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Could Late PS3 Games Compete Visually With Xbox 720 Titles?

Straddling game generations is always interesting from a software standpoint.

For example, let's say for the sake of argument that the Xbox 720 comes out well before the PlayStation 4 (which at this point doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility). Might it be possible that late-generation PS3 titles will compete graphically with the new Xbox games?

Of course, we have no idea how powerful Microsoft's new machine might be, so this question could be absurd. But for the time being, I think it's quite obvious that the PS3 is head-and-shoulders above the 360 in terms of exhibited graphics potential. Nothing on the 360 (and I've played the best that system has to offer) can even come close to competing with the last two Uncharteds, for instance, and I think games like God of War III and Heavy Rain have helped set the current generation bar as well. I think that's a given.

And in the future, we have the amazing-looking God of War: Ascension, Beyond: Two Souls, and The Last Of Us, the latter of which easily blows away anything on the 360 at this point. Then we might see more impressive graphical productions in other PS3 exclusives like Killzone 4, Gran Turismo 6, and Metal Gear Solid 5. All of that is only speculation, of course, but if they all came out for the PS3 when the Xbox 720 was on store shelves...I mean, would it be totally out of bounds to make the comparison? Or will the new Xbox just be that much more powerful than the PS3?

Let's not forget that late-gen PS2 games made launch titles for that system look like crap; Final Fantasy XII, Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater and God of War II were damn impressive; I often wonder how much more developers could've gotten out of the PS2...

Tags: ps3, playstation 3, new xbox, xbox 720, ps3 games, next gen

8/21/2012 9:04:08 PM Ben Dutka

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Comments (76 posts)

WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 9:34:18 PM
Reply

In a word, yes.

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LimitedVertigo
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 10:56:30 PM

No way.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:04:46 PM

At the very least it should compete with launch titles.

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Neo_Aeon666
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:10:34 AM

I think World is right. When talking about visuals, we are talking about a lot of things.

I do not think even the latest PS3 titles will compete with the 720 in terms of screen and texture resolution but, I am pretty sure the effects, the mood, the animation, the art direction and modelisation of key characters in games like Beyond and The Last of Us will still be on par or way superior to the first few efforts that will release on the 720. A quality production remains quality even if the competition released stronger hardware. Look at the Wii. Somehow their way *graphically underwhelming games* still get 9s and up in the graphics category lol. That is because of the art direction and how you feel when you play it.

Any1 agree?

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:27:48 AM

@Neo:
Mood, art direction and stuff like that has very little to do with technology, that's artistry. Just look at Limbo... It could have been a game played on your mobile, yet it's one of the most atmospheric games I've played in quite a while.

So from an artistic point of view there's plenty of games on the PS3 that will beat many titles that will come out for the PS4. Just like earlier generations.

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 8:32:44 AM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:39:27 AM

Here's the thing, the games on 720 are going to be almost exclusively multiplat (if I may create that phrase) and so they would be on PS3 too (if PS4 doesn't launch at the same time) so they will be comparable.

Any 720 actual exclusives wouldn't yet be taking full advantage of the hardware. So 2+2=4.

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wiiplay
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:19:53 AM

As a game developer myself, I have to agree with Neo_Aeon666's point of view. The current generation of video game engines and capture technologies allow for the PlayStation 3 to render graphical levels that can, in theory, match that of a true next generation console, such as the Xbox 720 and even the PlayStation 4.
However, that would greatly limit the PS3 to rendering a single area of the game at next gen quality, which would, in turn, greatly reduce the graphical detail to the other in-game objects, most specifically the textures that the game uses.

So, even though the PS3 is capable of matching next generation quality graphics, developers would be required to focus on one specific detail of the game, in one specific rendering area, thus reducing the graphical balance. In the end, applying next generation graphics to a current generation machine is, although technically possible in certain areas of development, no way a wise developmental decision, and would result in reduced detail to other aspects of the game, such as the game worlds or character models.

However, that isn't to say that comparing current generation technologies with the next generation isn't going to be fair. Early game engines for new hardware and configurations tend to borrow heavily from last generation code, as to avoid a complete rewrite of the engine for the new hardware.
Therefore, if the developers are lazy, and not much time was put into the next generation engines, it is quite possible that the next generation graphics of early launch titles could in fact look very similar to current generation video games. Although I highly doubt Microsoft would allow this kind of lazy design, especially not for a brand new next generation console, the possibility is still, technically, there.

