Square-Enix Doesn't Want To Expand, They Want New Fans
See Full ImageI've only considered the possible conclusion for several years but after the publisher's most recent announcement, I'm now convinced.
With every new unveiling, it seems as if Square-Enix is intent on informing everyone of the company's intention to "expand" their fan base. ...but that's not what they're doing. "Expanding" means that you build on what you already have; it means you retain that which has prompted the reason for growth. In other words, for a video game developer and publisher, it means they produce entertainment products that cater to both their established fanbase and a new group of gamers. However, it seems painfully obvious that such is not the way; ever since they announced they desire to "expand Westward" and opened their LA studio, it's clear they only wish to appeal to a new audience, while leaving the loyal audience behind. They had the foundation but instead of building upwards - which is what they claim to be doing - they essentially took a wrecking ball to that foundation and started construction on a new building.
I'm not saying Dungeon Siege III won't be good (although my confidence in Obsidian isn't very high), and I'm not saying I didn't enjoy past titles like Final Fantasy XIII. I'm saying that just about everything new from Square-Enix shows either an extreme lack - or is entirely devoid - of the very elements and features that made millions fall in love with Squaresoft all those years ago. Granted, the immediate argument for such a move is that progression and advancement means leaving old-fashioned ideas and mechanics behind, but you can boast innovation while retaining your fans. It really is possible. All I see is a company that suddenly has zero interest in Japanese gamers (let's face it; FFXIII sold like crazy on name-brand recognition alone), and continues to lump all Western gamers into the same group: the twitchy, must have crazy machismo in order to be entertaining, neanderthal crowd.
All I've got to say to that is, "thanks for repaying my loyalty with your assumption." You know, I'm suddenly reminded of the time when S-E brought up the idea of a Final Fantasy VII remake at their Twitter page, and the page exploded...and S-E was surprised. They were actually surprised, as if they really didn't know there were millions of old Squaresoft fans still out there; fans who may appreciate something like Deus Ex: Human Revolution but still miss the classic Square feel. And why is S-E basically only publishing now; do they only develop for Nintendo, or something? I think the bottom line is clear, and it's depressing for those who stare at their PS1 collections, realizing in dismay that in Square-Enix there is little to no semblance remaining of Squaresoft. They don't want to add to their fans (many of whom have already lost hope); they want to get new ones. Well, whatever. Seems illogical to me, but what the hell do I know?
6/7/2010 9:14:32 PM Ben Dutka
Put this on your webpage or blog:
Email this to a friend
Follow PSX Extreme on Twitter
Comments (113 posts)
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:19:14 PM
If I were a stockholder, I'd sell all my shares with S-E before it's too late.
6 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:42:52 PM
6 up, 0 down
bridgera
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 11:30:26 AM
I waited until I could get FFXIII for $40, maybe I'll checkout Versus and Agito, but other than that, I think I'm about done with that series.
Oh how it'll be missed.
1 up, 0 down
tes37
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 9:48:01 PM
Reply
7 up, 0 down
Hezzron
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 9:54:53 PM
Reply
Last edited by Hezzron on 6/7/2010 9:55:47 PM
7 up, 0 down
Victor321
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 9:55:15 PM
Reply
1. extremely small now, in terms of how many there are
2. much older (not exactly 60, but not 20 either), and therefore don't play as much games anymore; therefore, they don't see a need to cater to that audience (here, I am assuming that they are assuming that guys like you Ben, don't exist anymore, and they may know this by marketing research, for example)
3. part of the immensely large "twitch twitch must have crazy machismo" group of gamers (i.e. Today's largest segment of young gamers; I am not saying all young gamers are like that, because there are young gamers [Moi for example] that love games with stories and depth, and by young, I'm ranging from 12-16)
These are all of course, assumptions, but I personally wouldn't be surprised if this is all true.
On a sidenote, I remember reading an extensive interview from another gaming site on FFXIII with a couple guys at S-E (sorry, I forgot their names) saying that, with every new FF installment, they always strive to continually appease their existing fanbase (they said, "the ones that have always been with them") while picking up new fans in the process. Win-win for them, win-win for us no? I'm sorry I couldn't provide a link.
Oh, how times have changed (this interview was only from Summer 09!!!).
Last edited by Victor321 on 6/7/2010 9:57:41 PM
4 up, 1 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:22:44 PM
Remember all that buzz about content and towns being cut-out for the 360 version?
Final Fantasy games were all GOTY contenders. I don't think FF XIII is going to get a single nomination on the Western side.
As for Japan sales of FF XIII, its clear they came from name brand alone.
5 up, 0 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:43:14 AM
But oh well...guess S-E will never know that.
