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3D And Move: What Is The Appropriate Price For Gamers?

Sony put a big emphasis on the PlayStation Move and their new 3D technology at E3 this year, but there's one very relevant question that remains, and one I assume Sony is even asking themselves at this very moment: "what is the right price for such technology?"

Firstly, Sony did admit that Move and 3D are expected to have two very different lifecycles in terms of length, which makes sense. 3D needs time to catch on, and it won't really explode until the option is available on most HDTVs. This is simply because few people, even the most avid gamers, are expected to head right out and drop a significant chunk of change on a new TV right now. This is even less likely when that consumer has likely seen little or nothing of 3D gaming. The Move, on the other hand, is hoped to deliver within the year, and Sony wants to keep feeding it with great new software. It's likely that Microsoft puts Kinect on the same competitive footing with Move but the question is, what are gamers willing to pay to jump on board? Furthermore, when will they finally decide to take the plunge?

The full Move package, including the PlayStation Eye, will be priced at $99.99, although you can purchase the individual pieces for less. Retailers are saying Kinect will cost $150. First-party Move titles will go for $39.99 and we just have to assume the third-party ones will hold a $49.99 price tag (perhaps the same goes for Microsoft). Now, are these appropriate price points for such technologies? Is this acceptable to in-the-know gamers looking to embrace new ideas? Is it enough to lure Wii loyalists away to try an upgraded version of the motion sensing they know? Let's not forget that if you don't already own the PlayStation 3 or Xbox 360, you need the console, too, so... There was some grumbling going on about the Move's price and you can fully expect more grumbling over Kinect's price, which may be an indication of low initial sales.

But 3D is even more mysterious. I just saw a beautiful 40" Samsung 3D 1080p LED HDTV for "only" $1700 at Best Buy and while that's agreeable to some, it isn't to those who are plenty happy with their current HDTV, and aren't willing to make such a big investment. Besides, are people thinking the technology might get better with time, and they'll be screwed if they adopt early? Perhaps it would make sense for Sony to find a way to allow gamers to test 3D in the likes of Killzone 3 and Gran Turismo 5; perhaps something like this will be necessary. Personally, while I certainly could get that Samsung now, I too am inclined to wait. I've seen very little of everything they're promoting and so has most everyone else, and it's always difficult to promote a product that consumers never really got a chance to see. Move demo kiosks everywhere will be a must, as should 3D demos in various retailers, I expect.

But what do you think? This isn't about telling you what the appropriate price points are; it's about asking the gaming masses.

6/17/2010 9:29:35 PM Ben Dutka

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Comments (98 posts)

piratedrunk
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 9:50:36 PM
Reply

3D I will have to wait on but the moment they come out with a move bundled with that Sorcery game I will bite.

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shadowpal2
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:30:11 AM

I'll be dead honest in saying that this whole 3D thing won't last long at all. I mean you're not going to have movies constantly like Avatar - 3D is basically one of those "one time unique things where it can be done to make it look gorgeous"

It's seriously a gimmick...does anyone here actually think the Nintendo 3DS will be bought because of the 3D functionality? I bet anyone could care less...it's the fact that the Nintendo 3DS has pretty graphics (so far it looks better than the PSP's Peace Walker)...and well quite frankly I don't know what else.

But this whole 3D thing will be a gimmick...now if a game was made for 3D like Avatar was made for 3D - then there you go...3D will work. As long as there's a regular version and 3D version side by side...it'll work.

So in the end it's up to the developer.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:58:02 AM

@ shadow

I agree on ur 3d theories, however I disagree on one thing. I saw some gameplay from the 3ds and I'm sorry but watching it in HD I still think it falls far behind psp games, especially peacewalker.

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Tom_Robertson
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:33:33 AM

@shadowpal

I agree with you that it's a gimmick, I'm not even going to consider going 3D until I have no other choice. However, I disagree with you on Avatar being made for 3D. I watched it in the cinema in 3D and found it nothing more than mediocre, whereas on bluray on my 1080P screen at home, it's amazing. I'd just rather pay to see something with amazing graphics and visuals etc. over 3D :/

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bridgera
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 10:58:28 AM

Ya 3D is definitely a gimmick, the masses aren't ready for it. Maybe next gen.

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B-RadGfromOV
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:09:03 PM

I just hope it's not as bad as HD DVD where tons of people buy it only for it to lose support and fail.

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Highlander
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 1:42:58 AM

@B-Rad

Too many manufacturers involved already for it to fail that way.

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hellish_devil
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:06:04 PM
Reply

I just bought a 40" Bravia (not full HD, just 720p), like, a year ago. So I think I'll upgrade to 3D in like....well, let's just say I'll have one when the PS4 arrives

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ebterp
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:20:55 PM
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I am just not interested in 3D in its current form and I think you will find very few people that would buy a new TV to get it. Now Move I am excited about especially since I have two small ones who would get into it - my fear is that the pricepoint for Move isn't going to be that much cheaper than picking up a Wii so unless its something that really blows me it might sense to just pick up a Wii for them.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:46:26 PM

Something that really blows you huh?

