Face It, Hardcore Gamers, You Don't Matter
View Large ImageIt's the most painful thing I've had to say all year. But the facts are undeniable.
Although there are still plenty of developers out there who absolutely strive to deliver games specifically designed for the hardcore, the industry is now dominated by the casual crowd. And that can never change.
It can't because gaming is officially mainstream. Back when it was only for tech geeks and the kids who had trouble making friends in school, basically the only people who played were "hardcore." There was no such thing as the 26-year-old girl who sat down and played anything; see, we didn't have mobile gaming or games on Facebook, and the stigma that females did not play video games was in full effect. No girl would be caught dead playing a video game.
The evidence is right there in the content of video games. They were once nigh-on impossible to beat; only the truly hardcore, the endlessly dedicated, could eventually conquer them. But you can't get away with that any longer, as the majority of gamers are not hardcore and simply wouldn't play if we didn't implement the ease and accessibility that is now common. I've spoken out before about how this is actually a very good thing. And of course, we're talking about big business now. Big business doesn't survive without the masses. An obvious and irreversible rule.
So in the long run, if a publisher is looking to make money, he absolutely cannot focus on the hardcore. In fact, that publisher can't really think about such a small group at all. Losing the hardcore means almost nothing, provided the casuals love it; it has been estimated by analysts in the past that 80-85% of this industry is now comprised of people who are only "casual" in every sense of the word. With gaming spreading to multiple venues and becoming a normal part of popular culture, the term "hardcore" can only denote the die-hard avid fans, and that is always the minority in any big-business form of entertainment.
If movies weren't also dominated by the casual movie-going public, we'd have top-quality independent and foreign films that focus on writing, acting, cinematography, etc. You know, the stuff real film buffs actually care about. But the vast majority of movies are just flash and no substance, which is what the masses want. And that's what they're getting in the video game world, too, although I still maintain that this industry rewards quality in terms of both critical reception and sales.
So although the hardcore can no longer drive sales to the point where game makers can actually turn a profit, it seems most gamers still know what's good. ...to some extent.
8/3/2012 Ben Dutka
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Comments (49 posts)
Temjin001
Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 9:51:45 PM
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But it really is no longer niche. And the first game I can recall that really made headlines, like literally camera TV crews at Babbages/EB/Gamestop, was Final Fantasy VII. THat game by my recollection was something of a trojan horse, bringing video gaming to the lime light of mainstream entertainment. Well, something that wasn't Mario and Zelda anyway.
But as Ben pointed out with movies, I near had to stop watching Transformers 3 half way through a couple weeks back (first time watching it), I just couldn't stomach how much of a sell out the movie is for the masses. Don't get me wrong, I love Transformers, more when I was young than now, but Michael Bay's interpretation is designed to appease everyone.
Anyway, I really don't know how things will be for Sony going forward into the next-gen. History has suggested to me that winners and losers happen on generational transitions, I just hope MS and their market tactics doesn't bury Sony or place them in a spot that forces them to really change their identity.. anyway that's a different topic.
Last edited by Temjin001 on 8/3/2012 9:53:28 PM
6 up, 0 down
Warrior Poet
Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 11:29:59 PM
4 up, 1 down
Temjin001
Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 11:41:15 PM
2 up, 0 down
DazeOfWar
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 12:19:31 AM
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Teddie9
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 7:52:55 AM
2 up, 0 down
bluedarrk
Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 10:08:39 PM
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5 up, 0 down
xenris
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:56:38 AM
1 up, 0 down
DazeOfWar
Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 10:30:45 PM
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Even with movies I'll watch anything. I may not like some but I do enjoy the moment. I love a movie sometimes where it's just non stop action without a deep story but I also love movies with a really good story. It all depends on what kind of mood I'm in. I've watch some of the biggest garbage on Netflix but I've always made the best of it. If the movie is boring I take the time to get a nap in. Some of my favorite movies are all subtitled and foreign.
Let the gaming industry bring on whatever they want. We'll always still have the devs out there that were/are hardcore gamers and want that experience themselves. I think sometimes peoples standards are set to high nowadays to actually enjoy a game like they use to.