Anyways, good article Ben. I love reading about this kind of stuff. :)

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:24:42 PM

@wiiplay: It's correct what you write but your conclusion is kinda loses all logic. When A PS3 can only render a single area at PS4 level, at the expense of the entire rest of the scene those two renderings are not in any way equal or even comparable.

It's like me claiming that my drawings are photo realistic just because I'm good at drawing realistic eyebrows. That doesn't make my entire drawing equal to a photograph.

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 1:25:48 PM

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wiiplay
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 2:56:12 PM

@Beamboom: The PlayStation 3 does not have the power to completely utilize next generation resource requirements, but can theoretically produce realistic next generation graphical details if these details are applied to a specific gameplay aspect, such as character models.
Producing realistic next-gen quality character models that are 'true to life' would take up a large amount of the processing capabilities of the PlayStation 3, therefore, it would only be able to render certain elements at a time without any kind of serious performance problems.

So, although your eyebrow analogy is, more or less, accurate, you seemed to miss the initial point, which was, quite simply, if the PS3 were to render a certain aspect of the game at next-generation quality graphics, the other aspects of the game would have to be greatly limited, as to maintain stable performances.

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YashaZz
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 5:17:09 PM

Theoretically, no.
But the fact that PS3 is the colossus of it's time would make the future 2013 releases look like next gen titles.

There is chance they will look AS GOOD as 720, if not better.

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xenris
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 5:26:07 PM

No, if the 720 is easy to program for and similar to a PC then there are going to be devs out there who use the new cryengine, and Unreal engine 4 to make games that even the PS3 can't come close to matching.

Remember how awesome the Final Fantasy Agni engine looks? That is in game real time, I saw the video where they paused, moved the camera fiddled with things etc.

If the games coming out on the 720 look even close to that then they already have the PS3 beat.

The question is, are launch titles going to be this visually impressive? I think they have to, otherwise why will people buy a new console? There has to be a selling point, and I think insane graphics is going to be part of it.

Just my two cents

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DIsmael85
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 10:12:53 PM
Reply

I love my PS3, has great things to come for sure, but if the quickness of technology has any meaning I will say no the last PS3 games will not be able to compete graphically. As for story and what we get with PS3 titles that'll be the deciding factor. I foresee that the next Xbox will just milk old franchises, while the devs with Sony will just continue to bring new ideas and stories. My take on it anyway.

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Temjin001
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 10:35:53 PM
Reply

My prediction for the next Xbox has me thinking somewhere along the lines of this:
x86 AMD CPU (custom Windows 8 OS)
AMD GPU
4 GB Ram
Hi capacity memory stick storage for games, similar to Vita.
No optical drive
Kinect with every box

I believe MS is looking to encroach on Nintendo's turf by bundling a Kinect with every Xbox, but leveraging the value of "family" entertainment that comes in more forms than just games, Xbox LIVE content services. I also see MS making it powerful enough to please their hardcore base.

PS4
PPC cpu
Nvidia GPU with massive CUDA cores
4GB+ of ram
Blu Ray
BD Media

I predict the PS4 will trump the next Xbox from a power stand point. I believe Sony is well aware that much of their PS3 base recognizes the PS3 as a higher powered machine, capable of more premium products. I don't think they'll let go of this ethos and will want to transition as many PS3 owners smoothly to the PS4 and continue to grow an eco-system of franchises that will promise strong returns in sales, making them less contigent on 3rd party partners.




Last edited by Temjin001 on 8/21/2012 10:37:32 PM

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Ludakriss
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:11:33 AM

Man I feel ignorant. Well, I am but just on that one word - contigent?

Otherwise. Machines of such power, evidently won't even come close to running the Unreal 4 Engine but, will be pretty entertaining.

I have to say though. A lot of more mature players, by the sound of it, you are one of them. They mostly make Sony sound like it's the elder brother of games, you know?

Last edited by Ludakriss on 8/22/2012 8:12:23 AM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 10:47:04 PM
Reply

I still think that there is a chance that Sony will counter any 720 (or whatever) hype with a treasure trove of AAAA exclusives followed 6 months to a year later by the PS4 with even more, plus PS3 compatibility. Not sure how big a chance it is, but there is a chance...