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:59:31 AM

If you already have a ps3 how could picking up a wii be cheaper?
Besides even if they only had the same kind of games for children, the ps3 games would still have much better graphics.

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Fane1024
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 3:18:51 PM

I think the bigger barrier will be the glasses (and the headaches for those who suffer). 3D TVs seem to be launching at more reasonable prices than most first-gen gizmos and will probably become the standard within a few years, even if most people aren't using them for 3D.

I don't foresee too many trade-ups just to get 3D, but I do think new customers will opt for a 3D set, since it will also be the top-of-the-line HDTV in all other aspects (pun not intended).

However, if the TV could blow you...

Last edited by Fane1024 on 6/19/2010 3:20:31 PM

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BikerSaint
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:28:14 PM
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Well, I'll definitely be getting the Move setup some time late this year.
And might even get the Post-Natal, but only if it can be retro-fitted to my 250GB COD:MW 360 that I just got late last year
BTW, does anyone know if Post-Natal(alias:Kinect) will connect to mine, case I sure don't want to buy another 360).


As for a new tv, I certainly need one as I'm still stuck in the old Flintstones Yabba-Dabba-Doo time with my Sharp 32" "BedrocK" SDtv.

I want either a 50", 60", or even a bigger inched tv. But I'm also going to hold off buying it till the 2nd generation of 3DTV's are already establishe.
By then, hopefully both the price will be a lot lower, a set standard for all 3D protocols and also the need of the 3D glasses completely eliminated.

Last edited by BikerSaint on 6/17/2010 10:31:19 PM

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:01:09 AM

From what I've read the kinect should work with your 360 but it will need it's own power cord because the old 360's can't power it.

That being said I would definitely not try to power it with your 360, it'll die all over again. lol

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Shams
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:56:36 AM

@Biker:

Eh, why wait? Just invest a few hundred dollars and get a reasonably sized HDTV, otherwise you'll be missing out on how good games actually look this generation. Regarding holding off on 3D, I'm with you. Getting a 3DTV this early before even a good number of games and movies support 3D is just a waste of money. Wait for cost of the entry to come down, and for the industry to actually support it.

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Scarecrow
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:32:42 PM
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Move > 3D

It's as simple as that
Won't be getting a 3D tv ever, maybe when ps4 gets here, and even then I really don't care for 3D at all.

Move will be interesting and will probably have some nice support as time goes on.

Sorcery all the way!
I hope more people voice out their dislike for the generic "Harry Potter" though. Let us make our own character, even if it's simple.

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Reccaman18
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:37:10 PM

Hear, hear!

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Zemus101
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:39:36 PM

Yes! That would be awesome, that and a crazy amount of items and collectables to go along with ..hopefully, some serious (probably light) RPG elements. That sounds like seriously addictive fun to me. Play 'till my arms are tired.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:02:31 AM

Yeah about 3 months after sorcery comes out I should have an 18" bicep, at least on 1 arm. lol

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BikerSaint
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 10:46:55 PM

kraygen,
Thanks man, didn't think about having to have another power source.

I guess I'm aborting Milo before his poor little fetus even begins it's first trimester.


Shams,
The reason I don't get an HDTV right now is because I want a monster sized TV(dreaming for an actual 72"or higher)so I don't want to spent extra money right now on a 47 to 60" HDTV, only to have to buy another 3D-HDTV a couple years later.

I'd just rather wait it out & only spend my money once on my next big TV upgrade.
And like I said before, I REALLY hope to have the biggest, baddest super-sized one out there when all is said & done.

BTW, although I forget who made it, I saw a monster sized 102' HDTV that was out a couple years ago for the rich techophiles who could afford it's humongous price tag of $20,000.

So when that one comes out in all it's 2nd generation 3D glory, and along with a price drop to only $10,000 I WILL get it....
(I'll just sell $25 admittance tickets to watch it in my living room, just to recoup the 3/4 of it's cost) LOL

Yeah, it will be some major penis envy around my neighborhood, but I don't care, cause mine will forever be bigger than theirs!!

Last edited by BikerSaint on 6/18/2010 11:00:34 PM

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SvenMD
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:37:03 PM
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I'm dead serious when I say that watching the video for KZ3 the other day made me want a 3D TV. I got a 46" Samsung 3 years ago and I love it, but I would upgrade to play GT5 and KZ3.

Tigersdirect (kinda sketchy, but they're cheap) had a 55" Samsung 3DTV with a 3D bluray player and the startup kit (2 glasses and Monsters vs Aliens) for $2770.....it's a sweet deal...but until February of 2011 I have no need for a 3DTV.

As far as the move...I think $100 is a decent price. Again, I don't know WHEN I will get it...but it looks like fun.

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Reccaman18
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:39:20 PM

Tiger Direct? They're ligit dude. But you dont actually need a 3d tv. Just a tv that has a refresh rate of at least 120htz and can obtain firmware updates through USB. Its a lot cheaper that way.