5 up, 1 down
homura
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 12:25:55 AM
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As for the casual gamers who started playing only mobile games and facebook games, some of them do it just to kill time, me too sometimes play it for 15 mins. (Fruit Ninja is a good quick stress reliever), but sometimes other casual gamers will be hardcore gamer, for example: my cousin only knows mobile games, facebook games, but when she tried Uncharted, FFXIII and Heavy Rain in my ps3, she regreted buying an IPHONE 4S,
1 up, 0 down
ulsterscot
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 1:40:42 AM
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7 up, 0 down
Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 1:59:29 AM
I believe even the COD haters realize this. :)
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/4/2012 2:18:01 AM
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Underdog15
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:40:00 PM
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Beamboom
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 4:07:56 AM
You can be lucky and enter a game with only newbies. But if you on *average* ends up amongst the top three-five well then you are really very skilled and deserves cred for that. That's *not* easy.
COD is easier than the more tactical games like Battlefield (who I just find far *too* hard and I'll admit that), cause it's more solo based and therefore does not have the same teamplay requirements. Plus it's very well made and therefore intuitive, easy to *understand*.
But easy to *master*? Getouttahere!
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/5/2012 4:14:01 AM
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Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 2:31:51 AM
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It's online competitive gaming that is the hardest thing to master today. No soft intro, no difficulty curve, no tutorial phase, no savegames, no forgiving AI, no mercy.
It requires playing the same maps over and over, learning every inch of the map like the back of your hand, ultra quick reflexes and an intimate knowledge of the gameplay mechanics and ruleset.
That's hardcore gaming right there, folks. That's the arena where the noobs are nothing but target practise, and that's where the hardcore gamers flock.
I used to be one of them, but I have no problem in being called a casual gamer these days. I just don't have the *time* for anything else any more. Frankly I don't think I'd have the skills either. I'm just too old for that sh*t now.
Had my life been different I'd love to fight for the upper spots on the result boards, or the most prestigious equipment in mmorpgs! But I don't have that time.
So instead, when the chance arise and I got a couple of hours to spend on gaming I want to progress in the game I am working on. I don't want to spend those rare, valuable hours struggling with some god damn hard boss that spank me over and over and wipe the floor with my ass, or a map I have to start over and over each time I die.
I just don't want it! I guess that makes me casual. So sue me. But I am really very pleased that the single player games are heading this direction. It suits me *perfectly*.
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/4/2012 3:01:24 AM
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homura
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:03:52 AM
3 up, 0 down
Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:11:03 AM
To be honest Homura, that whole "casual VS hardcore" separation of gamers implies an elitish attitude that I just don't like. I find it rather... Childish? So people can call me whatever they want, I don't really want to be a part of that game(!) anyway.
Why can't we all just be... Gamers? With different preferences and reasons for being gamers? Some want this, some want that, but we are all gamers.
What we prefer typically depends on what we are familiar with anyway.
So I am Beamboom, a *GAMER*. Nice to meet you, gamer Homura! ;)
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/4/2012 3:53:23 AM
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PharaohJR
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:19:44 AM
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xenris
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 9:08:03 AM
Its hard to really explain how it is different but, I guess the best example would be one is like winning a game of soccer and the other is like solving a rubix cube for the first time without anyone helping you.
Competitive games are pretty limited to genres, you have shooters, RTS, and fighting games.
Is it fair that people who want challenging platformers, action games, RPGs etc are left out to dry?
I don't think hardcore games will disappear soon, we have devs that are catering to us. However I think it might die with my generation of gamers. Unless there is some hardcore gamer revolution when all the casuals get fed up with ez modes :P
0 up, 1 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 9:48:40 AM
3 up, 6 down
Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 10:15:37 AM
I agree that competitive online is pretty limited to genres Xenris, also I agree that no-one should be left out to dry. Of course not.
Furthermore you got a good point in that the experiences are utterly different. Totally agree. Online matches are like a sports games, indeed they are.
But a professional chess player is just as "hardcore" as a professional table tennis player even though those two games are extremely different.
And in my opinion, from a pure analytical point of view there is no principal difference between practising 100 hours to beat a boss or 100 hours to win a match. It's just two different kind of games, just like there are different kinds of sports in the olympics.