3 up, 0 down
Victor321
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:05:09 PM
0 up, 0 down
Hellfire
Friday, June 11, 2010 @ 10:26:43 AM
I'm a few days late to this topic, but oh well.
I just wanted to point out that there are quite a few ~20 old school SE fans out there. I live in a house with three other guys and we're all in our early twenties and have all been playing final fantasy games our entire lives. We get into heated debates on a daily basis about characters from Final Fantasy 4 and 6, and whether the magic system in Final Fantasy 1 sucked or not. And yes, we spend hundreds of dollars a month on video games.
We are out there, and spending tons of money. I just wish SE knew that.
0 up, 0 down
Fane1024
Saturday, June 12, 2010 @ 5:57:46 PM
The list: Alan Wake, Battlefield BC2, Bayonetta, BioShock 2, GOW III, Heavy Rain, Mass Effect 2, MGS Peace Walker, Mod Nation, Red Dead, and Super Mario Galaxy 2. I'm probably missing something (3D Dot, Just Cause, Split/Second, SSFIV) that'll get some votes. Not to mention the downloadable games.
That's a helluva year and we aren't even at E3.
Last edited by Fane1024 on 6/12/2010 5:59:27 PM
0 up, 0 down
coverton341
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 9:56:27 PM
Reply
S-E is interested in taming the "western" market now and they could not care less about the original fan base. I place the blame on the explosion of FPS game sales. I'm not necessarily saying that the FPS genre is bad, if it were then it wouldn't have had such a boom. What I am saying is they saw the power of the dollar in action and decided that they must emulate it.
What they seem to fail to realise is that the FPS boom happened because FPS games make for great multiplayer-online experiences. And what is different about this console generation than those previous? Online is much more accessible. TADA!
Do they realise a lot of gamers are starting to back off of buying the next big FPS just because it is an FPS? Do they not realise that just because there was that boom it did not necessarily mark a paradigm shift(that isn't there as a pun) in the interest of all gamers?
There are still us out there that love RPG. We love turn-base. WE BUY FFVII AND FF:T ON THE PSN LIKE MAD!!!
Highlander always has a good argument that the gamer audience is segmented or some such, don't know the exact term he uses, but dammit he's right. Not everyone likes the same thing. And by god S-E did not get to be as big as they are making COD games.
There, I'm fricken done.
6 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:14:45 PM
17 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:18:07 PM
0 up, 0 down
Nynja
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 7:49:26 AM
I need a new MGS fix for my PS3.
1 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:08:19 PM
Reply
8 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:14:31 PM
Last edited by laxpro2001 on 6/7/2010 10:14:58 PM
1 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:15:39 PM
2 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:24:50 PM
S-E have lost their freakin' minds. Unless they create a shooter with better graphics, better mechanics and more addictive gameplay than MW2, all they're doing is driving away the millions of fans who stuck by them in the first place.
Like World said, it's like middle finger to the fans who have been with them all along.
After all these disappointing announcements and horrible PR developments, I am actually hoping, yes, HOPING that S-E will go bankrupt, just so they learn their lesson.
Video gaming quality has taken such a huge dive with the success of the Wii and COD games. I weep for the future of this industry, especially if companies strive for quick cash grabs with mediocre brain-dead gaming products.
MEGA 64: In the year 2024, Activision presents New Mario Brothers 12!!!
"NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!"
3 up, 0 down
Snaaaake
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:33:29 PM
It's what I wish too but I just can't see it happening.
0 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:34:08 PM
And even if they did create said shooter, they would lose basically all their current fans.
@World,
Thats after you cut them down with your sword right?
@Snaaaake,
I wish that wasn't true but at this stage it seems so. Hopefully one day everyone will realize their disservice to us.
Last edited by laxpro2001 on 6/7/2010 10:36:53 PM
0 up, 1 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:44:01 AM
4 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:12:27 PM
Reply
...something I said?
In order for Square the keep my interest they need to announce KH3 at E3. I'm fed up with waiting which I have been doing for almost 4 years now. Also fix the horrid magic system from the second game so its more like the first and don't you dare make it exclusive.
Honestly not too long ago I used to see a RPG developed by SE and not knowing anything about it, automatically being intrigued by it and inclined to pick it up.
Those days are gone now, and now I'm upset.
0 up, 1 down
FullmetalX10
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 11:41:21 AM
Umm, am I reading this wrong? I think I am.
0 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:32:43 PM
0 up, 0 down
dragonx_HD
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:14:23 PM
Reply
6 up, 0 down
coverton341
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:27:56 PM
5 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:32:11 PM
6 up, 0 down
Snaaaake
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:34:31 PM
Not a revolutionary move!!!
