PS3 News: GT5 Damage Modeling Incomplete, Only "The First Step" - PS3 News

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GT5 Damage Modeling Incomplete, Only "The First Step"

As most of you know by now, Polyphony Digital plans to incorporate damage into Gran Turismo for the first time with the upcoming fifth installment. However, there are a few things that should be cleared up:

Firstly, the damage video that arrived in Germany for last week's GamesCom event doesn't represent what we'll see in the final product. Series creator Kazunori Yamauchi said it only "marks the first step of what we want to achieve for damage," and during an interview with GameBlog, he added that the team will have to see "how far the players want to go." Now, if you're wondering what this means, this statement is a testament to Yamauchi's drive (pun intended) to create the most realistic racing game ever. To date, no racing title has provided us with an accurate damage modeling system; no title has even gotten remotely close. Thing is, in real life, just lightly scraping a wall at low speeds can put you out of a short race, 'cuz you'll have to pit to replace that tire and maybe quickly hammer that fender back into place. And if you want to get really nuts, you'd have to make it so if you don't make the proper additional modifications to your car after tossing in a turbo, the engine just blows up on the first straightaway. Race over. The bottom line is that true-blue damaging modeling might make the experience overly challenging...i.e., it would truly be the world's first racing simulator.

And racing cars ain't easy. It's also interesting to note that damage won't be sustained by all vehicles in GT5. Obviously, they won't have a race where some cars can be damaged and others can't, but perhaps the F1 cars won't be able to be damaged and that'll only affect F1 races. Who knows? But we do know that when people ask for 100% authentic damage in a racer, 99% of them have no idea what they're really asking for. Yamauchi knows this...he'll want to see how far even the hardcore are willing to go.

Related Game(s): Gran Turismo 5

8/24/2009 Ben Dutka

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Comments (62 posts)

Orvisman
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:25:06 AM
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Amen!

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pavlovic
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:36:25 AM
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100% damage... impossible to finish a single race for an average gamer.

I'm still not sure about this damage thing... I'm fine without it.

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RadioHeader
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 11:45:25 AM

Yeah, same here. The cynic in me suspects that a lot of the people demanding damage are those who enjoy ending someone's race at the first corner :/

If damage was optional I'd go without, that way if you're taken out, you have a chance to work your way to an even more glorious victory :)

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NoSmokingBandit
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:37:40 AM
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Yamauchi knows what he is doing. He knows exactly where to take a game and where to stop. I trust that he will make sure damage is perfectly balanced.

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dillonthebunny
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:40:35 AM
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its just not needed... if we have to have it, then let us turn it off if we want.

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JofaMang
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:42:47 AM
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Damage modeling for me, has always been just a visual indicator of a sliding bar of performance: an arcade racing feature. I was always content with GT not having damage, as realistic damage would be unachievable.

I think GT2 had non-visual damage (bumping walls and cars can cause instability and reduced speed, as well pulling to the damaged side simple, but effective when it was turned on), which to me is FAR more realistic than twisting up some fenders, knocking off a hood and spidering the glass, while you still hit 180mph and threading the needle between opponents sliding sideways.

Do it right, or don't do it at all! There are enough arcade racers out there already.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:44:17 AM

"Do it right, or don't do it at all!"

Absolutely 100% correct.

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Nynja
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:03:48 PM

I mostly agree. If they can't get damage modeling done correctly, it may just end up pulling you away from the experience.

Yet, if they get it close to actual damage I can settle. I think it's mandatory for them to get some form of damage if they intend on including NASCAR.

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fluffer nutter
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:26:14 PM

That's exactly it. We have these "gamers" going around that the damage isn't realistic but I wonder how many physics classes they've taken to truly understand what a true, 100% accurate damage capable game would entail. Take off too fast, rear end someone and boom, you're out. Hit some debris on the ground and slide into the wall and you're out. The variables are nuts.

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Ricochet
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 11:02:35 AM
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It's so obvious. The damage modelling in the GamesCom was less than stellar I must admit. Hopefully the game modes will provide: Arcade, Normal, Expert, Realistic"

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Scarecrow
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 11:18:32 AM

Not a bad idea

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Scarecrow
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 11:20:06 AM
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I'm ok with no damage

I only care 'bout realistic RACING

Damage is fine to an extent but it shouldn't be what a game is ABOUT

Either way nothing will stop GT5!

Last edited by Scarecrow on 8/24/2009 11:20:45 AM

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Kangasfwa
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:56:37 PM

"Damage is fine to an extent but it shouldn't be what a game is ABOUT"

Say that to the success of Burnout.

