself is something I've had to do in the past...I'd rather not struggle to do it again.

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coolistic
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 7:13:16 PM
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Ben...why haven't you written a book?!:)

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Sir Shak
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 7:57:54 PM
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take arnold's advice FTW !

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Siege
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 8:18:57 PM
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Wow, so many comments and so many conflicting ethical systems being spouted off.

Ben, this isn't an easy situation, and I definitely do not envy you (At least, not when I think about your predicament. When I think about you making a living through one of the most amazing jobs ever...then I envy you, lol) Anyways, there has been some good advice posted and there has been some really bad advice posted. First off, revenge is not the answer. Revenge is something that is completely propelled by one's own subjective observations. Its basic principle is "I've been hurt, so I'm going to 'hurt' back." There is no true conception of justice, morality, or ethics. Revenge is totally based on hedonistic philosophy (I graduate in May with a degree in Philosophy, so I know a little something about this), it only serves to give one a temporary feeling of happiness. This has nothing to do with justice, it is about accomplishing one's own ends without regard to a higher moral standard. What if revenge became the moral standard of humanity, that is, what if everyone practiced it regularly? Society would cease exist. Revenge would constantly beget more revenge and, ultimately, humanity would die from within itself. (If one appeals to Kant's categorical imperative, then this means that revenge is necessarily immoral)

Ben, I in no way am attacking you, and I hope that it is not coming across that I am. I think you're a really great guy, and I appreciate that you are trying to make the right decision and not just acting out of impulse. Also, I don't mean to vomit philosophy everywhere, but, ultimately, this boils down to philosophy. Just read all of the comments on this page. A plethora of contrasting philosophical systems are being used (most of the time unknowingly) to reach conclusions. Now, sure, I could go on about some of the systems (That is, commenting on systems like Hedonism, relativism born out of post-modernity, and the Nietzschean "will-to-power"....all of which are used...a lot) and discuss the problems with each one but there isn't time for that and this isn't the place to do it, regardless.

In the end, Ben, I'd like to go back to something you said above in the editorial. You mentioned a biblicalesque revenge. I hope to not be flamed for this, but you never know. What I would say is don't appeal to something in the Bible is condemned and looked down upon. Regardless of one's faith and belief system that he appeals to, the Bible does contain some amazing humanistic ethics. In this case, I would say if you're going to appeal to something in the Bible, go with Jesus and his "love your neighbor as yourself" and "do to others what you would have them do to you." Dammit, I don't mean to sound preachy or anything like that. This is, however, the more rational route.

All I am trying to say is that, in the end, revenge accomplishes nothing. It is ultimately counter-productive. There are higher roads that you can take that would be far more beneficial. I am not saying that you should just let it all go or should lie down and allow yourself to get trampled upon. You're a smart, rational, logical guy. You can still be shown to be the better and stronger man without placing morality on hold. Sure, the pretentious jackass might not ever see it, and he might never know the feeling of suffering, but is it your purpose to make sure he does?

Anyways, sorry for such a long post, it just seemed to me that it needed to be said. I hope that this is of some help to you, Ben.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:24:00 PM

I don't see how I could misinterpret that post as an attack; I didn't even think Joe III's post was an insult or attack. People expressing vehement and/or thoughtful opinions are too often misconstrued as "hostile" on the Internet, and I attribute that to a pathetic level of sensibility on the part of insecure teens. Sorry...mini-rant; nothing to do with you, really. ;)

Anyway, I only had one college class in Philosophy (I went the other way and got a Psychology degree), but I got an "A" in it. Heh, not that that means much. But I do remember some of the basics, including Aristotle's theory of virtue vs. vice. If I remember it correctly, he said that the two extremes of a condition were the vices while the exact middle was the virtue. In other words, rashness and cowardice are the vices and courage is the virtue. In other words, he was basically saying what psychologists have always said, in that moderation is essential in almost all walks of life.

This is why I haven't made a decision yet, and why I'm trying to see this problem from all different angles. Jumping in too quickly would be rash, shying away from it and ignoring them both would be cowardly, and the only courage involved is to sit back, examine, and then determine. Which, again, is what psychologists typically recommend. Now, I agree that revenge accomplishes nothing, and is a mere band-aid and never a cure-all. Heck, the band-aid even has bacteria on it that can infect the wound and cause everything to get worse. I understand that, BUT...