1 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:38:00 PM
1 up, 1 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:57:41 PM
That would be true but think of the other people who play video games you know. How many of them actually stay up to date on news? Furthermore how many of them can actually name more than 5 publishers and developers? Finally how many of them play games aside from sports games developed by EA and MW2?
chances are you probably are one of the more informed gamers in your group of friends, then again I could be completely wrong, but my friends are exactly what I described up there.
While all gamers aren't that bad, a lot don't pay too much attention to the news or things outside their realm of playing video games. They won't be aware of how SE dicks over their loyal fans and the same is likely to happen to them without them having the slightest idea thats its been done before.
3 up, 1 down
Snaaaake
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:22:58 PM
Reply
After that one Square Enix fan will be gone.
1 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:35:02 PM
Reply
At least there are a few companies that can take over for SE. I just hope another series pops up that makes them go "Why did that company's JRPG outsell our Super Terrific Western FPS?"
3 up, 0 down
Snaaaake
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:39:07 PM
2 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:43:30 PM
Hopefully as more casual gamers turn hardcore, people will pay more attention to quality games, and the sales numbers will follow.
With Activision pushing COD and Halo now, we're in for a dark age and a possible repeat of 1982's video game crash. The hardcore have lost, the casual Wii crowd won. Square has abandoned their fans, and Western games are of higher quality than JRPGs. Japanese devs try to capture that crowd, but to no avail, thus leaving the JRPG enthusiast and long-time fan behind in the shadows.
Oh what dark times we live in.
2 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:02:01 PM
How do you expect more casual gamers to turn into hardcore games with the current trend in video games?
Aside from Demons Souls and Ninja Gaiden, I can't remember the last games that challenged me. Also the fact that Demons Souls didn't even break a million yet is appalling especially considering the amazing quality of it.
Sorry but I think the sad truth is hardcore gamers are going to become more of a niche as casual games become more popular.
1 up, 1 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:16:31 PM
For COD and Halo to outsell Uncharted 2 and MGS4, and Demon's Souls, and God of War 3, all bigger GOTY competitors, just shows how far our once awesome industry has declined.
Wii Fit and Wii Play are the biggest selling games of this gen, what does that tell you?
Basically S-E are abandoning the hardcore fans for the uncaring, unknowing casual crowd who know nothing about them or their past.
Time to take ol' Essie (S-E) out the back with the farm rifle. She's damaged beyond repair.
3 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:38:18 PM
Reply
WHY!?!?!?!
Sales of FF XIII didn't help. Worst FF reviewed compared to other major FF titles, and yet it's the highest selling. Why?
Brand recognition. If it hadn't been "Final Fantasy XIII", I think the review scores would have been 2 points lower all around. Sure it looks pretty, but pretty can only do so much.
After hearing this announcement, I became so sad that my favourite RPG developer has shot itself in the heart and replaced it with a mechanical one that pumps artificial blood 5 times faster. As a metaphor, I mean artificial games with no real substance or heart made to make a quick buck.
Developers like S-E need to understand, COD was popular cos it was one game all your friends would play on their 360's or PS3's, meaning it was one title you could be certain of buying that would last you a long while online.
MW2 had the social gamer crowd, anyone with a console who could play a shooter. Very few developers could tap that crowd, especially if they're all just FPS fans with itchy trigger fingers.
S-E, please understand that these people have already made a choice to buy MW2 and COD games for a social experience with friends. You can't tap that market!!!! Your only chance is to retain your loyal old fans and expand with new ones, not dump them in favour of capturing the twitch gamer crowd, they don't care about your games!!!! REALLY!!!!
I am over S-E, I really am. Final Fantasy Vs XIII may be the last S-E game I get solely from them. And if they go multiplat with that one, God help us all.
R.I.P. Squaresoft. The memories you gave us will always remind us of what quality gaming was all about in the Golden Age of video games, 1985-2005. Your fans will miss you.
4 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:45:32 PM
2 up, 1 down
Scarecrow
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:47:20 PM
Reply
It really is sad
The only thing we can do now is appreciate the OTHER jrpgs out there, Ar Tonelico, Agarest War, Shin Megami, White Knight Chronicles, etc.
Final Fantasy was special though. You always looked forward to EVERY character in the game. I still remember wondering what Tidus was going to be like and if Yuna was just going to be a dumb/useless 'princess.' Then in XII I wondered what Basch was like and if he was interested in Ashe and what the whole relationship with Balthier and Fran was like.
I wonder when they'll announce FFXV. Sadly I don't see it being announced this year.
