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Volition Designer: Used Games Market Needs To Be Fixed

Volition game designer Jameson Durall is working on a "secret project." But that project didn't get him in the news.

No, he sounded off on the controversial used video game market at the AltDevBlog in a post entitled, "I Feel Used." As most know, while GameStop makes millions off the sale and resale of games, game studios don't see a penny of used transactions. And Durall says if something doesn't change soon, the whole system could crumble.

"In the end, I fully believe that we have to do something about these issues or our industry is going to fall apart. People often don't understand the cost that goes into creating these huge experiences that we put on the shelves for only $60. They also don't seem to realize how much they are hurting us when they buy a used game and how pirating a copy is just plain stealing."

Durrall suggested that downloadable content could help combat the problem, as timely and valuable DLC would cause gamers to hold on to their copies longer. But he adds that such content has to be "compelling and a good enough value." He also supports the online pass program manufacturers like EA, THQ, and Sony utilize; the programs began in at attempt to get consumers to buy new copies. Said Durrall:

"Some consumers complain about this method because the precedent has always been that it's included in the price and should come with it. It did for the person who actually bought it first…so was saving that $5 at GameStop worth it for you?"

We've often said that gamers tend to be awfully dismissive of the amount of money required to produce certain titles these days. The idea that all developers are sitting in mansions sipping champagne is sadly false; the terrible truth of the matter is that it's a forbidding environment, and non-million sellers often barely make enough for the creators to break even. Used games aren't really helping, although we don't propose a solution.

Tags: used games, preowned games, volition, used video games

2/6/2012 8:40:27 PM John Shepard

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Comments (58 posts)

NoSmokingBandit
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 10:03:06 PM
Reply

Yes, and getting free books at your local library is going to drive publishers into oblivion.

Oh wait, thats not at all what happened.

Rather than blame the customer for everything, as is the modern trend for just about every media company, why not do your job better? Well, that would require more work and its easier to simply demonize everyone who bought a used copy of anything.

And people need to stop this BS thing about used games being $5 less than their new counterparts. All of the used games i've bought have been at least $15 less than new, usually more. People suck at shopping if they can only find used copies $5 less. But lets not be logical in our assertions, just throw out numbers that make your point sound better.

The reason some studios are hemorrhaging cash is the same reason every other company in the world is: The economy is still in the crapper. So rather than tough it out and do you job so well that people will be thrilled to buy your product, lets just blame the consumers.

Damn you poor college kids for paying $45 for a used copy of a $60 game! Damn you all! Its all your fault!!!! And dont get me started on parents working 2 jobs just to get their kid used copy of game for their birthday/christmas. They are the worst offenders. How dare they save money for their child when there are giant corporations who deserve their money more?

Am I doing it right?

This industry is disgusting. This is not the gaming i grew up with and its not the gaming i'll continue to enjoy. Musicians and film studios have been dealing with this "problem" at least twice as long as game publishers, and they seem to be doing alright. But thats different for whatever reason makes people feel better.

If you'll excuse me i'm going to go put a down payment on a brand new house because contractors are going out of business left and right and its my personal responsibility to take care of them. Apparently.

Last edited by NoSmokingBandit on 2/6/2012 10:04:07 PM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:03:30 PM

Publisher greed is hurting them more than used game buyers. And you're right about that $5 thing, every gamer I know would rather pay that $5 for the new copy. They buy used because the game is like 10 or 20 bucks and they don't know if they will like it.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 12:04:33 AM

For the record, the current trend in this country is exactly the opposite of what you say. It's the customer is right about everything and all businesses with more than two employees are corrupt, money-grubbing, kick-you-in-the-crotch corporations.

...I could hazard a guess as to where this borderline communistic viewpoint comes from, but I won't.

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 2/7/2012 12:05:31 AM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:03:41 AM

Does it come from communists?

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___________
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:21:34 AM

how does reading books in the library relate to used games?
your can go down to the rental store and play twisted metal every time you want to play it can you?
the library does not hurt writers because there not loosing any money from them.
such a small percentage of people who read their books do it from a library.
games though its the opposite.
so many people who play games do so by pirating, or renting, or buying used, 3 instances, not 1, where the developer sees bubcus!