Philosophy or psychology, I'm adopting a new theory that I'm sure philosophers have considered. Due to the combination of the extraordinarily fickle and impressionable human mind and the drastically changing environment throughout history, I believe morals are conditional. I know the purists will always adopt the maxim that there's an underlying sense of morality in all humans, and no matter what the reality, whether it's the 3rd or 33rd century, it never changes. This, I used to believe...when I was in college. ;)

But then, I remembered something else Aristotle put forth, and I believe it was the "a priori" truth. It's the purest of all truths; it remains true at all times, and in all universes. "The sun will rise tomorrow" is NOT an a priori truth (at some point in time, that statement may actually be false), but "2 + 2 = 4" IS an a priori truth. This being the case, I believe that THESE are the only virtues left. And while virtue may never change, morality can and does. Hence, my dilemma regarding this situation... There is no real truth and because I believe morality to be subjective, I'm struggling with the correct course of action.

This may not make any sense, but I'm tired and I typed this really fast. Anyway. :)

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/6/2008 11:25:22 PM

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Siege
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:52:14 AM

"There is no real truth" is a truth claim in and of itself...lol. No worries, you're tired. ;)

I hear what you are saying, Ben. And while, yes, relativism has been considered by philosophers recently, it does sadden me that you hold to that view. Nothing against you, I'm not saying you are a bad person or anything, really =) I just see that system running into and causing so many problems and ultimately being very inconsistent.

I do have to ask, though. If we take morality as being subjective, then how can you consider the idea of revenge? The idea of revenge automatically assumes that you've been wronged, that there is some higher moral standard to which a human ought appeal. If morality is subjective, though, then the pretentious jackass has been doing what is "right" by him and cannot be faulted. For you to take offense is to say that what he has done is wrong, that there is some intrinsic immoral value in his actions. An undertone of revenge is that you are "righting the wrong." You say that morality is subjective, but your considerations show that you do appeal to some sense of right and wrong, should and should not.

Sorry, had to throw that out there. I think it is a viable question and would be interested to hear your response.

P.S. I remember a couple months back you mentioning Aristotle's ethics in an article. It really made me happy, haha. Am I sick or what?

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:58:57 AM

Of course it's a viable question. I can consider revenge BECAUSE morality is subjective; this also translates to the fact that revenge is also subjective. What he believes is irrelevant. What he thinks is right has no bearing on my thought process, and my reality dictates that I'm not going to care about his view.

The idea of revenge only assumes I've been wronged if the accepted standards of morality come into play. If I don't buy into that, can't I apply my own definition to revenge...? And just because morality is subjective doesn't mean there isn't any right and wrong left; it simply means we can interpret the right and wrongs in a variety of ways. His interpretation has no effect on my interpretation. I know this sounds like a very isolationist viewpoint; very lonely and not exactly loaded with a lot of love or faith in my fellow man, but...

Well, like I said, I believed as you did when I was in college. I probably would've written something very similar to what you have written. But then I graduated...and lived life for over 8 years. I never wanted to believe it then but I have to accept it now: things change in how we think. ;)

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 1:35:22 AM

"There is no real truth". If that is TRUE, as I said before, we got ourselves a bit of a contradiction. And while all experience is primarily subjective, which is why study cannot substitute experience, I highly doubt, Ben, you'd be of the type to believe that a tree cannot fall if there was no one there to hear it. And while some morals are conditional, I'm sure there are many things that you would never do in 1000 years. And, philosophy has it's place, but I wouldn't go to a philosopher to fix my car, unless he was a good mechanic, too...


Oops sorry, guys. Didn't mean to interrupt.

Last edited by Aftab on 12/7/2008 1:36:48 AM

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Siege
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 1:50:35 AM

Not to beat the dead horse or anything. But, what then, is your definition of revenge? I do not see how it does not necessarily coincide with morality.

I, too, have little faith in humanity. I see humanity as being holistically depraved. But, just because humanity, on the whole, does not exhibit morality, it does not necessarily mean that there is not higher moral standard.

Also, with regard to Aristotle's virtue ethics, since you seem to appeal to them on one level or another. On the one side, you have cowardice. On the other side, you have aggressive action (revenge). In the middle, you have standing up firmly for yourself, no aggression and no cowardice.

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 1:54:36 AM

Siege, while I agree in certain truths being absolute, I'm sure you cannot accept that life is entirely either subjective or objective... Why, in any modern judicical system is there a necessity for both a judge and witness, while the judge cannot be the witness?