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Scarecrow
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:31:34 PM

No, Burnout can't compares to the success that is GT

Have you seen the sales figures on GT?

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Nynja
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:00:58 PM
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The more I see and hear about this game, the more excited I get.

Really need a 'next-gen' Gran Turismo fix... Prologue just doesn't cut it anymore.

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Charger7302
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:02:35 PM
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This is unrelated to the topic in the article but does anyone know if Gran Turismo 5 will have the Charger SRT 8? If it does then I will definitely buy this game.

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mexgeo86
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:06:41 PM

i currently own/drive a Charger but it's only a base model (love it though); would love an SRT-8 in GT too

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mustang750r
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:53:54 PM

American Muscle for the win!

I have much respect for the Charger as well as other autos in the industry and I look forward to having 16 car Muscle car shoot out.

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Dingodial
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 7:08:58 PM

I wouldn't mind having the Charger SRT8, along with the 2010 Shelby GT500 Super Snake, & the Camaro Z/28!

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mexgeo86
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:05:04 PM
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If they want total damage, they should turn to the Burnout Series. The racing aspect of GT shouldn't be sacrificed for aesthetics.

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Diggity Dan
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:11:57 PM
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This strikes me as one of those gamplay elements that'll work best if you can tweak it in the options, which Im sure we'll be able to.

It'll be interesting to see how it works out.

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Diggity Dan
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:12:20 PM
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Oh yea, and WANT!!!!

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camaro300zx
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:14:03 PM
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I thought the damage aspect in GRiD was really good.

But what I would like to see in terms of "realistic damage" is for example:

Your going down a strait away coming to a slight bend, the car in front of you brakes too hard and you rear end them. Causing your raditor to crack leaking fluid on the track. You get angry at the driver, slam the gas pedal full throttle, RPM's sky rocket then you blow an oil pan gasket. Now theres oil and coolant leaking onto the course.
And the cars behind you are sliding into the wall.
That would be funny. (And realistic)

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www
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:36:06 PM

Yes GRiD alongside DiRT all have nice damages.

I think people will learn how to drive very well if they know their cars will damage. How do you think folks will be driving in real life if cars don't damage? Brakes wouldn't be needed, cause we'll just be bouncing off each other, there'll be no accidents, nothing.

Last edited by www on 8/24/2009 12:36:40 PM

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CH1N00K
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:27:42 PM
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This could be interesting...It will seperate the arcaders from the simulators....The Nascar fans won't be affected though..lol they bump and grind their way around left turns all day long anyway.

"Rubbin is Racin!"

I remember watching a GT2 class race a few years ago when Bobby Archer did that to someone in his Viper. The guy in front of him kept shutting him down for a few corners, so finally Archer just bumped the guy in front of him and spun him out. As Archer zipped by him you could hear him on the radio to his team saying,

"He looked like he couldn't decide whether to let me through or not, so I made up his mind for him."

Cracked me up.And didn't damage the Viper at all, however you have to have been racing for awhile to be able to have that much control of your car in the middle of a race. 100% damage in the game will turn some people away from it unless it's an option you can turn off (or down)



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www
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:29:35 PM
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Damage is a nice addition imo.

Hows about when you're playing GT and some non-gamer is looking and he's like "wow, this game looks too realistic" and then, you crush but the car is still brand new and he goes "whoah! how come the car is still in perfect shape" and he starts walking away, believe me I've experienced this.

Yes I know realistic damage hasn't been done and it'll make a race impossible but I'm not asking for some ultra-realistic damage,just a little bit will do. I mean, damage is in almost all racing games now, I don't see why it shouldn't be done. It should be optional!

Last edited by www on 8/24/2009 12:30:28 PM

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Nynja
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 12:43:25 PM

Burnout and Motorstorm series probably offers some of the best vehicle damage available, though, even these series do not have 'realistic' damage.

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Dingodial
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 7:12:57 PM

@ Nynja
I agree although I think that it is stupid when your wheels fall off in every wreck that you have (Motorstorm Pacific Rift)

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Alienange
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 1:19:31 PM
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Just release the game with what you've got ! Fro crying out loud! Leave the "super realisticly not fun car damage" for GT6.

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lfcjake
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:35:29 PM

Oh dear... Thumbs down for you.

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Alienange
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:41:05 PM

Why? Because I spelled "For" wrong?

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tes37
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 8:01:14 PM

No, for talking about a tearful hairdo.

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Trarman
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 1:53:00 PM
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I know for sure one of the first things I'll be doing is seeing how messed up I can make a car and still finish the race!