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JohnnyGold
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 6:00:10 AM

Actually Ben,

if you are proposing fixed prices for games that consumers must pay at all times, that would be closer to a government controlled market (i.e. communism) than nosmokingbandits complaint, which is calling for a free market economy, or "capitalism." the fixed-price point for luxury goods is also known as "corporate wellfare."

the reason for that, and the economic collapse itself, was eloquently brought up by you in the article itself:
"The idea that all developers are sitting in mansions sipping champagne is sadly false."
how large is a staff that works on a game? and they should all make profits of millions of dollars for their efforts? and this is every studio?

no no, my friend. forget gamestop - go into one of your local record stores to truly gauge the worth of a game. red dead redemption still resells for 40. final fantasy 13 was 20$ about a month after it came out. if final fantasy released for 20$, how many more sales would they have had? hmmmmmmm. what if they released digitally for 20, and brick and mortar for 50$. i bet they would have turned a higher profit in either scenario.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 10:59:58 AM

Bandit, you are wrong on every point, and so far off base that you might as well hand in your game console now because if you had your way, no one would be making games at all.

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:25:39 AM

Everytime someone buys a used copy of a game less than 3 years old, somewhere a puppy dies and a polar bear cries.

ARE YOU HAPPY NOW?!?!?!

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:55:23 PM

Johnny: No idea what you're talking about. I never proposed any solution nor did I say I believed all developers should be wealthy. All I did was point out a contradiction.

Coming from a family of entrepreneurs, I can tell you from long experience that the current trend in this country is that of all businesses being bad and all customers - i.e., "the people" - are being persecuted by anybody in business.

It's retarded but it's part of the entitlement generation.

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sha4dowknight05
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 4:35:36 PM

you are so right, games cost too much money nowdays. people don't have as much money as they used too before. i think we should just keep things simple and i will buy whatever game i want and if i choose to buy used it would have to be a really good offer over the new opy of the game.

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 6:54:28 PM

What? I have WAY more monies than I used to!

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BikerSaint
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 10:52:39 PM
Reply

HMMMM, you know what???

During all the days of the......
Tandy,
Commodore,
Telestar Alpha
Intellivision,
Colecovision,
Atari 2600/5200/7200,
NES,
SNES,
Jaguar,
3DO,
VirtualBoy,
Turbo Grafix,
Atari Lynx,
Sega MasterDrive,
Genesis,
Sega,
GameGear,
NeoGeo,
N64,
Sega Nomad,
Saturn,
Dreamcast,
GameBoy/GBAdvance/GBSP/GBMicro,
GameCube,
DS
PS2,
or original Xbox.......
..........NOT ONCE did I ever heard any developer and/or publisher what-so-ever complain even once about either used games sales or cry about lending your copy to another....until this gen.

Maybe part of the problem is there's too many games out around the same time this gen(at least on the PS3)& since the economy's really sucked for a while now, whether we like it or not, we are now having to pick & choose our games carefully, where we didn't have to in the past.

Another problem I see is that some developers need to hone their craft better if they really want to pick up better sales. I mean maybe those same developers need to drop their prices quickly to better reflect their lackluster games.

Otherwise(and as an out-of-work collector) I won't be able to buy that many D1P's, and I'll have to keep on either waiting for huge price drops during any Buy 2-get 1 Free deals, or buying some of my games used.

Last edited by BikerSaint on 2/6/2012 10:56:28 PM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:04:54 PM

Jaguar ftw!

I think the difference is that in the old days there were a lot fewer GOOD games. But it's like, hey it isn't my fault I can't buy them all brand spanking new.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 7:11:05 AM

You are onto something there, World. I can't recall ever there was a time where there was this many high quality games as these days. Last year was insane, and this year looks pretty insane too.

Could there be that there simply is... *ghasp*... Too many top quality productions these days?

Wow... We are lucky. May it never end!

Last edited by Beamboom on 2/7/2012 7:11:31 AM

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:01:29 AM

The used game market and piracy is *vastly* different and more significant now than at any time in the history of the industry.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:00:44 PM
Reply

I understand that it costs a ton, and a single game can be make or break for a studio but while developers aren't sitting in mansions, a**holes like Bobby Kotex ARE. We who buy used are not the actual problem.

Also, I'm sorry but if your game is not up to snuff I am not paying full price. So if you want to kill the used game market then I'll just wait until your game drops way down in retail or not buy it at all.

When I buy a game used, at least there's a chance I'll buy your next game new if I like it. If I can't, then you might not get my business. Used game sales are not lost new game sales in the long run.