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Zemus101
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:37:25 PM
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well it's the same when high definition was new. You can't really show what it's like on commercials (I still see my local cable company's commercials trying to show the difference) You just can't, it'll end up like Nintendo's 3DS video and we'll have people getting sucked into TV's and silly stuff like that, I don't wanna see that. I wanna see every Futureshop here in Canada with a giant ass 3DTV with Killzone3 just sitting there, begging to be checked out to convince people, and hopefully me.

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CONTRABAND
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:42:33 PM
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I have a 1 year old 1080 120hz 52in Series 7 samsung that ran me $2,500.00 so i wont be buying a 3D TV for at least 5 years if not 8. but from the looks of things ill be picking up the move this winter.

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fluffer nutter
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:11:37 AM

Why was that TV so expensive? Did you go to Best Buy? I've seen their sale prices are usually hundreds of dollars more than the competition. I saw my Samsung 40" 120Hz TV on "sale" for $700 more than I paid for it.

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Shams
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:15:43 AM

Yeah, but BestBuy price matches. In the beginning of the year, I wanted to get a Pannie Plasma on Sale at Sears, but they were out of Stock. So went to BestBuy where it was selling for $300 dollars more, but had them call up Sears for the price check, and walked out with my TV of choice instead of waiting for a week for Sears to restock.

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StangMan80
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:43:31 PM
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I know I will be picking up move later this year also, but I won't be getting a 3D TV for a while.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 10:47:32 PM
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I still don't see how they can call it the "Full" move package when it doesn't have the nav controller. I wouldn't want the awkwardness of using the DS3 with it.

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MyWorstNightmar
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:12:05 AM

Some marketing "genious" came up with that description of an incomplete set.

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xnonsuchx
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 11:18:41 PM
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While Kinect is priced higher than a basic Move set-up, keep in mind that as soon as you go to 2+ players, Move is pricier. However, I still hear of lag/accuracy issues w/ Kinect and that it's a pretty big draw on the system's resources, so games for it might need to be 'simpler' than non-motion-controlled ones. It's a big wait and see for me.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:05:35 AM

Did you see the games they were showing at e3, some of them looked worse than wii. Ones that didn't were just an animal on the screen in a grassy field. And even with it being super simple and cartoony it still had more lag than wii ever did.

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xnonsuchx
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:48:08 PM

No, I haven't watched any E3 vids of it...but I live in Seattle and talk to people who work at MS and/or have helped test it and the best they can say is "Well, it's better than it was before." It sounds like they may have had a choice between adding an extra CPU to the Kinect device (which would up the cost another $50+ and added development time) or letting the 360 handle it all, and that they may not have realized the performance hit it would have until 'final' decisions were already made.

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Fane1024
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 3:25:17 PM

Typical M$: "It sucks, but not as badly as the last version! Buy twelve!"

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xnonsuchx
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 10:21:53 PM

Yikes! I finally saw some of the Kinect vids online and even the Star Wars game didn't seem like an intense use of it (looks like it's very 'forgiving' to compensate for lag/speed/accuracy). Mind you, I'm still not getting Move either until I see how it works out.

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Naztycuts
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 11:38:40 PM
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As far as the price point for Move goes I personally thought "What is this letting me do that I couldn't before?" I watched the e3 presentation heard the price, was amazed by the innovation of the titles, and I preordered it today alongside GT5 Collector's edition (I want that freakin' keychain!). If I'm not mistaken Microsoft said the Kinect titles would be full priced games at e3. I've also heard rumors of Kinect being anywhere from $100-$150. You'd have thought MS would have announced that as well, Sony didn't seem to have a problem announcing their Move for $80 for both pieces and the bundle options. Looking at this years e3 it seemed as if there was a role reversal compared to the early days of the ps3. Microsoft's still huge but it's kind of hard to stay big when your exclusives haven't been 'remarkable' since Sony dropped Killzone 2.

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Highlander
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 11:53:48 PM

Where did you find a pre-order for it?

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Highlander
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:10:26 AM

oops, I mean where did you find GT5 Collector's Edition for pre-order...

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Naztycuts
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:38:58 AM

I had to get it from Gamestop, I really didnt want to miss out since it's finally coming and I'm a sucker for awesome Collector's Editions.

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Highlander
Thursday, June 17, 2010 @ 11:50:39 PM
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Ben, Ben, Ben... How can you doubt? How much were 1080p HDTVs 4 years ago? How much are they now? Prices will drop, and the only way that 3DTv will come to be a 'standard' is if people buy in to it, and they will only do that if there is content. The content has to com first.

The price point of Move is very nice, and at $39.99 Move titles are priced right where Wii titles are. OK you have to have a PS3, but if a family is making the move up to HDTV then they will want a BluRay player anyway, so why not just go for the PS3 since it has that too? The combined price of the console plus move isn't that bad considering.

The interesting thing for me is that Kinect is likely to be more expensive than Move for most consumers, and arrives in the market nearly two months after Sony. We were told months ago that Kinect (aka Natal) would beat Sony to market. Not quite, apparently. Kinect arrives later and is more expensive than Move.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:45:32 AM

Yes, but I don't see prices falling much further for TVs; they've been pretty stable since that time when they plummeted.