When most of you in the comment field on this page talk about "hardcore" you only think single player games, but that's way too narrow. Hardcore is a question of dedication and difficulty! And to win in online matches you need to be *real* good, utterly dedicated, cause it's *hard*.
It's hardcore!
Be honest now, this is just another case of missing "the good old days". Let's call it "oldschool" instead of hardcore.
What we have here is a classic, traditional generation shift where the old boys don't understand the shit the youngsters do today.
"There's no real music made anymore. Or movies. Or TV. Or... Games."
Time to face it gents, you're just getting old! :D
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/4/2012 4:24:02 PM
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xenris
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 10:37:40 AM
Bens favourite game is FFTactics from what I understand, or at least it is up there for him. Is it fair that that genre which poses specific challenges is disappearing? Should he have to take up FPS gaming to get a challenge? Even still going to actual competitions in an FPS is a lot of coordination. How is that fair, that he can't have a hardcore game made for him and others and instead has to take up another genre and travel to LAN parties to play a game of Counter strike or starcraft or something like that?
That is the problem here beamboom. I played competitive games on the PC I know what I'm talking about and they aren't the same type of challenge as a hardcore difficult single player game, or co op game. Dedication is needed for both but I didn't need to dedicate myself to dark souls in order to get better at it. You just have to learn from mistakes which doesn't require 100s of hours to do.
Last edited by xenris on 8/4/2012 10:41:27 AM
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Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 11:23:13 AM
No no, God no, please don't misunderstand me in that I mean that any - *any* - genre or game style should disappear or that everyone should just suck up and start playing online shooters instead. That is as far from my principles it is possible to get. I will always defend plurality and diversity. And I will defend that far beyond my own personal preferences.
No, my entire point is just that hardcore *gaming* has changed. Hardcore gaming happens elsewhere today than it did 20 years ago.
It's the fans of oldschool gaming that "don't matter as much any more", cause times have changed.
I believe that's why you don't find todays single player games to be too hard, cause who play those games? Its those of us who are not playing on the "hardcore arena"! And we don't want to spend a hundred hours to take down a boss. We want to progress.
But I am all for a diverse selection of games to choose from. Omg yes...!
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/4/2012 11:40:24 AM
4 up, 1 down
xenris
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 1:15:21 PM
If you just want to progress I think people should still with a novel or a movie. I'm not trying to sound elitist, but in some cases games can be played without much input from the player and they hold your hand almost all of the way. Some of those games are awesome experiences and I don't think they should not exist, you know Journey was awesome and was not hardcore as are many others. But it sucks when genres that WERE hardcore or more difficult lose all semblance of challenge that the fans of that genre grew up with. Then we have genres dying out because its not profitable to make strategy RPGs or heck even traditional RPGS.
I dunno, its kind of why I PC game because there are still devs making hardcore games that are balanced even though they aren't making crazy profit they are still profiting so they continue to do it.
I just fear all genres will mash into one(kind of like they already are) and will all be so easy and casual it will be like going to an interactive movie only in this case you get the illusion of control and being a badass when really you arent.
I just find the subject touchy for me. I really don't like the direction the industry is going in most cases and this catering to casuals just rubs me the wrong way. Sorry for the rant.
1 up, 1 down
Beamboom
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 2:00:30 PM
2 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:51:50 PM
Now, while I don't play enough to think of myself as true hardcore, my interests are that of a hardcore gamer. My reasoning continues, though... it's because I like titles from ALL genres (while some I like more than others, but who doesn't?). I play difficult titles and easy ones. I play popular games and games that are extremely rare or niche. I'm just a game lover. Someone who solely plays CoD or devotes innumerable hours to WoW.... I don't think they're hardcore. I think they might be obsessed with their favorite titles, but... well... put it this way. Put one of them in Dark Souls, Uncharted's multiplayer, LBP.... whatever... and see. They will either be no good or simply won't like the discomfort of something they are unfamiliar with.