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:28:38 AM

That's what I already do. lol. If a game isn't great, I don't buy it. The best way to manage cost is to maintain a backlog. I have an enormous backlog, and I probably only pay full price for 2 MAYBE 3 games in a whole year.

And I still haven't bought anything used less than 5 years old this gen. So it's completely possible to do.

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bigrailer19
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:45:42 PM

K, thanks...

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BikerSaint
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:54:55 AM

So what?

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Godslim
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 4:07:43 AM

whats ign......

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Beamboom
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 7:06:59 AM

I bet there are plenty other sites who report this too. News stories kinda do get distributed that way.


Last edited by Beamboom on 2/7/2012 7:08:32 AM

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:29:30 AM

WHAT?!?!!? Another video game site (with like a million times the resources as this one) reported the same news story on video games?!?!?!?!?! WHAT IS THIS WORLD COMING TO!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

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Pandacastro
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:33:43 PM

Do us a favor and stay there.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:57:14 PM

Hey, know what? GameStop mostly takes the weekend off for news, so I've seen news articles as their "Top Stories" on Monday when sites that can't AFFORD to take the weekend off had the same story on Saturday.

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Killa Tequilla
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:44:17 PM
Reply

How would you like it if you made this really awesome game that you put so much money in to it, sleepless night, sweat and tears... Then all of a sudden everyone pirated the game and you got little to no money from all that hard work you did. Its almost as if you just stopped a car to give it a car wash, you made sure every little detail in that car was as shinny as Benders metal ass and you got very little money from your hard labor. You'd be pissed. No work should be left unpayed. People who say they dont care if they buy used games dont care because it doesnt affect them directly when they purchase their game. Its hurting other people, not you, so why care?

If you go to google maps and search for the nearest gamestops around a 100 mile radius, I kid you not, you will see more gamestop stores than you see McDonalds. This my friends is pure, the pure-est proof there is that there is a lot of games that are selling used.

The devs are going to do something about it litle by little. Sony should open up a store, Sony'Stop, where you can buy all games new or used and the devs and publishers will get their cut for used game sales! Brilliant! But impossible? That my friends, is a question that remains a mistery.

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Gabriel013
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 1:00:31 AM

I agree with your comment that the publishers themselves should join together to open a used games franchise though looking at what they accuse gamestop of doing, they'd likely try charging $5 less than the new price.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:03:32 AM

Look at GameStop's financials. They are really careful how they categorize their revenue becuase the revenue (and profit) they make from used games is what makes GameStop tick. New game sales are profitable, but Gmaestop takes billions of dollars a year in used game sales that have an average profit margin of 150%.

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bigrailer19
Monday, February 06, 2012 @ 11:48:13 PM
Reply

I agree with him. But used game buying has been around for a long time and I just don't see a fair an legitimate way of combatting it. So life goes on.

The unfortunate thing is game making will continue to increase in cost, and if the price of games goes up so will used game buying. It could unfortunately be a doom and gloom situation. But it's not going to happen anytime soon. So carry on.

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___________
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:25:35 AM
Reply

we really just need to get stores paying developers for preowned sales and for rentals.
that way developers are getting paid for there work, and retailers are not being so greedy.
only reason i dont buy or trade games is because you get seriously ripped off!
i traded batman arkham city yesterday, a 2 month old game and i got 30 bucks for it!
THIRTY!
saw it in the store today, same store and they had 0 preowned copies when i traded it, for 80!
so there making a 50 dollar profit on it, now thats just BS!
10 bucks more then a brand new copy?
really?
why the ^%$# do people buy this shit, especially if its only 10 less?
retailers need to stop being so greedy, and give the developers a small percentage of what there making on preorders and rentals.
then theres rental services like gamefly, there free arent they?
so you get to play the game for what, a week?
for free?
thats piracy!
i can see why developers are so pissed about used games and rentals, its just not fair there not getting anything for there hard work, and those who sit behind a desk doing nothing get 50 bucks profit!
and thats on 1 transaction, what if another guy trades that game in and someone else buys it?
buy and sell the same game 20 times, the trade in and purchase price will stay the same.
my god these people are making a fortune for doing pluck all!

so, as he said.
was that 5 bucks you saved buying used really worth it?
tis why i cant understand buying games used.
you get a used game, which in all my cases has been so badly damaged they wont read.
then you take them back for another copy and they refuse saying oh how do we know you did not do that.
yea i deliberately scratched the disk so i can get another one.
sigh.
id far rather spend the extra 5 bucks and save the headache!
not to mention online passes, DLC, and preorder bonuses your missing out on.
point being buying used normally gets you 30+ bucks of content you would not get used!
and used is 10 bucks cheaper, 20 max ive ever seen.
so if anything your loosing money buying used, not saving it!