0 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:56:11 PM
1 up, 0 down
Mystearica
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:48:48 PM
Reply
Link: kotaku.com/5541802/final-fantasy-versus-xiii-on-xbox-360-squares-looking-into-it
Last edited by Mystearica on 6/7/2010 10:50:20 PM
0 up, 0 down
aaronisbla
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:38:26 AM
0 up, 0 down
Kiryu
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 10:50:40 PM
Reply
Goto this link Now!
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=110903&page=1&str=899447082
1 up, 3 down
MyWorstNightmar
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:07:18 AM
2 up, 1 down
Jawknee
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:01:49 PM
Reply
E3...Versus XIII multiplat announcement is coming.
>_<
1 up, 0 down
laxpro2001
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:02:46 PM
1 up, 1 down
Mystearica
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:26:56 PM
0 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:02:45 PM
Reply
I'm no analyst but I can't see it working out in the long run. It'd be like Pizza Hut only selling that pasta of theirs and nixing the pizza. It wouldn't work.
2 up, 0 down
Bromus398
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:04:42 PM
Reply
That said, I've pretty much lost all faith in S-E. Unless they release one of my mainstay titles and it looks like it will kick ass beyond all shadow of a doubt (which is basically down to Kingdom Hearts 3), I'm done buying their products. Maybe if they return to the verge of ruin, they'll get their act back together.
3 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:07:45 PM
Reply
If he were to drop all his loyal small and medium business clients for one big one with lots of money, would he be praised? Would that be an intelligent? No!!! Of course not!!!
This is exactly what S-E is doing.
The intelligent thing is to cater to your loyal clients/fans from whom you get the majority of your money. But cutting them off and risking one venture with a big business is like shouting from the rooftops you want to drive your company to the ground.
S-E SHOULD cater to their fans and listen to their demands, while trying to create an action game on the side that combats COD and tries to attract those large number of twitch gamers.
S-E are slowly killing themselves. When the hell are they finally going to fire that idiot President of theirs and get someone intelligent who ACTUALLY LISTENS to their fans!?!?!?!
There will be a lot of angry or sad faces at the Square-Enix booth at E3 this year.
2 up, 0 down
Alienange
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:08:02 PM
Reply
They'll go off into publishing world and never develop their own decent game again. Young people will soon look at us old timer gamers and wonder what we were smoking to say that SE used to make good games.
Last edited by Alienange on 6/7/2010 11:08:57 PM
5 up, 1 down
Deleted User
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:10:54 PM
2 up, 2 down
Underdog15
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:45:47 PM
EDIT: There's also a large number of people who didn't care for the DVD release. They love FF7 the game, but didn't like advent children. Why would they get the blu-ray if they hated the DVD? (Which was out for a good long while before the blu-ray...)
Last edited by Underdog15 on 6/7/2010 11:49:44 PM
4 up, 0 down
Jawknee
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 2:37:00 AM
EDIT: There are still FFVII fans out there. You only need to look at the download numbers on PSN. It's been in the Top Downloads since it's release. I've played all the games in the Compilation except the cell phone one. People are still hungry for FFVII.
Last edited by Jawknee on 6/8/2010 2:39:55 AM
4 up, 0 down
Deleted User
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:08:23 PM
Reply
1 up, 8 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:19:17 PM
4 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:25:18 PM
It's about how times have changed. How Square is the epitomy of disappointment lately.
This has nothing to do with ownership percentages. This is about the fans of a once great developer being left out in the cold, and how S-E doesn't care about our views.
5 up, 0 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:46:17 AM
4 up, 0 down
Deleted User [Administrator]
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:32:53 PM
Reply
1 up, 4 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:47:36 PM
2 up, 0 down
Jawknee
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:53:25 PM
4 up, 0 down
Deleted User
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:49:11 PM
Reply
And for my sake of opinion, I think Enix has catered & changed it's fan base when it is 4 years in the PS3 & only FF13 has been met by them. I'm excluding Batman Arkham Asylum. They bought it AFTER it was release. Games like Last Remnant, Star Ocean (finally ported two years later!) Infinite Undiscovery, etc. Even Nier was meant to be 360 ONLY! We, the real fans, the one that made them money. . . it's done! They don't care about us.
PS, the new SquareSoft is Mistwalker. aka Lost Odyssey, Blue Dragon, etc
0 up, 3 down
Underdog15
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 11:52:50 PM
0 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:49:40 AM
3 up, 0 down
CHAOS THEORY X
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:12:02 AM
Reply
5 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 8:59:39 AM
0 up, 0 down
CharlesD
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:22:50 AM
Reply
3 up, 0 down
ZettaiSeigi
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:34:50 AM
Reply
I am sure that they would be more that capable of toppling Square-Enix by the rate things are going. A lot, if not all, of Sony's first-party games got critical and commercial success. I could easily see them doing the same thing with an RPG.