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Siege
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 1:57:04 AM

After reading the last line of Aftab's (EDIT: 1st) comment, Ben, I realized that our conversation has been a little bit of a rabbit trail. While I do believe that practically everything can be brought back around to or reduced to philosophy (and that it has a much more prominent place than our current culture wants to give it), I would understand if our conversation needs to be put on a bit of a halt if it is going to far sideways from the topic at hand.

Last edited by Siege on 12/7/2008 2:02:49 AM

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Siege
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:01:54 AM

Aftab, could you flesh out your question a little bit more? I do not want to give an answer and then find out that I misunderstood you. =)

Last edited by Siege on 12/7/2008 2:02:12 AM

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:14:49 PM

Sorry, Siege. It was more of a rhetorical question. But, i hear your point. Is revenge absolutely necessary? No. It is a big reason why judicial systems exist, to save society from the perpetual cycle of chaotic self-meeted, reactionary, punishment. But on the other hand, there are more times often than not in ones daily life where things involving personal injury cannot be brought to a court or to a higher authority other than oneself. Does one ignore those? And while personal things related expecially to the ego can be virtuously ignored, is there something to be said of principles, or is it that all principles are no more than a thinly-veiled, subjective, egotisical constructions. I think that is where the question lies.

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CH1N00K
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 8:50:09 PM
Reply

Well, I didn't think I was going to see a part two to this. And it seems to be working by the amount of responses.

As for your situation Ben, I'd say walk away. Let sleeping dogs lie. If you sleep with her, what good does it do you? If it ruins her relationship with Mr. Small penis then so what? You won't be seeing him everyday to rub it in his face..so what difference does it make? If you screw her over, just to screw him over, how does that make you any better than him?

But that's just what I'd do, I would find a better way to waste my time...lol

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gungrave
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:33:37 PM
Reply

I registered just to leave a post for this topic. Look, you could simply tell this girl to f*** off and get her out of your life. Forget that prick.

If I were you, I would get even. Now you better not lie to yourself when you say you could care less about this woman. If you still have feelings for her you would be messing yourself up big time....there's nothing worse than living life with regret. With that out of the way, so you don't care about this woman. I would totaly be sleeping with her, in fact I would even go do things to her that I normaly would not have done (the butt). She left and now wants to come back to you, I say just use her. That moron disrespected you but who gives a flying F*** about that guy, your bond was with her and she threw it away. Use her bro, get some, treat her like whatever.

Go out with your friends, party, meet other girls, enjoy your life. You can tell her of your outings but why would you? She has no right to question you, she deserves to be treated that way (be like, "woman, know your roll" =P). If she doesn't like that you don't spend time with her like before or whatever, just be like "you don't like it? there's the door". If she wants to stick around let her, who knows....it may turn into something great, if it doesn't so what. Use her for the goods until you find somebody that's worthy of your love.

keep me posted bro. By the way great site

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JPBooch
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 1:39:56 PM

And that is why women don't trust men. Unfortunately, your attitude, Mr gungrave,is exactly the same as most guys out there. It's a rare breed when you find a guy who actually cares. Women know that and usually wrap them up....which is why they complain that the good ones are already taken.
At any rate, your candor is much appreciated and welcome to the site.

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Daedusian
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:35:45 PM
Reply

I never really got the chance to post for the first article (yet even read it until yesterday) because final exams are upon me this week and I have been studying my arse off for the longest time lol. So I'll make this short so I can get back to it...

I really believe you should just stay away from the whole thing. Like a few have said, the situation that happened to you will most surely come back to bite them square in the a**. Believe me.

Take my sister for example (lol I can't believe I'm sharing this) ... she is probably the smartest person in my entire family, including relatives on my mother's side, father's side, and even step-father's side. Right now she's 24, soon to graduate with a masters and become a Physicians Assistant.

BUT what she lacks is any common sense, or knowledge of the outside world - basically anything other than intelligence. But, anyways, to put it in the nicest of words, she's a bitch. We have tried everything (and oh do I mean everything) to change that in her, but nonetheless, it fails everytime, so we have given up. (It's been this way since she was 10). Even her new boyfriend is beginning to figure this out, so I'm not joking here...

So getting back to my initial point, because of her attitude, things have been happening to her that otherwise wouldn't happen to a kind person. She's not all that bad, but there really is something wrong with her mentally and we can't figure out what it is.

And I really do feel bad for her because I truly believe she's not going to get as far in life because of the way she acts, but I ultimately hope the things that are getting back at her will change her outlook. Anyways, enough of that...

So I know it might not feel like the best option, because, really, you do not know what's going on while you are, say, playing a video game or writing up another article, it is surely the best alternative.