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shadowscorpio
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:56:10 AM
Reply

In the past it just seemed like this wasn't a problem. Almost like the new and used game industry were two seperate entities. As if to say the two just let each other be.

It wasn't until devs started paying attention to how much money the used game industry was reeling in. Maybe its simply because of the fact that game s this gen are so expensive to make?

I sincerely think that this gaming gen cannot be compared to previous gens. Too many different elements. I feel when moving forward, things have to be approached diffently. Conducting a full out attack on the UGI (used game industry)is goning to affect a certain level of consumers.

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Godslim
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 4:08:00 AM
Reply

im sorry did he say ONLY 60 dollars!

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:30:18 AM

Yup. I made that much earlier this morning. I'll make it a couple more times before the day is done, too. And it's not like I'm rich. I'm in an entry level professional position....

It isn't much.

Last edited by Underdog15 on 2/7/2012 11:31:10 AM

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dmiitrie
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:17:16 PM

It's been said before, but it apparently bears repeating: the price of games has remained relatively constant for the past 20 years, and when you compare that to how drastically the cost to make games has skyrocketed recently, I'd say people are justified in saying that games ONLY cost $60.

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:50:26 PM

I think they used to be even more expensive in Canada or something, because I remember buying Super Mario RPG brand new back in the day for like $100 or something.

But now that I say that, I feel like I'm starting to not remember things right...

Anyone know if I'm right or wrong there?

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Godslim
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:57:00 PM

im sorry but ps3 games new are too expensive especially for a short singleplayer game!

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Geobaldi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 3:20:34 PM

Gotta pay to play, as the old saying goes. Could always find a cheaper hobby, but gaming is one of the cheaper ones as it is.

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gumbi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 4:53:06 PM

Underdog. I don't think you're too far off. I live in Canada and I'm sure I got my parents to fork over $70+ for Donkey Kong Country back in the day. I could only rent Mario RPG, could never find it for sale at the stores in my hometown.

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 7:01:28 PM

@Gumbi
Yeah, That was a time when I would have tried to get my parents to help me out with buying games too. Most of what I got, I got with money for extra jobs around the house aside from chores. lol... most of my motivation as a kid/teenager was to buy the next game I wanted. lol

Man I wish all the money I made was still 100% disposable! lol

@godslim
I can understand for folks that have little money to spare, but I've always been of the thought that hobbies and entertainment are something extra... like, not necessities. When I didn't make any or little money, I rarely bought games and still played games a TON.

And compared to the other things I like to do, Video Games are pretty much the cheapest option out there when you break it down to a dollars-per-hour equation.

I'm with you in that I would never buy a game shorter than 10 hours for $60. I wait until it's on the cheap. But even a 10 hour game brand new works out to $6 an hour. And that's pretty much at a games most expensive point. In hindsight, that's pretty cheap if you compare to other hobbies like sports (registration costs and equipment) or golf or even movies. Buy a movie for $20, and it's like a $10 per hour investment! Brand new movies can be as much as $40 ($20 per hour). Compare that to a new game at $60, and I just have a hard time agreeing with you when comparing new to new.

But we're both approaching it from different angles, too. But my explanation is at least where I'm coming from.

Last edited by Underdog15 on 2/7/2012 7:03:55 PM

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Fane1024
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 4:19:59 AM

Underdog,
It's directly related to the exchange rate, which (as I'm sure you know) until very recently was nowhere near even as it has been for the last three or so years.

I remember $50 games being $70 CDN when the exchange rate was 1.40.

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Looking Glass
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 6:50:46 AM
Reply

For the record he did say "often" and not "always" (referring to non-million sellers that is). There are developers who have been doing just fine making lower budget games that cater largely to niche markets.

I think he's mainly referring to bigger budget titles which admittedly there seem to be quite a few of.