And I don't doubt 3D will be cool, I just doubt that the technology is exactly where it needs to be for early adopters. And as I might be one of them, I have to ask. ;)

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Highlander
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:10:44 AM

I just remember people justifying prices of $4k for 1080p TVs a few years back, so $2k or less for a 3D seems somehow better.

Either way, it's still out of range for me this year, so I will have to wait...

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:09:23 AM

true but you can buy the camera now, and in a few months if you don't want that game you can buy the wand and use just it until u can get the nav controller.

Spread it out, you don't have to buy everything at once.

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johnld
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 3:06:59 AM

yeah, you can buy it now but i think the only bundle with the game is the 99 dollar one. i want to know if that bow and arrow game is in the bundled game because if you need another wand then how does that work?

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fluffer nutter
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:17:16 AM

I know the MSRP for the PS Eye is $39.99 but you can find it at many shops for $34.99 or less. Lots of places are clearing them out too. Kmart has them clearanced out for $4.97 if you can find them.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:35:24 AM

I'm sure you could also buy the game separately. Might not get the savings that way but if you're strapped for cash, then buying over time might just be a better option.

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BikerSaint
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 11:20:28 PM

Ben,
I don't so know about HDTV prices NOT still dropping, just because I now see 42" & slightly larger HDTVs at Kmart & Walmart going for as low a price as $700/$800 these days.

And I believe that once these 3DTV's start taking hold of the market, I expect them to become the ONLY standard for ALL TV's.
And then causing another huge price drop just so manufacturer's can dump their HDTV stockpiles, just as was done with all the SDTV's when HDTV became the craze too.

And then our frigging stupid bureaucratic government bungler's(also know as the FCC) will probably pull another one of their ill-thought out fiasco's by banning the old HDTV signal.
Along with giving us more free "welfare cheese" in the form of two $40off coupons for new 3D converter boxes.LOL

Last edited by BikerSaint on 6/18/2010 11:21:30 PM

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bOnEs
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:18:30 AM
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a reasonable price for the move would be the entire set with an eyetoy for $15 more than a DS3 remote... and sets without the eyetoy for the price of a remote... no individual sets and stuff that confuses the consumer, that's shady M$ tactics...

3D tech is quite a ways off but, i like the fact that both sony and nintendo are fully invested in it, which means that the entertainment industry is fully on board as well... it's microsoft that now looks behind...

but, neither is reasonably priced right now... which is why i think nintendo won E3... sony's ideas are too pricey and too futuristic for the current time... maybe at the next E3 this would of looked better but, nintendo brought the games and that's what matters most...

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:10:52 AM

I know wii motes and move are different but they are packaged in the same way and priced almost identically.

the only big difference is that you need the camera which you could buy now and start video chatting with your friends.

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natho86
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:20:38 AM
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How good would demon souls be with move! As for a new tv my 50 inch LG has almost had it, insurence job lol and Sony 3dtv here I come!

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Scarecrow
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:07:51 AM

Demon's Souls 2 + MOVE would be lovely
Imagine swinging in any direction you want?

I love the game's animation, but it would be great if you could swing your weapon in real time (with force feedback these would be even better!!!)

The large hammers would be super fun with this

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:11:44 AM

Yeah I was harping on Demon's souls 2 and move for a long time and then they said no to demon's souls 2, darn them and ruining my dream.

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kanok
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:13:33 AM
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I have two DS3 controllers, it means that I only need to pay $100(bundle)+50(one more wand) =$150. It okay for me. So that I can play with my gf, or I can use two wands to play some games like the vedio.

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Robochic
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:10:06 AM
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I think the price range for the move is fine but I do agree wish they would of bundled the other controller with the move but as someone who use to work in the marketing world I know why they do this sort of stuff.

3D tv I just finally purchased a 42inch bravia during christmas for 499.00 CDN, i just don't think I'll be purchasing a new tv right now but once prices go down adn we see the sucess of the 3d tvs then of course I will, I'll never get to enjoy it without a barf bucket.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:16:34 AM
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It's hard to say really whether I'll ever get 3d or not, I still haven't used these new glasses with these new tvs, but in all reality I've never been that big on 3d and not just because of its quality.

When you play a game in HD and someone is walking through a town it looks 3 dimensional. When you watch something with 3d, certain elements still have that look like they're inside the screen in a 3d world, but some stuff sticks out of the screen. Everything doesn't look 3d in 3d only some of it does.

It just looks funky because it doesn't look 3d to me, it looks like there are objects floating in my living room that have no reason to be floating.

As for move, I'm sure anyone who's been around the last couple months knows I'm a fan. Price is exactly what I expected and tho I'll have to buy more and more pieces over time, that's ok, I had to buy my ds3's over time, so no big diff here.

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Lawless SXE
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:25:11 AM

I agree that 3D does look a wee bit funky. But you can't deny the scene in Avatar with the tree spirits landing on what's his face was pure awesome. The only part of the entire movie that wowed me. I kind of prefer the gimmicky side of 3D, because it doesn't work properly when seen as a serious image, if that makes any sense.