No one is made hardcore because they play a lot of hours or play what is most popular (or even commit themselves to a single title that is niche). Hardcore to me is a gamer who appreciates the entire gaming industry. A gamer who follows news, rumors, editorials, videos... who plays and is interested in a wide arrangement of titles and genres... who seeks to master anything he lays his hands on... one who appreciates artistry in games AND values the mindless blood n' gore hack n' slashes. A hardcore gamer is not easily defined by a checklist, a certain game, or playstyle. They are defined by their interest in and commitment to the gaming empire, their passion for story and challenge alike (not always present in all titles), and their ability to appreciate each and every title out there for whatever small things they do well... even if it's not a game that particularly "clicks" with them.
I know it's entirely subjective... but everything good and noble in life is. :p How do you define a hero, a leader, or a friend? There is no checklist... but there's never any doubt, either.
2 up, 2 down
Fane1024
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 12:19:05 AM
If you want to use "hardcore" to mean something different, then it shouldn't be contrasted with "casual".
People who play COD for hours every night until the next one is released are not "casual" by any definition of the word.
casual adj.
1. happening by chance; fortuitous: a casual meeting.
2. without definite or serious intention; careless or offhand; passing: a casual remark.
3. seeming or tending to be indifferent to what is happening; apathetic; unconcerned: a casual, nonchalant air.
4. appropriate for wear or use on informal occasions; not dressy: casual clothes; casual wear.
5. irregular; occasional: a casual visitor.
In other words, more than one dichotomy exists within gaming and we shouldn't conflate various identifiable groups.
Last edited by Fane1024 on 8/5/2012 12:33:09 AM
3 up, 1 down
Beamboom
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 3:49:00 AM
You just pull out the very definition of casual and it all becomes clear as day for all, case closed.
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/5/2012 4:22:12 AM
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homura
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 5:39:00 AM
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Beamboom
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 9:34:35 AM
My goal here was just to point out that it is the "oldschool gamers" that don't matter, the "hardcore gamers" of today are getting bucketloads of luv.
But yeah, I feel with both you and Ben and Xenris & the rest here. I totally feel your frustration and I'm just really glad I am not in that same boat, since I never had that same relationship with jrpgs and srpgs to begin with. I've only played the typical western style games my entire gaming career, so I don't know what I've missed out on.
But all this talk about those genres has made me really curious! So I *hope* that we with the next gen will see the resurrection of those gamestyles, and get a handful of blockbusters that can give me a proper introduction to the genres.
Last edited by Beamboom on 8/5/2012 9:36:17 AM
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richfiles
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 12:17:25 PM
I'm getting ooooolllllllddddddd!!! /)O_O(\
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PharaohJR
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:34:48 AM
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i remember my early days of gaming most folks i dealt with thought it was foolish..... then xbox dropped some how it made them folks pick up a controller but i couldnt get into xbox like sony,sega & nintendo..... i dont mind gaming elevating, just dont forget the foundation.
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Gamer46
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:52:46 AM
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___________
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 4:40:06 AM
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exactly why this gen has been such a massive disappointment!
i miss the good old days where developers made games they want to make, not developers making games they THINK will sell!
miss the good old days where there was a multitude of genres, and sub genres, and everything was in pretty good balance.
not to say there were not more popular genres, but its certainly not like it is now where whole genres have gone non existent!
which is what really worries me about next gen systems.
developers have dummed down their games for the mass market, and they have dummed down their games because there so heffed up on amazing graphics and technoloy they run out of time and budget to improve the gameplay!
cough GOW!
so whats next gen going to be like when systems are even more powerful!?
and even more expensive to develop for?
that just means things will get even worse!
1 up, 2 down
Veitsknight
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:00:06 AM
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It goes something like this:
"This is actually very similar to the photographer argument. Just because someone has a pricey camera and takes pictures, it doesn't really make that person a photgrapher.
I do agree that this view borderlines bigotry but what you guys fail to realize that generalization affects us as well. Unlike camera companies, video game publishers wont or can't cater to a specific type. They have to generalize. Many of us here are RPG lovers, but we mosty play FPS games because that is what they keep pumping out this generation. And they kept pumping FPS just because a couple million people got addicted to CoD. This generation has been a huge blob of FPS and bloom effects.