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WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:05:20 PM

There better be PS3 B/C

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Temjin001
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:17:52 PM

I agree. I want all of my PSN only crap to come over to PS4, sooner or later. I'd say after this next-gen, it just might not be worth it anymore to uproot and restart anymore. I don't like the idea of out with the old, in with the new for every console generation.

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Kall555
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:53:08 AM

@TheHighlander,

I agree with what you say here. Most of the time launch line-ups are fairly standard anyway. I mean, both PS3 & 360 didn't have very enticing launch games at all that would justify the quick purchase & if the PS3 can capitalize on this with some end-console cycle PS3 exclusives of their own before they let their new model out of the door then that would be a very good start for them coming into the new gen.

As you say, it's a chance. & when we're seeing games like God of War Ascension, Beyond, The Last of Us & *maybe, hopefully* The Last Guardian (if it still exists) in 2013, it is a very realistic possibility that this could happen. It would be a very smart move by SONY to do this.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 2:32:48 AM

I would kill for ps3 compatibility.
But if the rumored architectural change is true then I don't see how that could be realistically done.
Unfortunately!

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 3:14:24 AM

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stay3r1337
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 7:50:48 AM

@Ben Dutka: Are you a complete idiot? Naughty Dog achieved that on ps3 because of their sheer talent and by efficiently using ps3's power. Not all the studios has time and money to do that. In terms of raw power even the Xbox 360 GPU is way more powerful than the ps3's one. Ps3's cell processor is a double edged sword. Not all developers are capable of taking advantage of that CPU and thus we see similar or subpar graphics on multivplatform games. I've been buying/selling/tuning pc for the past 13 years and I know what I'm talking about. If Microsoft had a talented studio like naughty dog 360 would have pretty games like uncharted too. Soo no! It's not possible because it's a generation gap which seems like something way beyond the learning capability of your brain.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:41:18 AM

If you've been alive more than 13 years you should know better than to insult the guy who runs the site. My opinion.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 9:21:20 AM

@stay3r1337: I agree with the essence of what you say there, but that form of communicating has no place around here. Take that attitude with you to somewhere else, or try to communicate like an adult.

Unless that's way beyond the learning capability of your brain.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:07:14 PM

stay3r1337: Half of what you say is completely wrong, the other half means you can't communicate as a mature adult.

Either way, here's a warning and shut up.

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Leafs25
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 10:52:44 PM
Reply

PS3 is great but to compare 7 plus year year old hardware to the rumored 720 specs would be absurd. No offense but your talking like the ps3 completely demolishes the 360 in terms of graphics. Ps3 has the edge but not by a landslide.

This gen wont compare to next gen in terms of graphics.

And really. just think about it. I know we all love our ps3, but to even suggest that games might look as good as compared to the 720 is 100% Fanboy. Even though we don't know the specs yet.

Last edited by Leafs25 on 8/21/2012 10:58:15 PM

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 4:22:28 AM

Resolution won't change much Leaf. Photo-realistic graphics at 1080i/720p don't look that much better at 1080p. So unless the NextBox comes with a 2160p screen, it's limited to playing in the same ball park as the PS3.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:08:37 AM

The instant you use the word "fanboy" you disqualify yourself from intelligent conversation. Children use the word. Not adults.

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kay Oss
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 11:04:02 AM

I think you are forgetting on crucial thing about your argument. The reason why most current games on the ps3 and xbox is comparable is because they are multiplatform games. Most games are develope on the xbox because it will be easier to port to the ps3. Its harder to port a game developed on the PS3 to the xbox because of the different in power. If developers goes all out to develope on the PS3, that game would be very hard to port to the xbox. If you look at exclusive games between the xbox and the ps3 you can clearly see the different in graphics between the two systems. I might be wrong but from what i see the PS3 may look as good as "early 720" games. I honestly have to say that developers have not fully tapped into the full potential of the ps3. Just look at beyond two souls... if I didnt know better I would think its a next gen game.

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Kiryu
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:02:42 PM
Reply

Could Xbox 360 games compete aganist PS3 titles.

Could Xbox 360 games compete aganist early PS Vita titles.

Seeing how it went.I'm sure late PS3 titles can surely outbeat early next gen games.

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Leafs25
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:04:18 PM

I don't get your logic.