Also, 3D only works if you are totally immersed in it. In other words, a cinema, where everything else is black and your focus is on the screen, which takes up all of the visible space in front of you. Watching a TV, no matter how large, will always take you out of the experience because of all the things cluttering up your space.
Peace.

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___________
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:49:10 AM
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200 bucks really is the limit, i would not pay anymore than that for the full set, thats 2 move controllers 1 sub controller and 1 ps eye.
say 70 for move, 40 for the sub and 60 for the eye is fair.
thats by them selves, but the whole point of buying a bundle is for it to be cheaper, not more expensive.
if i go down to the local grosser store 5 kilos of flour will be cheaper than 2 bags each 2.5 kilos.
thats the whole point of buying in bulk, to buy in bundles.

kinects only going to be 200 here apparently, that can have up to 4 players conected no matter what game.
ps move can only have 4 move controllers connected at once, or 2 moves and 2 subs.
so if a game uses 1 move and 1 sub per person than you can only have 2 people apose to kinects 4.
plus not to mention move runs on batteries so eventually they will run out and you will have to charge them.
kinects hardwired into the system so you dont have to worry about that dying.

if moves any where near kinects price than its going to sink like the titanic!
not to mention kinects already getting the advertised from here to the moon!
but with sony and move, well there still in preschool when it comes to advertisement.
as the saying goes you have to spend money, to make money! the sooner sony learns that and stops being so tight a$$ed the better!
but im afraid thats never going to happen.

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Lawless SXE
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:20:36 AM

HAHA, you're comparing to kinect to the move and saying it's better because you can have more players? Okay, I'll take the bait. People who have gone hands on with the kinect have stated that the lag time is in the vicinity of 2-5 seconds more often than not (look up your own sources), imagine multiplying that by the four players. It would be enough to make all but the most sedate games unplayable. I may be completely off there, but whatever.

Also, problems were shown at E3 with a single player controlling kinect. Picture how much worse that would be with four people jumping around like idiots, crossing each others physical boundaries in regards to the camera. I have no doubt that they f'd it up big time.

If you're anything like me, you'll always have a spare controller hooked up to the ps3 charging in case the one you're using dies. That may not seem feasible with the Move given that most people will be using both at the same time, but why not hook it up while playing a game that does not require it.

Finally, the kinect is only hardwired into the system if you buy one of the new 360s. If you have an older system, you will still need to plug it into a wall socket.

One last thing. As far as Sony is concerned, Australia barely registers in terms of overall sales, so they don't see any real reason to advertise here. Sure, they still do it occassionally, but not nearly enough. And honestly, where have you seen a Kinect ad? Because I've never even seen a 360 ad on TV. Can't say the same about the other two though.

Peace.

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___________
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 8:24:00 AM

no im not saying kinect is better because it can have more players, im saying kinect is better because of a few things.
you do realize its not do out till november right?
they could change allot of things before then!
as for advertisements, whats your email address?
ill send ya the flyer EB sent me for kinect and the 360 S today.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:40:05 AM

I haven't heard anywhere that you can only have 4 move controllers, 2 wands and 2 navs. Put up a link, cause it sounds like you're making up stuff now.

If the ps3 can link 7 ds3's why only 2 wands? I don't see it. Prove me wrong.

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bridgera
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 11:05:53 AM

To the OP:

For me the big drawback to Kinect is the GAMES.

How do I play a game like Halo w/o a controller? You can play SOCOM 4 with the Move, but Microsoft hasn't shown us any type of equivalence with Kinect.

But maybe I'm not their target audience, as I'm not a giddy school girl jumping in a boat to collect coins with her friend.

I don't see myself needing 4 Move controllers, especially when the Dualshock 3 CAN function in place of the Nav.

If I can have 4 players, but don't see any games I like, it really doesn't matter to me how many players Kinect supports.

Last edited by bridgera on 6/18/2010 11:06:56 AM

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Fane1024
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 3:34:28 PM

Dude, you hold your hand like a gun (index finger straight, thumb up) and pump it towards the screen, while simultaneously saying "pyew...pyew pyew pyew". Couldn't be more simple.

What are you, in eighth grade?

;P

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Lawless SXE
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:11:32 AM
Reply

I don't see 3D being at a good price point for another two years at least. When I can get a good set for under $1500 AUD I think I'll get interested.

What most people can't seem to be able to grasp is that Move is a premium product that requires more than one piece and is far more advanced and accurate than the base structure granted by the Wii. With that in mind, the price tag for new adopters buying a PS3 at the same time will be daunting, but anyone that already has a PS3 and knows Sony's history of releasing Ace hardware should have no problem dropping the $180(?) for all of the pieces.

I had more to say, but it's grown wings and flown out of my head, so I guess, Peace.

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Tom_Robertson
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:36:53 AM
Reply

Both are just 'cheap' gimmicks. I don't mean cheap as in the price, but cheap in the ideas. I'm gonna consider PSMove, but after playing a few games with it, and as for 3D, not until I have no other choice will it be considered.