Yes, Sony got a lot of love from Square during the PS1/PS2 era, but it's clear as day that it is not the case anymore. S-E has forgotten about their loyal fanbase and doesn't care anymore about what they want and what they have to say.
So Sony, it's time that you get your hands "dirty". You don't need S-E anymore. You are fully capable to create an RPG that will be as good, if not better, than Final Fantasy. If and when you get to do that, you would have the last laugh. And we would be there with you laughing at S-E until they disappear into oblivion.
6 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:50:43 AM
Reply
3 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 6:45:32 AM
3 up, 0 down
goodgamer
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:13:16 AM
Reply
also japan studio is the new rpgmasters
1 up, 0 down
AlfaChaos
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:24:44 AM
Reply
1 up, 0 down
Lawless SXE
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 2:16:40 AM
Reply
As for Square-Enix, well, what can be done? No amount of begging and pleading will make them see sense, only the brilliant flash of money can do that, but we all know that Sony (God Bless) will not sink as low as that. Alas, Square-Enix, we knew ye well, back in the days that were.
Oi, and what's this Nerkas video that was flashing outside the Staples Centre?
Peace.
0 up, 0 down
Lawless SXE
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 5:16:14 AM
Peace.
0 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 6:58:24 AM
I was around 10 when all these games started appearing on PS1. I got MGS1 and FF VII from my family, and those 2 alone remain to this day in my top 5 all time favourites. Story-telling in games was at it's peak with those games. They pushed the boundary of video game story-telling, beyond staged platformers like Mario where you hav to save a Princess.
We speak so fondly of these games because they remind us of a time when we were young, had more free time to appreciate every detail within each game. It was a time where games were admired for their beauty and creativity, not their ability to host 56 players online with more guns than the Vatican can hold.
These games made companies like Squaresoft and Konami great. These games pushed the bar. The cutscenes in FF VII alone were enough to make me run to my parents to show it off to them in 1997. It was all cutting edge.
To see great companies abandon their great roots and hardcore fans in order to make a quick cash-in on the COD audience is beyond me. It makes me weep for the future of this industry, as I have already stated before.
All those old games you mentioned are held dearly for what they achieved artistically and narratively at the time.
Personally, Bioware is the only company I have strong faith in for story-telling and RPG mechanics. Still haven't played White Knight Chronicles, and Demon's Souls isn't coming out in Australia for another 2 weeks.
Do yourself a favour Lawless. Download and play all these games on the PSN. Vagrant Story, FF's VII-IX, Metal Gear Solid, Oddworld: Abe's Odyssey (not an RPG, but still a great game), and keep an eye out for Parasite Eve.
As for current games, get your hands on White Knight Chronicles, Demon's Souls and Lost Odyssey on 360. These will give you a hint of what we older gamers experienced back in the day.
0 up, 0 down
Douchebaguette
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 9:40:30 AM
1 up, 2 down
Underdog15
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 10:30:30 AM
No one is denying that some of their games are still well done, for the most part. Most people will admit that despite FFXIII, for a common example, being a let-down in terms of moving away from what FF's are known for, it was still a very well done development. However, that 'X' factor that made them great seems to have disappeared. The further complaint is their lack of concern for customer satisfaction. They aren't expanding their business... they're rebuilding it.
2 up, 1 down
Lawless SXE
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:31:01 PM
I fully intend to pick up Demon's Souls when it is released, and White Knight Chronicles some time in the future (maybe when the second is released so I can have them both in one hit).
As for those PSN releases you listed, I'd love to get them, but I simply can't as I'm running on a 3G internet connection you see. As soon as I get a real one I'll pick them up though.
@Douchebaguette
I know that what you say is probably true, but I don't look back on my experiences with the old Atari with nostalgia, or fondness. I look back and think, 'Wow, they were actually really bad.' And besides, as much as I like most of the games that I've played, I can't say that I've seen anything to grab me and properly take a hold of me yet. I know that your post was that it was nostalgia for nostalgia's sake, but I don't think that's true.
@Underdog
Yeah, but from what I understand, it isn't just Square-Enix. It seems to me that most all publishers are trying to expand their business by attempting to take on new consumers at the accidental expense of their old. It just seems downright foolish.
1 up, 1 down
Scarecrow
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:33:47 PM
Wrong
A better comparison is the rock/metal music genre.
I wasn't around for Metallica in the 80s, Ozzy, Judas Priest, Dio, etc. in the 70s, yet I still agree with A LOT of people that-that was the golden era of rock/metal.