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Temjin001
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:19:50 PM

I think in production and overall quality, yes. We'll see this a lot, I think. The next systems will surely bring their inherent processing strengths to the fore right from the beginning (1080p and many effects). But I think overall production quality and execution will take some time for the new system's to eclipse the old by the majority of content providers.

Last edited by Temjin001 on 8/21/2012 11:21:37 PM

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Kall555
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:56:27 AM

@Kiryu,

What?

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 2:46:43 AM

Hehe - wow.

Could x360 games compete with PS#? Obviously, yes.
Could x360 games compete against Vita titles? Uhm... Dude?

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jimmyhandsome
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:41:55 AM

Have you ever played an Xbox 360 game? The Ps3 certainly has it beat, but it's not exactly night and day.

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:52:24 PM

All things being equal, assuming that the same game is implemented on PS3 and 360 and that the dev team for each properly optimizes the programming and design for the platform, the PS3 will beat the 360 more or less every time.

On the other hand, the Vita, as amazing as it is doesn;t have the hardware to compete with the 360. But...it's a closer match than you think simply because the core designs in the Vita are 7 years more advanced than the 360's hardware. Quad core CPU vs tri-core CPU. 360 has higher clock, but quad arms are more efficient per clock cycle, the 360 is still faster, but not by as much as you expect. The quad core GPU in the Vita is a compeltelty different animal to that in the 360, I'm not aware of a way to compare their hardware and/or performance directly. However, each of the GPU cores in vita has multiple units on board. Much like the CPU comparison, I suspect that the 360 still has it beat, but not by as much as you think. The Vita and 360 have similar amounts of RAM, so that's a wash.

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Leafs25
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:49:06 PM

@ Ben, the instant you say '' I think it's quite obvious that the PS3 is head-and-shoulders above the 360 in terms of exhibited graphics potential'' is well, I hate to say it, but i have too, fanboyish.

We all know the ps3 has the edge in terms of graphics, but heads and shoulders is a big over statement.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:56:39 PM

Quit with the PC game police. It's hardly an exaggeration at all. The Last Of Us makes the 360 look like a last-gen piece of hardware, plain and simple. And as for current available hardware, both of the last two Uncharteds are doing things no 360 software ever dreamed of.

None of that has anything to do with bias. I can see. I have eyes.

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sirbob6
Tuesday, August 21, 2012 @ 11:36:14 PM
Reply

Well, considering late PS2 games could compete with launch PS3 games it wouldn't really be that out of line.

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matt99
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:19:41 AM

No they couldn't, not graphically at least. I can't count how many times I died in Resistance and CoD because I was just looking at the stunning visuals. In terms of overall game quality then yes, late ps2 games could easily compete. But there was a very clear step up in graphics (as there should be).

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kraygen
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:20:17 AM
Reply

I'd say it's definitely possible. People keep mentioning rumored specs for the 720, but in truth we don't know what it will have.

Even if the new specs are fantastic you have to consider that games will probably still be on dvd which means any spectacular graphics would require either pc like installs or more discs than Microsoft is willing to allow.

Plus you have to consider that most consoles launch titles aren't graphically that much better than the previous gen's late titles.

Therefore considering 360's graphics have been maxed out for years devs multi-platform games will probably play on ps3 if the 720 comes out first. As for exclusives who cares how good halo for 720 looks.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:57:54 AM

I've read several places that the next Xbox will feature a blu-ray drive. It's the only natural thing to do too, so I'd be surprised if that were not the case.

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kraygen
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:41:49 PM

Hearing a rumor from multiple people doesn't make it true. MS once said they would never use blu-ray in their console, so I'm still waiting to see if they're willing to pay the blu-ray association.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:20:17 PM

lol - dude, you can't seriously mean that you believe Microsoft will release a new console without the capability to playback HD movies? The blu-ray format is the new standard format now. It's got the same status as the DVD had back when the x360 were designed.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:45:54 AM
Reply

I guess that during the transition period from one generation to another there will be a few titles that in practise are X360 ports.

But the X720 will be able to play games like Battlefield 4 and Crysis 3 in a quality the PS3 will never be able to even think about doing. That's what matters here.

I believe the latest screenshots from the next GTA was an indicator of what kind of a leap we can expect - and that even from a game who traditionally can't be a graphics showcase, due to its size. It would not surprise me the slightest if GTA5 were a launch title with the X720.