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Zorigo
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 5:40:45 AM
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How much is this gonna cost in europe!!!!

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Fane1024
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 3:36:01 PM

They said there would be info on the UK blog.

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Juanalf
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 6:03:12 AM
Reply

The only advantage I give Kinect is that It supports 4 players out of the box meaning you only have to buy one.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:42:51 AM

yes, but think about the quality and how big of a room do you need to have for 4 players? Also every demo has shown them standing directly in front of the kinect, one a 4 player game how close to you have to be.

People are going to be falling all over each other trying squeeze into view.

I think I'm going to go to peoples houses who get kinect and walk around behind them while they're trying to play, should be good for a laugh.

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FullmetalX10
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 6:13:50 AM
Reply

*Sigh*
I see it like this: 3d-TV, hell to the no, at least not yet, I wouldn't even be able to get that cash if I worked for 5 months straight and the technology is still in very early stages.

PS MOVE, either bundle + extra MOVE + (2) sub controllers = 100 + 50 + (60) 30 = (210) 180 bucks,
or buy a PSeye now + 2 MOVEs later on + 1 (2) subs later on and also a game = 50 + 100 + 30 (60) + 40 = 220 (250) bucks minus the 50 bucks now will still end up with 200 bucks later on...
I just don't see it happening till the first price drop, since I still need to buy more games and a Kite + board for kite surfing, which is ridiculously expensive as well.

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ohmikkie
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 7:29:15 AM
Reply

does anybody know what Killzone 3's frame rate is going to be? Reason I ask is that I would be very surprised it is going to be over 200. Which I believe is the requirement for the new 3D tech. Something does not add up or I need to be directed to the appropriate Wiki.

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bridgera
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 11:00:47 AM

Human eye can only see 30 fps. So for 3D you only need 60 fps (30 fps per each eye).

Some people claim to see improvements at 60 fps, so with 3d you would never need more than 120 fps.

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Highlander
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:01:48 PM

I think you're right about most people, most people who do not regularly view video images at 60fps can not tell the difference. I think it's kind of like being a trained observer. Once you have trained your vision you can discern a difference between 30fps and 60fps.

I think we can perceive higher frame rates than 30fps. It's just that most video sources prior to HDTV were 24/25 fps. After about 60 frames per second we can't perceive individual frames, but human vision is an analog system, so human vision can discern changes in frame rate even at those higher frame rates. If for example the frame rate varies or there are stutters, a human will notice it. If you watch something in 30fps, especially fast moving action the human vision system will let you see each individual frame, they may blur together to an extent but you will perceive the 'jerky' motion of fast moving objects. At 60fps, the differences between frames are more slight making it harder to discern the differences.

That's why games at 60fps are often described as silky smooth because we can't detect the differences in the frames and it just looks smooth.

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JackC8
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 7:36:39 AM
Reply

The Move is a little expensive: $50 controller + $30 camera + $30 subcontroller. And I guess you need two of the $50 controllers for some games, like boxing or where you've got a sword and a shield? That's the thing - $80 for a controller and camera isn't bad, but how many games will that allow you to play? I don't know. I'm buying it so I can play a couple of games that look interesting to me, it's a novelty that I may get sick of quickly, or maybe I'll like it. Won't know until I try it.

I have no idea what the general public will think of it. Will Wii owners start migrating to the PS3 over the next couple of years? It will be interesting to see what happens.

3-D TV's? Way too expensive. They've got a little problem in that most 3-D movies are aimed at a young audience, and most young people don't have jobs, much less money. My son had to beg me for months before I finally bought him a 360 for $500. A $1,700 - $2,000 TV? Ha ha ha ha ha. Personally, I'm sure 3-D gaming is really cool, but not nearly cool enough to justify the price. If 3-D added $100 to the price of a TV, then I would be willing to consider it. But only if I was in the market for a new TV. I'm certainly not rich enough to go around replacing nearly-new, high dollar electronic items just because they've come out with a new model.

Last edited by JackC8 on 6/18/2010 7:37:47 AM

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TheOldOne
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 8:19:46 AM
Reply

I expected the package to be 100 bucks including the second Move controller. But my hopes were too high since I forgot that they have to include the Eye Toy for the whole Move thing to work. So basically, you will have to spend $150 for the whole experience of both consoles (PS3 and Xbox). I hope that Move gets better games, since I promised myself not to spend a dime on Microsoft's console.

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fluffer nutter
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:25:37 AM

Where did you read that the Eye Toy was compatible with Move? I haven't seen that yet.

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kraygen
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:44:41 AM

a lot of people still call the ps3 camera eye toy.

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TheOldOne
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:13:09 PM

LOL, never had played with any, so I though it was the same name/thing...my bad!

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CrazyIrishBoy
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:44:04 AM
Reply

Im just thinking that the devs of multi platfrom titles wont be arsed having much of a difference in the games between the mechanics of move and kinect, so one will probably take the other down a bit.