Now we do have a couple of games that do cater to our favorite genre but alot of those have been stripped down, made easy and basterdized to appeal to a "broader audience".
EA is already investing alot into casual gaming and pay-to-win scheemes because that is what the "general" gaming public is into :D"
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xenris
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:55:07 AM
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It all just seems to be about getting people into the game shooting stuff quick because everyone has ADHD and can't take 3 minutes to watch or read something about the game they are playing.
I just watched one of Conan Obrians Clueless gamer reviews and while it was funny I couldn't help but be saddened by watching it, as he was playing skyrim he was constantly saying I wanna kill something, can we skip this, stop talking women etc. The impatience was probably an act to a degree but I have "gamer" friends who act the same way. Their attention is so low that they need constant stimulation and explosions killing in order to not get bored.
Sadly I don't think this will pass either. As each generation below me seems to want everything to come easy for them. In games if they arent "winning" then the game sucks, even if the winning has nothing really to do with their skills. They just want the illusion of being good at something, which extends far past videogames in the younger generation. We are in the era of instant gratification it would seem.
2 up, 1 down
DazeOfWar
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 3:42:06 PM
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Us hardcore gamers will put 100+ hours into 1 game. Plus we will play a more variety of games. We know what's coming out and when. Who the developers and publishers are. We go onto gaming sites to read about gaming and find out anything new about our games. We will stand in line at a midnight launch just to get our game asap.
I have a lot of friends that also play games but they're the casual type. They play here and there and always ask me what's new in gaming.
Us hardcore live and breathe gaming. We love to play more than anybody else and that is why we are hardcore gamers.
2 up, 0 down
DazeOfWar
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 11:32:38 PM
Even when I was in the Steam store they have many games listed as casual even though a casual gamer wouldn't play them. I think we are just looking at it all wrong.
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xnonsuchx
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 5:31:27 PM
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Axe99
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 5:51:17 PM
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It's very important to see the trees in the wood - while the casual is a big proportion, it's not the whole gaming market by any stretch :).
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Rogueagent01
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 8:28:10 PM
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If devs would take the programming more seriously we could all be happy but it seems the pubs push them into the corner and say either/or and that is that, leaaving the devs out to dry when it comes to customer feedback. Hopefully more companies will realize this is achievable before they lose all of their hardcore and casual fans.
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dork02840
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 10:30:35 PM
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DazeOfWar
Saturday, August 04, 2012 @ 11:24:12 PM
I'm confused on that part.
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homura
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 1:11:02 AM
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I just remember, I,ve seen a video about Super Mario, in the video you you will see the fastest time to beat the game without dying just turbo and jump occasionally all the the way without stopping and pushing the left button, and a video of clearing the last level of Tetris, it's so fast, and of course a news about a blink kid finishing a zelda game of course with a help of zelda fans, and I thought to myself, wow those are hardcore gamers.
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homura
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 1:11:17 AM
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I just remember, I,ve seen a video about Super Mario, in the video you you will see the fastest time to beat the game without dying just turbo and jump occasionally all the the way without stopping and pushing the left button, and a video of clearing the last level of Tetris, it's so fast, and of course a news about a blink kid finishing a zelda game of course with a help of zelda fans, and I thought to myself, wow those are hardcore gamers.
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SS4
Sunday, August 05, 2012 @ 6:55:19 PM
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The world is controlled by a minority that enthralls the masses while individuals gets swallowed up and thats why some ppl have some niche hobbies but those can be invaded as well as we are seeing now . .
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KaneKaos
Monday, August 06, 2012 @ 4:49:03 AM
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Yaz
Tuesday, August 07, 2012 @ 2:27:45 PM
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Challenge is nice of course, gaming gets boring after a while when you're practically an unbeatable god, but some games are just too hard. I like being able to experience a good story or the wacky antics of a game at my own pace. This doesn't mean that the hardcore gamer should be ignored, though it seems to be the case.
Everyone should be able to find a great game that they enjoy, whether it brings in the big bucks or not. I just wish game companies would look past the money and see that too.
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D_RoyJenkins
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Friday, August 03, 2012 @ 9:46:45 PM