And I know this isn't the best of examples to coincide with this matter, but I felt if I had shared it, it would help you reconsider the idea. Just my two cents. But it is your call, so do what you feel is right. You know the most of any of us. Good luck man.

Last edited by Daedusian on 12/6/2008 11:47:26 PM

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gungrave
Saturday, December 06, 2008 @ 11:41:46 PM
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One more thing just becareful. You never what may happen when people snap. I wonder what would happen if you sent that loser a picture text from her phone of when she's down below working them jaw muscles >=0)

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blitz30952
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 5:32:07 AM
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I think this article and long string of comments (with some awesome advice i might add) is the prime example of why I visit this gaming site the most :D

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ArnoldK PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 9:26:20 AM
Reply

Ben, if it makes you feel any better...even my girlfriend said you should hit it and run.

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SarahPalinMILF
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 1:57:08 PM

You're GF sounds awesome...

But def Ben...Hit And Brag...then Run lol

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:18:51 PM

Whoa. Arnie's serious.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:21:49 PM

LOLOLOLOLOL

Now THAT'S good stuff.

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cheng
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:38:31 AM
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Arnold...please...its wat ben wants, not wat your girlfriend wants...but i know ben wont do it, got faith in him.

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superjew
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 12:23:54 PM
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This is a joke right? You're posting your public life on a gaming website, fine, it's interesting enough, but to ask us whether or not you should hit it and quit it? Um... well, that seems rather odd. And kind of petty man. Just let it go, clearly you aren't over this girl or else you probably wouldn't bother. If you're pissed about something just tell her why you are pissed about it and call her out on those things. That's pretty much about as far as you should go.

Sure, it'd be funny, but I honestly think you're smart enough to realize that you won't feel better and that you're just being petty because the relationship didn't quite go the way you had hoped. I'm sorry man, but if you have to do something, just go talk to her, it might actually make you feel better.

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Aftab
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:57:41 PM

Complain to a woman about herself, or about another guy? You have zero experience. "Interesting enough", though, as you say.

Last edited by Aftab on 12/7/2008 3:01:14 PM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:21:15 PM

There's a whole lot more to this than the surface factors, and I would expect you to be able to decipher them...

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xtreme
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:36:03 PM
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I wouldn't bother mate, Don't fall to to there level stay on the higher ground. But what you could do is hang with her more often as friends. That will really get him pissed. Hell if you make it seem to him like you two are together he will lose his nerve. he might even throw a punch. Then you can beat every last drop of justice into him :).

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Fane1024
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:44:53 PM
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Ben,

I'm disappointed in you that you would even consider stooping to this sort of behavior. If you want to confront the jackass, be a man and do it. This sort of behind-the-back B.S. is beneath anyone who would consider himself a human being.

The only person you would really be hurting is yourself.

I understand your feelings, because much the same thing happened to me, but it's not worth sinking to their level just to feel like you got even. As much as part of me would like to hurt my ex, I wouldn't because it would only increase the pain in the world and I'm all about the love. ;)

Not to get too Buddhist or quantum theory about it, but...

"I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together."

p.s. I've really enjoyed reading this debate.

Last edited by Fane1024 on 12/7/2008 3:20:24 PM

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Chaotic Jake
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 7:05:20 PM

Fane's right. She may have been wrong, but what's there to gain out of revenge, especially of that magnitude. In the end, karma will only get you back ten-fold.

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Shatterday
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 2:54:28 PM
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So I was just thinking and I figured I'd post something before I went to work.

You do take a big risk when posting personal articles such as this and it makes me glad that you do it.

When we have things like this to debate over, it takes us away from what this site is about but it's also along the same lines. Instead of debating whether which version of a game is better, Xbox or PS3, or we're just here to read about new games we should look out for... we're talking about an ethical issue for which we all have our own experiences and opinions.

Regardless of whether or not the responses to your posts get positive or negative replies, know that things like this will, in the end, bring us closer together as an online community and as gamers; casual or hardcore.

Ben and Arnold, thank you.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:19:33 PM

It's exactly what I hope for. I'm glad it's working. :)

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MRSUCCESS
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 6:38:20 PM
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Ben, I suggest you hit and run. Wait, don't hit and run---- hit, run, ask her to you food and then you leave. Take pictures of her as well. Never call her again and your pride will sky rocket, believe me--it will.