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 12:56:41 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:09:39 AM

You are putting WAY too much stock in what we see at the start of a new hardware cycle.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:30:55 PM

Am I really?

If we assume that the next consoles has a performance that at least has a performance that is *comparable* with high end PCs on launch day - and I really, really hope they will be - then we already know the gap between Battlefield 3 on consoles compared to the PC footage we had seen.

Now, have you seen that latest ingame video snippet from Crysis 3, with the protagonist appearing over the hill? If that is, as they claim, realtime rendered then I believe we've already seen what we can expect at the start of the next hardware cycle. I can guarantee you that Crytek are working on their engine for the next gen consoles as we speak.

Add to that the GTA5 screens who obviously are rendered on current technology and we got two examples of titles that in each their way represent the level of technology *today*. Is the PS4/X720 even in production yet?

So no, I don't think I've put too much stock in what we will see at the start for the next console generation at all! I expect Crysis 3 / GTA 5 quality to be where we begin with the AAA titles on next gen.

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 1:56:36 PM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:55:20 PM

Yeah, you really have. Just trust me.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:04:21 PM

But what exactly are you saying here?

Do you think that the PS4 version of GTA5 (if there will be one, of course) will not look as good as the PC version? Or if Crysis 3 are released for the PS4, do you think it will then look and play worse than the PC version we see video from today?

If the PS4 versions looks like something that could just as well have been released on the PS3 I have to say I will be very disappointed...!


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 3:05:03 PM

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Underdog15
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 9:18:12 PM

Looking back in history, I think there's some merit there, Beam. Early PS1 games looked really bad... like... REALLY bad. Some SNES games looked cleaner and crisper. MUCH more, in fact. Same with PS2... early PS2 games were crap too. For the entire first year. And the same thing happened with PS3. And in all cases, (Xbox included, although it's got no where as much history) late gen of the old gen was almost always better than the early games of the newer gen.

Some of the late PS1 stuff was way better than anything PS2 offered in it's first year. Same with PS1 and the SNES or Genesis before it. And the PS3's first year was very slow as well (although Resistance: Fall of Man seems to be an exception).

Clearly, the 720 will be a better all-around spec. system than the PS3 (At least it sure as hell better be), but I don't think it should be surprising to anyone for the better late PS3 games to look and play better than the early games of the next gen. Late XBOX games looked better than early 360 games too, ya know. Each gen seems to have an initial year FULL of "meh". PSP was the same, and the VITA is doing that too. PSP turned out to be pretty impressive for it's time, and the VITA will likely do the same.

SO far, nothing that's happened is all that surprising, and I wouldn't be surprised if that trend continued with this gen just as it has all past gens.

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Beamboom
Thursday, August 23, 2012 @ 5:34:50 AM

I think I understand what you guys mean; It takes some time before the new hardware really shines. I just think both of you underestimate these years gone by during the lifespan of the current gen consoles.

And please notice, I do not in any way say that what we see at first of the next generation will be anything like how the games will be on those platforms a few years later.

All I am saying is that GTA5 and Crysis 3 both shows what current hardware *today* can do. And if the next consoles are roughly based on todays technology then it should be pretty safe to assume that those mentioned titles will look like what we've seen today. And that is a *significant* improvement from the current consoles. Especially Crysis 3. That videoclip I refer to here (I posted it on the forums a while back) is simply mindblowing.



Last edited by Beamboom on 8/23/2012 5:35:26 AM

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Vivi_Gamer
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 2:20:24 AM
Reply

Do you remember the 360's launch, it was just full of last gen titles like Call of Duty 2, Gun or Tony Hawks: American Wasteland. Meanwhile I was getting Final Fantasy XII (Even though I hated it), Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence, Devil May Cry 3: Special Edition & Kingdom Hearts II. People tend to forget how bad the 360 started off too.

Even if XBOX does start of early, look at the PS3 now, it is a far more powerful and of course has the Blu-ray!

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matt99
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:24:11 AM
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If the PS3 can compete then microsoft f**ked up.

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slugga_status
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 7:35:03 AM

^ This

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___________
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 5:47:02 AM
Reply

hell no!
freaking resistance had better graphical effects than GOW2!
obviously depends on how much of a leap next gen systems are, and how much time developers get to work on the games, and also more importantly if there alien tech like usual $ony systems or more conventional.
however that said ill eat my hat if ps4 launch games look worse than ps3 late games!
especially if uncharted 4 releases as a launch title!
the last of us looks amazing, so imagine what ND could do with a new system!