Late 1980s through 2000 was v-games golden era. Plain and simple.
Level design
story telling
character design
So much variety you couldn't even begin to "OMG I'm tired of FPSs." It had platformers, fighting games, SHMUPS, FPSs, racing, sports, rpgs, action adventure, it had everything you can think of.
1 up, 2 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:06:37 PM
It's this difference that pains the loyal fanbase most. The shift in style and intended demographic is a close second, but yes, the latter may be more due to nostalgia.
3 up, 0 down
Douchebaguette
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 5:23:08 PM
@ Scarecrow
Since when something better to you will ever be better to the eyes of a child playing newer games today? Never.
You have to re-read what I said. I didn't say anything about that time being better or not than this time [btw, I too prefer that time over this time. There will never be games that has struck aura and mesmerized me such as FFVI, FFVII, Chrono Trigger, MGS]. All I said was, that people growing up NOW will end up saying the same s**t we do now to them, so Lawless shouldn't really beat himself up for it. Why? Because kids today will never get to witness what you claim as the "Golden Age" and we'll never magically erase our memories and magically live to see their side of the story. Infact there's more chance they'll believe they're in some sort of "Golden Lame." It's a bit obvious. It's like your grandad that keeps banging on about "Back in mah day, we didn't have tuh fight over the remote. We actually had tuh get up off our tuckus' then walk tuh the tv and actually change the channel manually. Now shut up and give me the remote you young whippershnappers D=<."
----
Cut to the chase: there is no "Golden Ninja Warrior." It's what's golden to YOU. I can't believe I'm stating the obvious here. And if you're going to argue about quality in games then one can argue that back in those days you'd never find a game with conviction such as Uncharted 2 [God, the voice acting to the first 3 Resident Evil games were ATROCIOUS], RPGs with so much choice like Mass Effect 2, mass creativity found in games like LittBigPlanet, or ease of universal plug n' play for fairly addictive socialising online experiences such as COD4, KZ2, Halo 3 & Red Dead Redepmtion.
Who knows. See your FFVIII could be some kid's FFXIII. Your cousin's Modnation Racers could be your older brother's Mario Kart, all on the same level of appreciation anyway.
Perhaps if the days you mention were about the Golden Days for developers, I would concur.
---
And for the off-topic: I know plenty of people who appreciate the foundation of metal, the influences from Thrash metal, but would rather listen more to the metal which bands generate today over the classics, or would rather see Lamb of God live over Iron Maiden. Wanna know why? Oooh, [other than exceptions such as me, where I've listened to 80's thrash and NWOBHM first before expanding to other and later genres of metal] it's a another mentioning of the obvious: because they've grown & adapted to metal today. They've never witnessed yesteryay, so why be a douchay and nay-say by telling a storay about the superioritay of the Golden-ay? Exactlay.
1 up, 1 down
Underdog15
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 11:50:27 PM
I'm afraid I agree with Scarecrow and Ben, though. While there is a nostalgia side to our appreciation, the case in point, SE, doesn't score the same they used to. There is an obvious decline, not just to fans, but all critics. Keep in mind, most critics don't even do a comparison to begin with. However, their overall scores are a full point lower, on average, if not more, than they used to score back in the day.
Instead of the obvious Final Fantasy series, look at Dragon Quest VIII. SE stuck to VERY traditional means, and they had huge success. Whenever they get to their roots, they do well. Dragon Quest VIII averaged a score of 9.2/10 amongst 55 professional online critics. This is a fairly recent (4-5 years late PS2 gen) proof-in-point about the traditional JRPG working for SE. When has SE ever created a game fans want and failed, is my question. Perhaps that's a better question than "Why are they moving forward?". Why not ask, "When has their traditional-what-fans-want attitude NOT paid off?" Movies, like AC and Spirits Within, do not count, as they aren't really what fans want... not REALLY.
2 up, 1 down
___________
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 2:38:09 AM
Reply
there trying to appeal to more people thus increase their customer base but in doing so there loosing fans.
what the millions of people who live and breathe FF is not good enough for ya?
its not like there barley scraping through i mean for fu*ks sake there swimming in money, so much so they just bought out eidos there not exactly a cheap small company!!!
arent those 2 Ferraris 2 bentleys and 2 RR and 5M dollar mansion enough for ya MR wadda?
selfish ^%$# #$%^$# %$#@#% ^^&%$#@#@#$!!!!!!!!!!!!!
this is what is wrong with the industry today and why todays games will never be as good as yesterdays.
back in the day developers and publishers everyone involved in a game had a massive passion for the game thats why they were doing it, not to make cash.