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jaybiv
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 8:03:14 AM
Reply

Used games are what's saving industry. Dudes are trading games in to buy newer ones. The developers need to quit bitching and perhaps look at how they can keep development costs down. Salaries is one area, but no one wants to take a pay cut. They should be happy they don't have the technological issues that the music industry is dealing with.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:08:02 AM

No, used games are the biggest threat after piracy. Right now in the PS3 world, used games are a bigger threat because of the limited success Sony has had with securing their platform.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:03:43 PM

"Limited"? Is there any piracy on the ps3 at all?

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Geobaldi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 3:23:24 PM

"Is there any piracy on the ps3 at all?"

Yes, the PS3 has been hacked a few times already, and I have seen pirated PS3 games for sale.

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pillz81
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 4:28:58 PM

There are also PS3 games up for download.

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gumbi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 10:00:37 AM
Reply

I'm still surprised that the industry hasn't shifted to a software activation model. Where you need to purchase a license to activate and use your software.

So, say the new $60 game comes with a license to activate your software. If you acquired the game disc through any other means you have to purchase a $5, $10, or $15 license from the publisher to activate it.

This wouldn't kill the used game market, but it would force it to change, to be fair. Instead of Gamestop selling you a used game for $50 and making a huge profit, they'd have to sell it to you for $35-$40. Then you buy a license from the publisher. It still costs you $50, you still save $10, and Gamestop only makes a $10 or $15 profit on the sale (about the same as the publisher). Or maybe the publishers could sell bulk licenses to Gamestop to be packaged and sold with used games. Either way, They both still make money.

Granted, this model is not without it's flaws. It could throw a bone in the game rental industry. They'd need some system of rental licenses that are only good for 5-7 days after activation. And trading games with friends wouldn't be free anymore.

I have to say though, I'm really getting sick of hearing the complaining on both sides of this argument.
Publishers/Developers: You can't keep doing the same thing over and over and hoping for different results. So either change the way you do business, or quit whining.
Gamestop: You didn't really expect this free ride to last forever did you?

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Underdog15
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 11:34:18 AM

I agree.

People should have the option to buy used. But it shouldn't hurt the developers, and I think places like Gamestop inflate the value of a used title FAR too much.

Incorporating activation fees would mean gamestop would have to sell for less (or include it, thus them paying the devs) and the final cost to consumers would be EXACTLY THE SAME.


People here like to act like you either have used game sales or NO used sales, and they fight for one side or the other. People forget there are always grey areas in reality.

Sure, we should keep used game sales as a viable option for people who can't afford it, but there can be no argument that the current used game sales model needs a face-lift.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 12:42:02 PM

This is what I've said since the beginning. If the Gamestops of the world worked with the publishers and devs to share the revenue, it would be a workable situation. bu they don't, and won't and the publishers *have* tried to bring them to the table. GameStop simply won't talk. So the publishers are left with few choices. The trouble with the entire discussion is that people think that things like online passes are an attack on consumers. They are not, they are an attempt to reclaim some of the huge revenue pie that GameStop are keeping to themselves.

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gumbi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 2:48:28 PM

I'm sure the publishers have tried to work out a deal with the Gamestops. But lets be honest, unless someone forces their hand, Gamestop ain't sharing. They make too much money off used games and see no benefit in giving any of it away. It's a goldmine for them.

The only way publishers are going to get a piece of the used game pie is to take matters into their own hands. They need a system of controlling who can, and can't, use their software. Nobody is going to pay $50 for a used game if it'll cost them another $10-$15 for a license to play it. This would force Gamestop to lower their prices on used games. Yes, that means their trade in values will be lower too, but they'll still have to cut their profit margins. It would be more like it used to be.

The thing is, a change like this would make very little difference to the consumer's bottom line. You'll still be able to buy used games, and it'll still cost you about the same when all's said and done. The only difference is that you'll be supporting both the retailer AND the game developers.

Instead of trying to work out deals with Gamestop, which will just never happen. Pubs and Devs need to appeal to the major console makers and work on getting firmware updates that support software licensing. Take the uncooperative Gamestops right out of the equation by forcing the market change upon them.

I understand that, technically, this would be difficult to implement. But if they're not willing to take such measures then nothing is going to change. Used game retailers are simply not going to play this game unless they are forced to. So force them.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 3:36:28 PM

Welcome to the darkside Gumbi. Underdog and I have been saying exactly that for what seems like years now. Every time one of these stories comes up people complain about it being anti consumer. Yet it's not. Gamestop will still have to give a fair trade value for used games otherwise people will sell them directly on Ebay o whatever. GameStop will have to bundle online passes with games free otherwise there would be no reason for someone to buy the user game. Gamestop sure aren't going to bump up the price of a used game considering it's already charging high prices for them. So in the end the consumer gets the same trade price, and buys used for the same price, and some of the revenue goes to publishers. The only change from today is that GameStop is no longer able to drive 150% profit margins. I don't see how this is in any way anti-consumer.