Last edited by ___________ on 8/22/2012 5:47:41 AM

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slugga_status
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 7:37:10 AM
Reply

If we're talking graphics I'm going to say no..If we're talking about quality I'd have to say yes..If the PS3 can even hold a candle to the next Xbox then it's clear that somebody screwed up over there

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:45:24 AM
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I think people might be giving MS a little bit much of a pass, the games out of the gate won't take full advantage of the hardware. There doesn't seem to be much left of the internal studios there. And if it launches first we can expect multiplats to be about the same; you know? Those games that make up 99% of what's available now?

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DIsmael85
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 9:20:34 AM

If that is the case then you can expect those multiplat games to look and play just as well as the PC counterpart which will make people go jump onto it. This is why PC gamers look down on console gamers they have better hardware. Like I said in my post, MS will probably(may already) have their first party teams churning out 720 games. They will most likely milk old franchises to increase sales and those games will have to look good because 1. they will be on new hardware and 2. they want sales.

Persona 4 was one of the PS2's last rpg's and to this day I still play it because it has way more content and a better story than most of all the RPG's that have been released this gen. If Sony can keep busting out unique and awesome games, graphics will not matter much as the content and what we get from the game. This will be their saving grace until they release the inevitable PS4. Just my 2 cents.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 9:44:07 AM

Dismael got the essential point here:
Since the X720 share architecture with the PC, it gets a head start right from the get go. The developers can continue with the experience they've already gathered during development for the PC the last years.
This is why also the X360 owners were able to enjoy software that used the hardware potential so much sooner than we could on the PS3 (something that I personally with no reservation find to be solely a Good Thing).

This is yet another good argument for using a more standardized architecture. It simply gives better software faster!


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 9:55:07 AM

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:12:19 AM

If developers were able to do so much with the 360 out of the gate, we would've gotten MUCH better games earlier on. Compare Gears 3 to the first Gears, for example. Look at the 360's launch titles. What, Kameo? I mean, there's no doubt that a PC-like architecture has always given MS the edge in the console business and yet, that has NOT resulted in superior graphics in any way, shape or form.

We also have no idea what the 720 specs will be like. It's very possible they could go more casual; MS WOULD do that considering they want the biggest market possible.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 11:32:40 AM

You guys kind of made my point for me, just because the PC style of the 720 hardware is available doesn't mean the devs making multiplats will have the capability to take full advantage of it.

And just because MS is grinding out titles as fast as they can from their minute number of internal studios won't make them graphics powerhouses.

I expect they will have an edge visually, but that doesn't mean there's no competition from the other side. We should all remember that the final big budget games on Sony hardware are always quite stunning and usually look a full generation better than the launch titles.

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:02:36 PM

Well, given that most 360 games don't even render close to 720 and are scaled to 720/1080, I think we can start being a little more critical here.

On a broader note, MS is veering away from the PC with Windows 8. During the 360 generation, multi-platform devs had the 360 Dev kits which mirrored the more closed and proprietary Windows dev environments to a large extent, making it easier for devs to work on 360 if they had Windows experience, and easier for them to port resources back and forth. The PS3 is based on completely different and more open standards approach to APIs and Dev tools. That was part of the reason for the poor start for Ps3 multi-platform versions and the slow increase in quality.

However Windows 8 is currently looking like a drastic change in direction from Microsoft. It's heavily tablet focused, and even business users are beginning to get antsy about it. Some haven't switched to Windows 7 from XP yet, and to them Windows 8 is a completely foreign environment. However that focus on tablets (Microsoft wants to make their own) and what looks like MS trying to emulate Apple with a more closed environment in general, looks like it will orphan current PC gamers with Windows 7 and not a lot beyond - except the NextBox. The point being that there won't be developers that are heavily involved in Windows/PC games that can easily transition to the NextBox.

I'd say that the next generation of gaming will move further away from hardcore PC gaming towards casual gaming on touch devices with shovel-ware or flash based games that adopt the freemium approach of micro-transactions every time you fart. At the same time as that, there will be a more hardcore, premium gaming market based on dedicated gaming devices that will focus on traditional gamers and casual gamers alike. These next consoles will be more than capable of playing the stuff that tables can do, but the tablets will be poor substitutes for consoles with the more hardcore games.