that passion made them care about what they release and thus made it a fantastic game.
nowdays they could not care less whether their game is good or sh*t as long as it brings in the $ thats all they care about!
its looking like developers like naughty dog are a dying breed, give us a few years and we will have nothing left but shovelware ala activision.
im going to ring activision tomorrow and give them a ear full and hopefully get it through their thick heads.
i bought crash racing 2 on my iphone and its so freaking laggy i can not play it!
im ringing them tomorrow, giving them a piece of my mind and demanding my money back.
until these selfish a$$holes get a swift kick up the backside there not going to stop and before you know it we will be drowning in activisions.
i can honestly see this gen being my last gen of gaming, after this were going to have nothing but shovleware developers releasing sh*t and charging us a arm and a leg for it.
why make a good game and bust your a$$ when you can do a third of the work and make just as much money?
4 up, 0 down
kraygen
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:39:26 AM
Reply
RPG fans who haven't played white knight, it is the video game deal of the day on amazon today, for only $36.99.
I'd jump all over that deal.
1 up, 0 down
aaronisbla
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 3:44:09 AM
Reply
NEVER have i sold a FF game after beating it. Not even FFX-2 which still sits in my collection. Thats saying a lot. At this point if/when they announce FF VS 13 being multiconsole i dont think many will care
0 up, 0 down
Dancemachine55
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 7:12:52 AM
Reply
THIS IS NOTHING LIKE THAT!!!!
Sony has the most powerful console on the market with the largest mass media storage disc available, the Blu-ray. If S-E cared about their creative vision, they'd keep their game Sony exclusive.
Fair enough if FF XIII went multiplat, 360 was still kicking butt in 2008 when the announcement was made. But there is NO EXCUSE for FF Vs XIII to go multiplat if S-E want to see the greatest FF RPG made, visually, narratively and spacially.
If Squaresoft were still around, we wouldn't be in this mess. FF XIII would be PS3 exclusive. Vs XIII and XIV would be exclusive to PS3. These games would be aiming for greatness in the game collectors shelves, not greatness in selling like hotcakes and becoming unwanted beer coasters that are worth $3 in the bargain bin.
S-E no longer care about quality, and that is a shame. Self-destructive is the best word to describe their direction.
FIRE WADDA!!!! What are the board members waiting for!??!?! Wasn't that Twitter post about a FF VII remake enough of a wake up call to them? Do they even know we old fans still exist in the hopes of a PS3 exclusive Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts or Parasite Eve sequel/remake?
Who do S-E listen to? I will join that company and THEN tell S-E what to do to save themselves and their image. RETAIN YOUR RPG GREATNESS!!! LISTEN TO YOUR FANS!!!
As ____________ said, it's not like S-E doesn't have a big fanbase, cos theirs is huge, I'm talking millions, in regards to fans of Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts and Dragon Quest.
Sorry, ranting too much.
Basically, we fans need to find the local S-E developer studio and stage a protest. Spread the word from US to Japan. S-E must be held accountable for their actions. We fans are a passionate bunch, and they need to know that!!!!
Last edited by Dancemachine55 on 6/8/2010 7:14:41 AM
1 up, 0 down
Clamedeus
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 8:33:15 AM
Which i think is stupid, if making it for another platform means making it look even worse with multiple discs why bother doing it when you can put ALL of it on one single Blu-Ray, doesn't make any sense what so ever.
It's like If you had the money to buy a Lamborghini or a Honda what would you buy?
1 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 9:09:48 AM
3 up, 0 down
Dustinwp
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 9:09:20 AM
Reply
Last edited by Dustinwp on 6/8/2010 9:11:04 AM
2 up, 0 down
Douchebaguette
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 9:43:21 AM
Reply
2 up, 0 down
Evil tele
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:12:13 PM
Reply
as for FF7 remake.... i honestly think that enix is a little afraid to make this. considering how big this game would be, how much of a challenge it would be to basically recreate the game world of FF7, without damaging the 'essence' of the original. They were right when they said it would 'take years to make' (but they've been talking about how long it would take for a few years already - it could've been partially done by now)
best thing they could do right now... (wont happen though) - is to drop all the fluff and BS that they're doing.. assign ALL of their divisions to work on two games.... FF7 remake, and kingdom hearts 3. - both exclusive to the ps3
1 up, 0 down
FullmetalX10
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 12:25:56 PM
Reply
Even though S-E is ruining itself and leaving us(the fans) in their wastebins, I still have hope left for two of their games, even though that son of a b*tch wada had a thought about making Versus XIII(one of the two games) multiplatform, I still have hope, even though they are trying to change their loyal old fan base for the new twitching youth which doesn't care about anything they make, only fps's and space marines shooting aliens, I still have hope.