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gumbi
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 4:12:03 PM

Always liked the dark side better anyway. We have cookies.

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Highlander
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 @ 9:00:43 PM

Double Chocolate Chip, but their going fast...personally I'm holding out for the milk chocolate covered shortbread...

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Darwin1967
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 @ 2:23:40 PM
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But he adds that such content has to be "compelling and a good enough value."....well there you go. Game designers continually develop titles are basically good for 'one play'...I loved Red Dead Redemption, and would STILL be playing it if they would release additional DLC...but nada, nothing. It's like they put out a game a little bit of DLC then move on....nothing makes a gamer want to hold onto a game when you can't do anything more.

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 @ 7:33:28 PM

Perhaps.

But that's not the real issue at hand here.

The point isn't that used sales are bad. It's that the used market needs to be fixed. Used game companies like Gamestop make all the money. Both gamers and developers could be better off with a reform of best practices.

That's more the point: The used game market shouldn't die. It just needs to be fixed. (And I personally believe gamers would continue to, at the end of the day, pay the same amount they pay now.

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RobN
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 11:26:43 AM
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You want my business, rather than watching me buy from the used market? Discount.

I get the bonus content for preorders. I get the online pass. I get all that. But I simply can't afford to buy all the games I'd like to buy. I won't stoop to piracy -- the debate over that is different than the used market, and I support any effort to stamp it out -- but when I can't afford the games I want when they're discounted to $30, I sure can't justify spending $60 for a single game.

If I buy a Blu-Ray movie, I might pay $25 for a new release -- wait six months, and it will probably be $15 or less. They put a ton of resources and millions of dollars into their product as well (though to be fair, they make money off more than retail sales).

So I wait until you come out with a discounted GotY edition, with a bunch of premium content thrown in and the whole thing sold for $20-30. If you're not going to do that in 6-12 months after release, then I'm going to go buy it used for $20. If you don't like it, then you must not want my money -- at least not at that price.

Don't complain about the demand curve -- it's not going away. Adapt to it or watch your sales go to those who will.

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patv3dgamer
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 12:24:21 PM
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I think all of you are getting the wrong idea from what was said. He didn't say that all games should be new. He is not saying buying a used game is bad. What is being said is Gamestop should give a portion of used game sells to developers. Only brand new games give developers profit. Gamestop is taking the profits from the rightful creaters of the content. You people that are saying games cost too much now days. You do not realize how much the media cost. DVD-R DL=$8/disk BD(25G)= $10/disk BD(50G)=$30/disk. Microsoft is getting a huge profit margin on media by the way.

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Ather
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 2:35:44 PM
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The problem is, the content makers believe to downright pathological levels that everybody who buys used, or illegaly downloads, would have happily bought new if there was no other option. But most wouldn't have. Buying used, downloading can help turn people into new customers. Say you buy Uncharted 2 used. You play it, you like it. Boom. Now you want to go out and play the 3rd. So you buy it new, get dlc's, etc. Had you not bought used, you'd never would be into the series. You might have taken money from them for 2 (depending on availability), but you clearly gave them money for 3. Same for CD's. Download an album, like it, buy the next album. No download, no buy, ever! Gte rid of these things, and you still lose customers.

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Supagudg
Thursday, February 09, 2012 @ 3:16:25 PM
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What appears to be the problem, is the flooding of the market with games, which is great for those of us who can afford, financially and time-wise, the costs of playing them all. However, broke college students, among others, don't generally have that luxury.

The unfortunate problem is that the games are "too good" and come out too often. This is NOT a complaint, but an observation of the nature of this--and many--art forms. When developers, of their own volition, pump millions of dollars into the realization of their own aesthetic, they are doing something which fundamentally defies "business sense." This is both beautiful and inefficient.

The rules of supply and demand always apply, art or not. No matter how many awesome games a developer releases, they will get less from it if consumers have to pick and choose too much, based on affordability. Either the production cost, the price, or the availability of these products have to change.

After all, it is not the consumer's job to make sure the developer makes a profit; it is the developer's job to convince the consumer to buy new.

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