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mustang750r
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:12:09 PM
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i say just release the game and then in the form of updates (or dlc) implement the more "authentic damage" in piece by piece. PD should leave it to the player to decide if they want to play with damage on or off. I see a Pro mode for those who want all the damage and physics, Medium for those who want just visual damage and physics, and Novice for those who, well you know and it could have light physics and optional visual damage.

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mustang750r
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:21:35 PM

i just read the above comments and i see my fellow gamers have the same ideas and share the same feelings as i do.

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Highlander
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:29:09 PM
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It seems to me that there are four possible modes here.

* No damage
* Visual damage only, damage has no impact on performance
* Arcade damage, damage is shown visually, but has only a slight impact on performance.
* Fully simulated damage. Damage has realistic effects on performance.

As is stated in the article, realistic damage modeling may well be too much for the vast majority of players, and in F1 cars, all but the slightest damage is race ending.

This is a game, it's a simulation sure, it's accurate, but it sill has to be playable.

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Geobaldi
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:45:58 PM
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In the least they could do the damage like the NASCAR games on PC used to do. It was realistic enough and really made you try your best not to take any. And it was fun to drive in reverse and just cause havoc in the leaderboards ;)

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King James
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 2:49:59 PM
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Thank goodness! I thought I was gonna have to race with the damage off all the time. The video I saw was not GT realistic at all! I think the guy playing mashed into the wall (on purpose) going at least 50mph, and all that happened was a hanging front bumper and an open door! Terrible.

This is relieving. Thank you Ben for reporting this. I hope they do what Arnold K. suggested a couple of months back; the option to choose how realistic you want your damage:
-No damage (just good ole GT play)
-Fun damage (damage similar to GTA and Burnout, with no true penalty towards performance)
-And hardcore damage (You got slightly bumped at 120mph and now your car's f*%^ed and you have to pay for repairs and even medical bills)

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SkantDragon
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 3:02:08 PM
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I do hope to see fully realistic damage capability. And I think most gamers won't actually be able to deal with it, so it will need to be configurable just how realistic it is.

I actually compete in amateur racing events in RL, and I often use GT to practice. If I hit a wall in the game, I stop and turn off the console. I just wrecked my car, and I'm done.

Approaching it that way really changes how you drive and for the better. I can play GT for days without ever hitting anything. And that's exactly the kind of habit I want to teach myself for being in my RL car on an RL track where I don't just get to push the restart button.

I do think it would be good for gamers to be exposed to these concepts. Because race games so far have really taught a lot of bad habits that are nothing like how you approach the real thing. Racing around without ever crashing into walls isn't nearly as difficult as most people think. But the approach that produces that result changes the whole way you drive. And it's actually a faster way to drive, too.

Basically, gamers would have to learn how to actually drive a race car properly.

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Highlander
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 3:55:41 PM

You mean everyone would have to learn to hit the apex, and take the racing line?

But...that would mean no more riding around corners on the doors of the car along side, no more using the dude in front of you as a breaking point for a sharp turn, and no more riding the wall as you corner! However will the newbs manage?

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www
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 4:14:36 PM

Well said SkantDragon!
And games like Grid and DiRT have really thought me how to drift along sharp turns without doing too much damage.

"But...that would mean no more riding around corners on the doors of the car along side, no more using the dude in front of you as a breaking point for a sharp turn, and no more riding the wall as you corner! However will the newbs manage?"

LOL Highlander, so true! But tha's the point. People using others as brake at sharp turns is really annoying, but that will never go away, cause we all do it. I can imagine how cars will be smashed at those corners when playing online.


Last edited by www on 8/24/2009 4:15:43 PM

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Highlander
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:37:00 PM

I used to do it all the time on the TOCA I and II racing games on the PS1. That game modeled damage and you paid the price, though you still had a bit of lee-way for door to door racing....LOL!

I bet it will always be a temptation in off-line racing.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 3:17:12 PM
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This doesn't bode well for a 2009 release though.

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lfcjake
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:33:01 PM

I'd rather them get the game right, instead of having a product that feels half arsed, to me and others.

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A2K78
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:01:43 PM
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"To date, no racing title has provided us with an accurate damage modeling system; no title has even gotten remotely close"

Yamauchi is right hence why the damage that Turn10 market so much is fake. If anything it also show how pointless damage is...if you can't technically reproduced actual damage, why put it there at?

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A2K78
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:02:02 PM
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"To date, no racing title has provided us with an accurate damage modeling system; no title has even gotten remotely close"

Yamauchi is right hence why the damage that Turn10 market so much is fake. If anything it also show how pointless damage is...if you can't technically reproduced actual damage, why put it there at?