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Palmetto
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 9:59:49 AM
Reply

I have no interest in 3d or the move. How about just making a game that doesn't need to be patched once it is released!

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bridgera
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 10:56:51 AM
Reply

I think the move bundle is priced right at $99. Although you might wind up buying a 2nd controller and/or the Nav with it, putting it at $180 tops, but at least there are options, like holding off on the 2nd controller and Move until you get your hands on it. With 40+ Move titles at the end of the year, it should have some good games.

Kinect at $150 doesn't do it for me, they haven't shown me the ability to play games like SOCOM 4 with it. Maybe if they had some awesome games and a way to play games like Halo with it, but I haven't seen anything like that yet.

3D is still too new and too expensive at this point. The technology WILL improve, and the prices WILL drop. Maybe next gen it'll be bigger, but now I don't see it happening.

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Deleted User
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 12:30:24 PM
Reply

Ben, you were wrong. The $99 bundle DOES NOT come with the FULL MOVE SET.
Comes with: 1.) PS3 MOVE Motion Controller, retailed at $49.99 2.) PS3 Eye, retailed at $49.99 3.) Sport Champions, retailed at $39.99
Now buying them separately wouldn't be smart. Plus this bundle doesn't come with PS3 MOVE Navigation Controller, retailed at $29.99 You were wrong Ben :]

btw, Gamestop has a three day weekend of BUY 2 GET 1 FREE starting today!

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Lemon_Saint
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:02:22 PM
Reply

I'll pass on the 3D tv ... I'm still waiting on the holographic tv. Let's get our checklist:

1) Technology is available-(check, has been for awhile)

2) Porn industry backs it - (check, and a driving force behind a lot of new tech)

3) Is it past the year 2000-(check, hence, it is the future)

Where's my hologram tv?!?!

Last edited by Lemon_Saint on 6/18/2010 1:03:17 PM

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Highlander
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:07:19 PM

Holographic TV is not ready for primetime, it's not truly available outside he R&D labs. This is as bad as people saying that we didn't need BluRay and besides Holographic discs were already available. If they are, where are they? Oh, that's right, they aren't and weren't 4 years ago when everyone who disliked BluRay tried to promote them as being the true HD alternative.

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KING313
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 1:22:21 PM
Reply

I've been looking around for a 3d tv and bestbuy has some good deals on a few. I MAY BUY one before the year is out, however the move controllers I believe cost too much damn money. Move is targeted towards family gaming. Well, for 4 wands and 4 nav controllers your looking at 320 bucks not including sales taxes. THAT'S A LOT OF DOUGH! I believe you should get both pieces for 60-70 bucks and maybe 100 bucks for all three(nav, wand, PSeye)

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Highlander
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 2:05:22 PM

Why do you need 4 wand controllers? The standard Move controller set is 1 wand, 1 nave and the PSEye. Since a DS3 can double up as a nav controller and many already have a PSEye, the price of entry into 'Move' for most will be the cost of the wand controller. OK for some games you might need two wands, so you buy two. You still don't need to have more than one PSEye and if you're holding one of the wands in either hand, you need no extra nav controller.

People keep trying to price up Move by adopting a worst case scenario. How about a best case scenario. You already have a PS3, a PSEye and a DS3, so you spend $50 and buy a wand controller. Now you're ready for Move titles at $39.99 a piece. Seems rather inexpensive to me. Remember this is an accessory, not a new console purchase.

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Deleted User
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 9:25:48 AM

@HIGHLANDER The $99 MOVE SET DOES NOTT!!! I repeat.. DOES NOT come with the NAVIGATOR! Stop advertising something that is false

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Highlander
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 6:01:50 PM

@Logamus

I'm not advertising anything, and I have not said anything about the standard Move set coming with (or without) a nav controller.

What have said is that you can use the dualshock 3 instead of the nav controler so that if you already have the PSEye as many PS3 owners do, all you need is one Move controller (or two if you want to play games that use two).

So before you make a fool of yourself again, try to actually read my posts.

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THEVERDIN
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 4:44:38 PM
Reply

Does anyone know what games are in Sports Champion? As for the price $99 for the bundle seems ok. I would buy this right off if they bundled it with Sorcery.

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Orvisman
Friday, June 18, 2010 @ 6:53:08 PM
Reply

Here are two interesting reads:

PS3 Move:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/199107/playstation_move_e3_hands_on_precision_perfection.html

Kinect:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/199139/microsoft_kinect_e3_hands_on_were_missing_the_point.html?tk=hp_rev

The writer of both "reviews" makes a bold claim saying that going from Kinect to Move is like upgrading to high fidelity.

Last edited by Orvisman on 6/18/2010 6:58:38 PM

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Highlander
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 12:09:15 AM

That PCWorld piece on MOve is OK, but not well researched. The writer comments on how the Kinect is a high resolution version of the Eyetoy with audio. The exact quote is "Kinect is basically Sony's EyeToy with higher resolution tracking and audio input."

I have news for him, the PSEye is a high resolution EyeToy with audio input. Perhaps the writer at PC World simply doesn't know that?