I think that in this potential future, some of the advantage that MS had with the 360 is gone because of MS' own movement away from traditional PCs. I expect that they will use more and more bribery to obtain exclusivity in the future.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:16:39 PM

So Highlander you think MS is just following the money and will likely move away from hardcore gaming?

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DIsmael85
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:43:46 PM

I will say this, if the rumor of the next xbox having Blu-ray in it is real, then they will be able to use more to create more. This was Sony's advantage I believe with this gen since the PS3 was and is the only console that uses Blu-ray as it's medium. Microsoft screwed themselves by not advancing their Disc format to the HD-DVD at the time, but with the way things were back then when it launched it was rather pricey to stick that in their console. Sony took a huge risk and while the system has come a long way it did initially bite them in the rear.

Fast forward to today, where Blu-ray prices have leveled out and it's no longer a wallet breaking expense to own them. Best time for the console tech to advance. Sony will have to bring out PS4 to compete it's only normal. Putting down MS's first party studios for experimenting back when the 360 launched is pretty low, because if you look at them now they have advanced. If they keep the PC architect and use blu-ray as their medium and their games will look a hell of a lot better than anything out. Though like a lot of you have stated, we don't know the specs of the system we can only guess and debate from what is available via rumors and speculation. Maybe Microsoft will drop the ball really hard, but to deny the competition really won't help any game dev or anyone advance. We'll just end up with the same crap anyway.

Last edited by DIsmael85 on 8/22/2012 1:44:37 PM

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 2:02:18 PM

Microsofts choice with Win8 is a bold one. I am very, very curious as to where that will play out.

But I seriously doubt they will make their X-box more casual. I think it's *much* more likely that they try to make their own tablet, "Surface", their mainstream gaming platform.

No, you should all expect the Xbox to be a formidable competitor to Sony also in the next generation.

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/22/2012 2:03:25 PM

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 6:02:48 PM

I agree Beamboom, the nextBox will not be a casual gamer system, that is where MS wants the tablet to go - IMHO, as I said;


I'd say that the next generation of gaming will move further away from hardcore PC gaming towards casual gaming on *touch devices* with shovel-ware or flash based games that adopt the freemium approach of micro-transactions every time you fart. At the same time as that, there will be a more hardcore, premium gaming market based on *dedicated gaming devices* that will focus on traditional gamers and casual gamers alike. These next consoles will be more than capable of playing the stuff that tables can do, but the tablets will be poor substitutes for consoles with the more hardcore games.

Tablets will be the primary form factor for casual gaming, and I would include the Vita in that since it is a touch device and essentially a small tablet with game controls. Home consoles - aka the nextBox and PS4 will be more focused on games and traditional gamers than the touch devices, but that new casual gaming segment is increasingly important and both major console makers will address that market with their next console in addition to the traditional gamers.

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jimmyhandsome
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:02:40 AM
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This is a very awkward question as we really have no idea of the specs for the next Xbox. But a few things:

1) MS would've really f***ed up (as others have said) if late gen PS3 titles look as good as Xbox 720 launch titles

2) I will be very disappointed in the next gen (at least WiiU and Xbox 720) if the launch titles for both consoles don't seperate themselves from this gen

3) I will be hesitant to even purchase a PS4 any time early in it's life, if titles that are made for both PS4 and Xbox720 look like "The Last of Us"

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Fane1024
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:13:37 PM

WiiU isn't next-gen. It's at best marginally more powerful than the PS3 (really the 360, but with 3x the RAM).

If the PS4 and 720 aren't *greatly* superior to the WiiU, then there is no next generation.

Last edited by Fane1024 on 8/22/2012 10:21:42 PM

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wackazoa
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 10:45:14 AM
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This is not an insult to you Ben. You are doing your job.


But I wish this stuff would quit ! All this speculation is tiresome. Why cant Microsoft and Sony just admit the new systems are here, give us the specs, then give some date for when they are to hit the shelves. This crap where they dont confirm the existence of these systems are real, it's like they are school yard children waiting to show up the other "mean" kid.

It would be nice to know what each side is giving us so we can have true debates on which system is better (I dont really care about hardware so much as the games themselves). Dammit just let us know what we already know to be true !