^_x

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Chaotic Jake
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 7:29:48 PM

More like his stubborn, blinded, self-indulgent shallow, meaningless excuse he considers his existance. No woman in the world would ever want to go out with your sorry ass knowing that you'd kick them to the curb in that pitiful fashion. It'll take morn than a solemn vow to keep that a secret from any of your future girlfriends, and even then no doubt your ex will not hesitate to ensure you don't get your little happily-ever-after after what you did to her. Revenge only manifests into more hatred, and in the end, there's a chance that one of you may end up dead. Not a threat, but a precaution. Don't toy with human emotion. All you're doing is asking for your ass to get pounded as well.

P.S. And for you shallow, pathetic low-lives who are only willing to forgive her if she's hot, screw you all. I suppose that beauty to you is nothing more than a factor that you can manipulate for your own self-benefit in any way, shape, and form. I hope all of you with that kind of mindset end up alone, rotting away in your little hikikimori hideaways contemplating why it is that every girl you asked out ended up ditching you.

(P.P.S. Don't go thinking I'm putting words into your mouth, Ben. I'm merely stating my opinion for someone of that lifestyle and thought process. Unless, this revenge plot is really what you want...)

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Sunday, December 07, 2008 @ 10:18:51 PM

Knock it off. Just because you're pissed about the Nintendo thread doesn't mean you can bring that malice around everywhere. Get over it and calm down.

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Chaotic Jake
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 2:30:10 AM

You're the one to speak for malice! You think I'm posting my opinions for myself? These are people that we're talking about! Badmouthing corporations is one thing, but screwing around with others' lives is a whole other story. You're the one pouring out your pleas of angst and agony, plotting your revenge through screwin' your ex-girlfriend and tossing her out like yesterday's newspaper.

She 'cheated' on you and made you look like a fool. So, the only way to make ends meet is to do the same to both of them. You think your actions don’t have an impact? This ain’t your little Final Fantasy Tactics Shojo-Beat drama/angst love story, you know. You have more of an effect on your community than you think you do. If you screw them over, their response will be no different than yours. They, too, will seek bitter revenge. And if they can't, no doubt they'll take their anger out on someone else. This is where all of your efforts become for naught. Eventually, everyone will be at ends with each other, and society as a whole will break down. Yeah... Sounds like something right out of a movie, yet we neglect to acknowledge just what sparks a riot, or even widespread chaos, such as the whole Middle East. But we're getting off topic...

Point is, you say you hate it when such events happen to you, yet you seem so... intent as to support the very ideology that you continue to rave as a violation of your personal rights. Just what do you support? You realize that you are doing nothing to bring an end to this cycle, nor are you even considering the consequences of your actions. The more you sit here and brood on your problems, the more it'll manifest and develop into hatred and rage. Over time, you'll lose control of all reason and logic. Irrationality will take over, and you'll wind up doing something that you'll have to live with for the rest of your life. And this cycle will only continue until you finally make a stand. Being the bigger man may be overrated, but in the end, you'll make life better for not just yourself, but for those around you as well.

Of course, but what does it matter? You merely believe that you'll get your revenge, and that'll be the end of it. You’ll have your last laugh, and that’s all there is to it. So just go ahead! Do your deed and get it over with! As if anybody cares. I'm sure no one will mind. In fact, I bet they'll all be waiting for you back at home, cheering you on every step of the way saying "It was about time that you got back for what she did! Now won't nobody mess with you now!" And you'll all be laughing about it for the remainder of the night and for many weeks to come. And no one will hold it against you, for if anything, you'd agree that it'd make a hell of a story to tell to your friends...

"Yo, check it! This chick dumped my ass for some retarded douche-bag, but when she realized just how stupid she was, she wanted me back! Well, I wasn't about to be fooled THAT easily. Noooooooo... So I screwed her ass and kicked her out!"

Dude 1: "Whoa, man! That was AWESOME!!!

Dude 2: "Yeah, that totally showed her!

Showed her what? Just what ARE you fighting for? If it were for her, then why does she have to suffer? You claim it to be retribution, but what do you hope to gain from it? Pride? Self-satisfaction? In the end, all three of you will wind up miserable and depressed. You'll feel cheated, she'll be in shambles, and Mr. Pretentious will seek nothing more than to make your life a living hell.

And one has to wonder if you really did care about her. At first, you said that you thought the world of her, yet you're willing to let a situation like this blow your relationship to shrapnel and disintegrate into microscopic dust follicles to be scattered in the breeze. Not only are you so stubborn as to not even let her explain herself, but you are unwilling to so much as even test her to see if her loyalty is as true as she claims, or if it's just another one of her 'baseless conjectures'.