For there is still a solid team at work at that company and I think you all know which one I'm talking about, that's right, Nomura's team(that sounds kinda bad-ass), I hope Versus XIII and Kingdom Hearts 3 will become Playstation exclusive mammoth titles, those might be the last of their kind(a genius Square game).
If you go out(leave your loyal fan base), go out with one hell of a bang!
plz give us our Playstation exclusive games, we deserve them for making you the company you are today.
0 up, 0 down
Evil tele
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:16:14 PM
Reply
retail it at $180 a unit... it'll still "sell like hotcakes"
dont they see the potential?
1 up, 0 down
Scarecrow
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:37:36 PM
btw I ain't the only one
Last edited by Scarecrow on 6/8/2010 1:37:57 PM
0 up, 0 down
Evil tele
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 1:49:13 PM
There was a time when i heard a new a new FF game was coming out.. instant buy..
after 12 & 13 let me down... not anymore :(
1 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Tuesday, June 08, 2010 @ 2:40:16 PM
0 up, 0 down
Rinoa
Wednesday, June 09, 2010 @ 4:08:03 AM
Reply
i just think that writing an article like this, based on an opinion (that we all feel the same, we all feel abandoned by SE) while the title sounds like it's a fact, and something they stated instead of making it clear that it's something you just assumed, like we all did.
i dont know about you, but it really brings my spirits down.
they didnt say they abandoned their fans, maybe they can still surprise us.
maybe they just need to get rid of wada and maybe they just need to see that their games wont sell only on house name anymore... that will eventually happen.
0 up, 0 down
Caanimal
Thursday, June 10, 2010 @ 3:42:27 PM
Reply
If SE honestly thinks they are going be able to just drop their established fan base and just pick up a new one they are going to be sorely mistaken. I don't see this ending nicely for Square-Enix at all...
1 up, 0 down
ZenChichiri
Thursday, June 10, 2010 @ 11:50:44 PM
Reply
I know games are more expensive and time consuming, so there is more of a risk taken with making the game, but if you go with what is safe all the time then you will lose fans. Greater risk = greater reward and that is why Square thrived in the PS1 era. Vagrant Story, Xenogears, Brave Fencer Musashi, and Threads of Fate were all risky as they were new IPs, but that risk taking was selling copies. Of course they always had their Final Fantasy crutch, but now the company is leaning on it a little too much in an attempt to keep their loyal fans with cheap spinoffs.
0 up, 0 down
ThEuNdYiNg1
Friday, June 11, 2010 @ 5:14:00 PM
Reply
0 up, 0 down
Lightofjudgment
Sunday, July 18, 2010 @ 4:54:47 AM
Reply
The atmosphere in Square Soft games, it does not matter what game, is splendid. Every dialogue, every sound that comes resonating from the speakers of your television hits you with such awe and force that you can tear just by thinking about it. Aerith's (very, very shocking and heartbreaking) death, The Planet and its efforts to rid itself of Meteor's threat through its Lifestream, Laguna's separation with Julia, Squall's acknowledgment of his love for Rinoa, Zidane's overcome depression, Garnet's (or better still, Dagger, since it played such major roles in her life) everlasting affection for Zidane...
Square Enix had wrecked the name of Final Fantasy. And as if that word wasn't powerful enough I would make it 10 times as strong just to show everyone the deepest extent of my disappointment. Final Fantasy VII culminated with a resolution so epic that it was perfectly easy to tell that Crisis Core and other films/games under the Compilation have ruined it. Square Enix is focused wholly on graphics, gameplay and intensity, and have neglected the sentimental elements which make up the quintessence of Final Fantasy, robbing it of whatever pride and uniqueness it has. Final Fantasy is nearly no longer Final Fantasy; it truly ignites the fury of people like me who have grown up with Final Fantasy and have loved it so much.
The ignorance of Square Enix is awe-inspiring. They must have thought for once that maybe they should change their genre of games to suit the newer generations, all due to Gran Turismo and Gran Turismo 2's incredibly stupid and meaningless reign in the market. The magnificent of Final Fantasy does not lie only in rushes of adrenaline, and if that still cannot permeate that thick skull of theirs, then I shall continue to abhor them, and I will do so with all my heart.
If they had thought of casting off their old fans like feathers, the fans who were so tied to the original Final Fantasy, then I stand here to prove their insolence and impudence wrong, for they have no idea what Final Fantasy has brought to my childhood.
0 up, 0 down
ShadowRunner
Reply
Monday, June 07, 2010 @ 9:35:48 PM