And tell me when the next Killzone is coming out...... please.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 12:09:09 PM

It's nothing new. It's what they've always done. The Internet has generated a legion of spoiled brats who want to know everything the instant a whisper is heard.

I don't see why Sony or Microsoft should say anything if the systems are literally years away. On the other hand, if they're coming out in 6 months and we still haven't heard anything, I'd have a problem with that. But I seriously doubt that's the case.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:18:54 PM

Talking about the next generation gins up too much interest in it which harms sales of current-gen hardware. Also devs may have their dev kits but I'd bet my eye that the final specs of both consoles are still subject to change.

I understand your eagerness though.

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wackazoa
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 1:41:45 PM

Well maybe then they could come out with a timetable for when the next gen systems where to come out. Say "We still feel that the PS3 is capable for the next 2 years, beyond well we shall let you know." That would work because then we would know which games are for next gen...

Plus not to mention the price increase of the system, games (if we go by precedent from the last 2 systems) and peripherals. In a bad enconomy I have to seriously save to get a next gen. (I know I dont matter much in the grand scheme) But just look at the Vita, besides what they say I dont think it has done as well as they want and its maybe half the price of a next gen system.

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Ignitus
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:25:44 PM
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Ha, what a joke.

Naughty Dog can produce that kind of games with Sony's time and money and are the exception rather than the rule. Also, the visual diferences are not that great or stunning, the diference is marginal.

The rest of the PS3 games even struggle to match the performance of the xbox 360 versions. What makes you think they can outperform the even more powerful 720, which also happens to have a better development tools and enviroment?

This is just wishfull thinking for not to say pure fanboyism.

I'm more interested in how the PS4/720 will fare relative to each other.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 7:38:42 PM

So...in other words, you can't read.

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Knightzane
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 3:44:36 PM
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Damn... To think how many xbox people visit this site only to insult the playstation. I was expecting to read something interesting. Instead i get 'the 360 is easily on par with the ps3' sorry, i own both systems and the 360 has never blown me away. Alan wake was good, but it was no 10. Gears was boring. Halo 3 wasn't horrible, but the story gave me intestinal pain. Fable wasn't my type of game. I have no real opinion because i played 10 minutes of fable 1, and 2.

Now i really don't care if im called a fanboy because when you come to a damn PS oriented website, expect to run into people who love PS over xbox. Theres a reason for that and its ridiculous that people would actually start a damn console war over the topic. I think it would. Why? well look at the damn games that are coming out for the ps3 now. When i saw GOW Ascension i thought it was a CGI cutscene until he started killing people. So to the 360 fanboys, please for the love of god go to a 360 website devoted 100% to your MS needs and allow the people who love their PS3 enjoy a simple article without having to read "The 360 is better" Its like reading a damn comment section of a youtube video.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 4:04:59 PM

Who are you going to believe, the 360 fans or your lying eyes? ;)

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xenris
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 5:49:29 PM
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I think the Nextbox launch titles will look better than late PS3 games.

I'm not a PC elitist, but there are some PC games that when cranked look absolutely amazing, and while they don't blow the PS3 out of the water they stand well above it. The Witcher 2, Crysis 1, Metro 2033, and Battlefield 3 all look really really amazing when you can handle having them maxed out. It isn't light and day like it was going from the PS2 to the PS3 but still it is really noticeable.

I also assume the new engines will be ready by then, and if games launch using Unreal engine 4, the new cryengine, and whatever the engine is called that was powering Final Fantasy agni, well then we're going to get games that do actually blow PS3 games out of the water.

PS3 games MIGHT compete with some of the launch titles, but I think it wont be long before we start seeing ridiculous looking games built on the new engines I mentioned.

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homura
Wednesday, August 22, 2012 @ 8:23:20 PM
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The next xbox graphics will be better than the ps3, of course compared to the 7 yrs old console, technology has advanced and microsoft will take advantage of it. As for the 360, PS3 is still much more better, just compare the Final Fantasy XIII PS3 version to the 360 version. And look how beautiful are The Last Of Us and Beyond and we still not sure if it is the last releases of this generation. And my opinion is that our 7 yrs old beloved console still can compete with PC graphics today, just look at the water and the sands in Uncharted 3, how amazing. PS3 still can kick ass after all this years. And if the next xbox can't greatly surpass the visual of the PS3, then I think microsoft will be in trouble.

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