You want advice? Here’s my advice! Just tell her off and be done with it! If you can’t even so much as forgive her, then let it go. After all, she hates being with Mr. Pretentious, does she not? Why not make her suffer by having her live by the decision she so regretted? After all, you DID say that her decision were irrevocable. Just let fate take its intended course. In the end, she will continue to suffer until the day that she finally dumps him as well, at which point; it’ll be his turn to suffer. As a whole, they’ll both get what they have coming to them and wind up alone as well. But I suppose that idea never came to your mind, did it? Revenge doesn’t have to be physical. It can also be emotional or psychological. Not even their fate can escape time itself. And in the end, your hands are clean, for both their fates are bound by their own actions. No crime, no pain, and you’ll still get your little kicks.

(A little psychotic, I must admit, but I try to take both sides and find a middle line.)

If you really valued feedback, then you'd take mine, which you so wholesomely invited in the first place, to heart, rather than ridicule it, ball it up and shove it back down my own throat. If you think that revenge is the right choice, you’ll only be hurting yourself and all those around you. Not only that but you’ll begin to develop a habit of utilizing revenge for your everyday situations. Then eventually, you'll come across someone just like yourself; someone who's not willing to take it lying down. And from there, you can only imagine what ensues.

In the end, I cannot tell you what to do. You may not like what I say, but then again, who’s to say that everyone will be on your side? Honestly, I’m glad I’m not, but it’ll make no difference to me what path you choose: revenge, acceptance, or letting it all go and allowing nature take its course. Just remember that whatever you decide, your decisions are irreversible; just... like... hers...

Memento mori

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 4:47:39 PM

First of all, at no point did I say she cheated on me. She didn't. Secondly, blowing this little drama out of proportion and saying it affects society as a whole is both VASTLY overreaching and even irrelevant. Yes, if we all acted on revenge every second of the day in regards to all the wrongs we believe were committed against us, it'd be chaos. Got it. Thanks for the painfully obvious late-breaking news on that. Thirdly, nobody will interpret this piece as a "rant," and I never once "raved" against either the girl or the guy; in no way do I think this is a "violation against my personal rights."

99% of that rambling post is based entirely on assumption, and these are things you need to be clear on. I'm FAR too laid back to have any of my "brooding" (which none of this is) change to rage and hatred; if anything, it'll just seep away only slightly painfully. I'm going to "lose control of ration and logic?" Are you effing kidding me? I'm not obsessing over this every second of every day, and I'm not losing my grip on reality. One second you're saying this isn't a crazy dramatic end-of-the-world story like in FFT and the next you're telling me I'm gonna snap and start wreaking havoc. ...great contradiction there.

"As if anybody cares?" I'm well aware people shouldn't care; that's hardly the point. I'm not asking anybody to "care." I simply asked about what people thought. As for the rest of that infantile mess, it's a grave insult to me and anybody I associate with. That's another bad assumption, and incredibly annoying. All three of us will end up "miserable and depressed?" ...what the hell? Because the relationship triangle is a little iffy right now? Yes, three lives will be ruined depending on what I do. Mm-hm.

I did care about her, and if a "situation like this" doesn't alter your view of a person, you're a freaking idiot. Plain and simple. Another screwed up assumption is that I didn't give her a chance to explain herself; I've given her multiple chances, and it's not MY fault the explanations have been lame and unconvincing. And here's a little hint- we don't "test" another's loyalty. That just screams insecurity. Loyalty should be trusted, not tested, genius.

I KNOW what revenge can be. Stop talking to me like I'm a low-IQ Alpha male. It's pissing me off. If you want to rely on fate, you go RIGHT ahead; I live in the real world, where this plane of existence relies only on actual action. I did invite feedback and I got a ton of it, and I responded civilly to those who recommended either side. The difference? THEY didn't make rash assumptions about me, my friends, the other two people, or the situation. You've made the majority of it up in your mind to support your argument, which makes the entire thing null and void. Got it?

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 12/8/2008 4:49:08 PM

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concerned man
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 2:17:58 AM
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To Ben,

Greetings. I stumbled across this web-site and read the article located above. As it may become apparent, I am a person who likes to think/debate about these kinds of issues, and I would like to impart some advice, whether helpful to your situation or not.

I would like to start out by saying that I am sorry for your apparent anger at this situation. To say that I know how you feel would be a bold-faced lie, seeing as I don't know the rigors of a relationship gone awry. That and I am not you, so how could I possibly know exactly what you're feeling?