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A2K78
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:03:59 PM
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"To date, no racing title has provided us with an accurate damage modeling system; no title has even gotten remotely close"

Yamauchi is right hence why the damage that Turn10 market so much is fake. If anything it also show how pointless damage is...if you can't technically reproduced actual damage, why put it there at?

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A2K78
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:04:19 PM
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"To date, no racing title has provided us with an accurate damage modeling system; no title has even gotten remotely close"

Yamauchi is right hence why the damage that Turn10 market so much is fake. If anything it also show how pointless damage is...if you can't technically reproduced actual damage, why put it there at?

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photo K
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:13:59 PM
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if they add it... my car is gonna be @#$%@$%! I tend to bump and scrape cars and walls...a lot, lol. But its fun, but it wouldn't be so fun if it'll take me outta commission right away. I hope it won't cost the user money to repair it... I'd pretty much have to buy a new car after each race.

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lfcjake
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 5:31:28 PM
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Damage is essential in driving sims. Well, it is today, thanks to Forza.

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Rings0fUranus
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 7:08:50 PM
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if they add it, they have to make it optional. because honestly, it will ruin online.
also, imagine putting a ferrari into a wall at daytona at 200mph? in order to make it truly realistic, i would imagine they would have to make the car vaporize into nothing but bits of fiberglass and your driver would have to DIE lol.
im just fine with no damage! (isn't the goal to race cleanly anyways?)

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lfcjake
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 6:26:35 AM

Works alright for Forza.

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tes37
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 8:05:01 PM
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I know this may be unrealistic, but I'd like to see a self adjusting difficulty and damage level that gets harder as your driving skill improves.

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Nerull
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:09:25 PM
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It needs damage, how ultrarealistic it has to be is debatable but I don't get how everybody acts like GT is a driving simulator when all the cars are glued to the track and the AI is one of the most robotic ever seen in such a hyped series. Overall the series hasn't really improved since GT1, it's just got hundreds more cars, many of which are pointless 43hp cubes.

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Highlander
Monday, August 24, 2009 @ 10:38:01 PM

Lemme guess, you think Forza 3 is the pinnacle of video game motor racing? ;)

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OriginalSin
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 1:42:20 AM
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I think the damage system in GT5 is a great idea, but if they had to make it 100% accurate it might become a pain in ass for some. I'm all for it as long as it doesn't make it nearly impossible to play.... I'm all for simulation as long as it doesn't border on frustration.

Hopefully within the different modes they will have a less realistic mode when you just want to have fun and not worry too much about crashing your car and writing it off....

Speaking of which if you do write your car off will actually be written off?? That will be cool but I can see myself having a couple of freak out sessions if that happens...

All in all I can't freaking wait!!!

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Banky A
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 2:54:32 AM
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- Damage for Race, WRC & probably NASCAR
- Performance problems if you crash too much (showed in demo)
- Option to turn on/off (I'm sure PD will add this)
- Interior damage for those specified vehicles


I've been stalking any news for this game 24/7 every single day recently, on way too many websites.
I think know what this game will need/have ^_^
And it helps if you've seen the Gamersyde 60fps cockpit video - it looks soooooooo goood I can't describe it in this comment lol.

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Banky A
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 3:35:59 AM

And guys, this one is gonna' (and has gotta') be out in December.

Fans have been waiting enough, "it's been a long time coming". There's so many hints on the date and I know the quality will be top-notch when it comes out (hopefully next to Christmas).

Believe ^_^

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___________
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 3:07:47 AM
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"how far the players want to go."
that does not strike confidence in me what so ever.
what that sounds like to me is
we want to see what we can get away with, will try something show it and if people are not happy we will add to it.
thats unacceptable.
just do your best add everything that you can by march next year, than release it.
i dont like PDs attitude lately there starting to sound like close enough is good enough.
when 5 years development time goes by i expect nothing but fu****g perfect!

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Banky A
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 3:33:25 AM

Polyphony Digital are very nice and cool people.

Don't doubt them :)

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maxpontiac
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 8:31:29 PM

So much doubt, when the game is not even out yet.

PD will deliver with GT5. People need to relax.

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___________
Tuesday, August 25, 2009 @ 8:13:21 AM
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only time shal tell.
i say delay the game till march next year or so to make the game perfect, the graphics are there.
the physics and damage are way way off, given i have not seen what there up to now but what they have shown is far from complete.
ive waited 5 years i can wait another 6 months.
just give me LA Noire!
that game i cant wait for.

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