Last edited by Highlander on 6/19/2010 12:10:45 AM

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BikerSaint
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 12:02:51 AM
Reply

Orvisman
Nice catch!

BTW, while surfing through that first link I noticed this other good link too...

Inside the Sports Champions, "Gladiator" game.
Hands-on with Sony's PlayStation Move(2 vid's)

http://www.techlicious.com/blog/hands-on-with-sonys-playstation-move/

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DemonNeno
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 12:37:09 AM
Reply

Here's what I'd say. If you want to appeal to the masses of gamers, you need to earn the attention.

PS3 earned it and it's now changing peoples minds. Price range. Prove me wrong! Since the Slim, the PS3 has been a raging success story, as far Sonys' sales are concerned.

Move means to do well, but money is evil. I mean it! We're at a financial explosion of epic failures and companies keep expecting their customers to pour more and more into their one product with a lifecycle stacking full of expenses.

Well if you pour too much, it'll spill. And that's what COULD happen to an excellent product. Sony needs to man up and soak up some of the Moves' pricetag. Make your customers WANT to buy it. Not just want it. That alone won't warrant what they need to achieve with the PS3s Half Life point dawning, if not dawned.

3D gaming won't happen to do so well. Prices are absurd and most importantly, as you may agree Ben, some of us cherish what we currently have. Expanding gameplay with 3D will certainly take back seat to the PS3 and really shine with PS4. Expanding on their values with hardware will ultimately make the populus happy.

This would be Sonys' chance to strike. With their impressive tools of imagery projection along with their R&D, they can make it possible to use a GPU strictly to render 3D via hardware and make it compatible for both 2D and 3D sets, the 2D being mostly used to get gamers feet "wet".

Move needs to become cheaper. It'll carry the PS3 along with more generalized masses willing to step away from the kiddish console. PS4 3D will set a new standard for two different dimensions of TVs and ultimately change how we watch our entertainment.

Hell, Sony can get really bold and introduce a product for the PS3 that'll add a "support" box that'll help push 3D imagery over 2D TV units. Again, not as good as a 3D TV w/ accelerated 3D support, but better than dumping another $1500+ on a 3D TV set.

Edit: Sorry, this post was all over the place! haha.. Storms keeping me up! Better than tornadoes, for sure though.

Last edited by DemonNeno on 6/19/2010 12:40:39 AM

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Highlander
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 1:45:30 AM

For 3D and all future HD gaming to work really well, the next generation of consoles need to go down the route of real time ray tracing. That is where the next step is - IMHO.

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DemonNeno
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 4:56:52 PM

That would be absolutely wicked to see ray-tracing finally strive in realtime! I haven't heard much news about it lately, but I can imagine it would be quite a feast to get it running. Whatever happened to the creation of an "RPU"?

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Highlander
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 6:02:21 PM

LOL! some would say that is what the CellBE is...

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DemonNeno
Sunday, June 20, 2010 @ 9:19:26 PM

Touche! It's evident that the only thing holding back the current Cell is in the form of code.

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johnld
Saturday, June 19, 2010 @ 2:12:23 AM
Reply

granted there are going to be games where multiple move controllers is a must but whats stopping them to create move games where the controller is shared by up to 4 people. you know light changes color means next player. that archery game could be one of those games. but 2 wands to be shared by 4 people just like how games for the wii can share wii remotes for each player. the tiger woods game can be be a candidate to play like that and basically any game that doesnt need you to have all four people on at the same time. they could have two at the same time then switch to the next two. As for me, i'm not really going to buy move so that i can host or play with other people. i'm buying it to try the games for myself. i'm in no rush to buy more accessories. i already have 4 dualshock 3s, 1 ps3 mic, the ps3 keypad, ps2 adapter, a dedicated external hard drive, ps3 remote, and a psp memory stick to back up my save files.

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Cravit8
Monday, June 21, 2010 @ 9:34:48 AM
Reply

It was brought up before by another poster at some point when he wondered will the Move keep up with his martial arts swiftness.

If the Eye only captures at 60FPS, I really wonder if that is fast enough. Does anyone know of an article documenting the fastest speed a hand can move and still be lag-free detectable with the Eye?
I say that because I really want to play tennis and ping pong on PS3 at realtime speeds. I've played the Wii at my nephews house, it blows. The graphics may be more of a turnoff to me than the actual crappy control that I just can't get the hang of.
And I really really REALLY want a lightsaber game.

Imagine Tennis on the PS3, at the graphic quality of other top sports titles etc IN FRACKIN 3D!

But it will all be in vein if the Eye isn't fast enough, and that's what I want to know.

Its funny to say, but I think what needed to happen was to have a Natal/Kinect type camera used on the PS3 with the move instead of the Eye. That would be gold.

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Cravit8
Monday, June 21, 2010 @ 9:42:30 AM

Ok, so help me out, I just saw the specs for the Eye and it says it captures 120FPS. I swore when reading about the move that its motion would be captured at 60FPS.
What framerate IS the Move being captured at? 120FPS would make my speed concerns void.

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