Getting to the heart of the matter, however, I must agree with many of those on the forum who say that "revenge is not the answer".

(Having examined paragraph starting in "Anyway,")

From the thoughts expressed in this paragraph concerning the statements/excuses she gave for her defense, it really sounds to me as if you feel like she is out to get you and ruin your life. Usually, in my experience, people think about others a lot more than themselves, but there are those times in their lives when they are so focused on getting things done or pursuing something that they temporarily lose sight of the people who want their questions answered promptly and legitimately. It is quite possible from the information given in this paragraph that she isn't doing all of this just because she dislikes you or that you don't "measure up to her expectations" so to speak. She may see something in the other guy that could be completely different from what you see in him, something positive in his favor but not negative about you. Sure, the way she attempted to break up with you like she did wasn't the best way to go about it, but not everyone necessarily has a quick, witty explanation for why their feelings have shifted so far in the other direction, especially when under all of the other pressures of life that they go through. Aside from her and the other guy's actions and justifications, there is the factor of "forgiveness" to measure in here. Forgiveness can manifest in different ways, including:

Complete forgiveness: Not only forgiving someone in words, but also in mindset.

Partial forgiveness: Forgiving someone in words, but secretly unforgiving in mindset.

Self-focused forgiveness: Forgiving in both words and mindset, but only for the purpose of letting the issue go and moving on with one's life.

No forgiveness: none...nada...zip...

Whichever route you would like to take, it is not my place to decide that for you, but only my humble opinion of which to impart on you. My advice is to forgive for your own sake FIRST, and then if you ever feel like forgiving them, then go for it.

(Having read the paragraph starting in "This was")

"Biblicalesque" revenge is most certainly not the way to go for many reasons. One, not everybody feels the same way about the Bible's teachings and writings as others. Two, not everyone feels the same way about religious referencing as others (speaking specifically for Athiests and Agnostics). Three, from what I have learned from my religious mentors, "Biblicalesque" revenge is reserved for God, and only God. It is God who imparts this brand of punishment. Any other forms of punishment we use are for social, interpersonal, or personal reasons only, and are subject to questioning at any time.

A firm sense of morality must also be backed up by internal and external dialogues (with both ourselves and friends, family, colleagues) when debating whether or not to take certain actions against the person who wronged you. Without them, our "moral compasses" are nothing more than child's toys, useless and breaking at the slightest tension or resistance. We must remember that everyone's "reality" is different, and that your's, her's, the other guy's, and my reality are far, far different. This makes us think, act, and socialize in ways that would possibly offend each other, or at least be unsettling. As different as our realities are, our senses of justice can be just as ambiguous. Therefore, "morality" is a questionable human trait that I suggest we all study more about before we go off and do something that we will inevitably regret.

(Reading on from "But of" to the end)

There are many opinions expressed in this article that I find very questionable, but will not argue, for even though my sight on this is way different you have your own right to be angry and to defend your own interests.

To answer the proposed questions:

Yes, she should be blamed for not coming clean with you about her affair with this other guy, and for not fully considering how the situation would make you feel.

No, she doesn't deserve the said hurt that you would inflict, because in my eyes, the penalty would not fully fit the crime. There is a difference between being evasive and ignorant about everyone's feelings (in her case), but there is a big difference between this and in doing what you were proposing, in which you would be deceiving her by taking her back and "having sex" with her just to make sure that both of them are as miserable as they could possibly be.

Thank you for your reading time, and I hope you find the answers you are searching for.


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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 3:52:00 PM

Well, thanks for all that; I always appreciate concerned effort. ;)

However, I think you're misinterpreting a few things. First of all, in no way do I believe this girl is out to ruin my life. I really don't think that can be inferred from what I've written; the angst I may feel after the break-up is just normal stuff, and not indicative of anything deeper. Secondly, I knew I made a mistake when I said "Biblical-esque," because I knew people would take it literally. I really didn't wish to be literal, as it's only there for creative flair and emphasis. I don't mean to imply anything religious with that imagined phrase.

As for the part about the moral compass, and that our realities are all different, I do have to disagree. While I just said earlier that I believe morality to be subjective, I DON'T agree that reality is subjective. Perception only dictates perceived notions; reality is unaffected. This follows the same law that says personal opinion has absolutely no impact whatsoever on product quality. If the other guy I'm talking about her perceives things in a certain way, fine; he's entitled to do that. ...doesn't mean he can't be wrong, and it doesn't mean it's his "reality." He's just misinterpreting reality.

For me, I'm aware that revenge is hardly a long-term solution (or even a solution at all), but sometimes, we get the urge to indulge in a vice that will make us feel good for only a short while, even while understanding we'll feel like hell later. It's what makes us human. ;)

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superjew
Monday, December 08, 2008 @ 3:40:10 PM
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Aftab, I'm in a relationship that has lasted nearly 3 years, it isn't the first one I've had and while I don't know Ben personally or claim to be an expert, I have some experience.

Don't take the high road because it's the high road, take it because it'll make you feel better in the long run. I think anyone with some experience in dating, Aftab, would know that there's no way Ben does this if he's over all of it. He just lets it go and moves on.

Fu** Karma, fu** what she deserves, go talk to her if you need to clear the air. Not to get a relationship back on track, for closure, so you can move on with your life. Don't worry, making bad decisions on her part will likely bite her in the ass. I just don't honestly see how this makes anything better, aren't you pretty much just matching hte level of Mr. Pretentious Jackass by doing this? He's getting your sloppy seconds, and you're getting his sloppy thirds. ;)

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concerned man
Tuesday, December 09, 2008 @ 12:32:47 AM
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To Ben,

Thank you for your reply, and I'm glad that it seems like you're feeling better.

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Toxin
Wednesday, December 10, 2008 @ 4:59:41 AM
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You may go into it in thought of getting back at him but in the end, who is to say you are not the one that gets hurt?



Last edited by Toxin on 12/10/2008 5:01:14 AM

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PS3_Wizard
Wednesday, December 10, 2008 @ 11:01:49 AM
Reply

Yeah Ben, I CAN say that i feel your pain.

My girlfriend of 2 years and 2 months has moved to a new location and is attending a new school. We started out great, with plans of having kids and getting married and only being their for each other. We have a semi-long distance relationship, so we have talked on the phone our entire relationship without missing so much as a day. That is until she started lying about things and holding stuff back from me, knowing it would be detrimental to us. She was in a few small situations involving a few guys, but we got over those problems with time.

Well anyway, when she moved to this new school, lots of guys approached her, seeing as how she is a model with DD breasts and a face to die for. At first, she was doing what she was doing previously at her old school, when the guys came up to her, she'd turn them down and tell her she was taken.

Well one day i hear from her brother she has met a male "friend" who i was kept in the dark about. After doing a bit of research in the matter; (and not to mention stalking her by sitting outside of her house) I found they she put off our precious phone time that was so essential to our relationship to go on "jogs" with him out of the blue. keep in mind that she has never wanted to go jogging EVER prior to that day. And she told me that she was going with just her brother.

My research also found that peer pressure from her new "girl friends" and the guy himself was contributing to her infidelity. They would say things like "Its ok for you to be friends with him" or "He doesn't have to know what you're doing all the time. You are too young to get tied down to one guy"

Well a few weeks later (and going to clubs, and sneaking him over her house, all without letting me know anything) I found lots of proof and decided to confront her about the problem. Even faced with the undeniable facts, she continued to pull the whole "we are just friends" card.

I've even taken the time to find out where he lived, and drove to literally F*** his A** up. All to no avail, because he heard of me coming and decided to high tale it out.

After that incident, she supposedly told me everything, and wasn't holding anything back from me anymore. I took her back after she agreed to change back to her old self.

Unfortunantly, she got involved with this guy 2 more times, each time thinking she could get away with it. I guess the point of my story is that I know how much you are hurting. You act as if its not that painful, maybe because you want to save face in the midst of us readers. But i know its rough on you.

I gave my all for my girl...who im trying to get out of my system, giving up on friends, college, and my senior year of high school.

If anyone tells you that revenge isn't the answer, they obviously haven't been put through this situation like us. Women are evil creatures. Don't trust the "I want to be friends" lie. They will use that to try to take the time to get back on good terms with you, and end up making the same mistake all over again.

The guy who is trying to steal my girl was lucky he wasn't around when i stopped by for a visit. You and I differ because you didn't do anything while he was being a complete a** to you. I would have F***ed his a** up in a heartbeat, but I would do it at a later time, preferably with a ski mask to hide my identity.

And about your EX? Chances are she knew full well what she was doing. She thought she wanted a future that was more financially stable, or that she wanted to try new things. And not backing you up when he was downing you was a terrible thing on her part. For all you know she could have been laughing along with him when you parted ways.

Screw the Trick, and leave her. Its less of a chance of being hurt in the future. If she left you once because of peer pressure, she can do it again.

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