Hacking, Lawsuits, Big Business...This Is Still Gaming, Right?
See Full ImagePerhaps it was inevitable. But what was once a simple, harmless little hobby for a few of the less popular kids in school has now become "big business."
The term sends shudders through the long-time hardcore who naively wish things could've remained the same as always. We have to take the bad with the good. The advancements are amazing even though the nasty underbelly of the electronic world has, as of late, seemed...slimier.
Activision, Infinity Ward, two disgruntled former employees, and a multi-billion-dollar property. The legal facts are almost impossible to follow accurately and at the end of the day, it all boils down to the following: a bunch of very rich people jabbing at each other in an attempt to get richer. $100 advertising campaigns. The advent of casual/mainstream gaming, which essentially translates to "faster and dumber" (as just about anything that caters to the mass populace needs to be). The costs of...well, everything. Hackers attempting to play the role of patriots or revolutionaries or Robin Hoods or whatever the hell they do, which as far as I can tell translates to little more than a massive "look at me" complex.
Somewhere beneath it all lies the simple joy of a video game. I'm sure of it. It's there, even if we have to dig through several layers of slop to find it. No matter how advanced games get, the veteran gamers still play them for the same reasons. And those reasons are really quite tame; it has nothing to do with making a statement, making money, or posturing in any way, shape or form. It's just about living in a fantasy, virtual world for a few hours; an escape that is most necessary, especially these days. I just don't want everyone to lose sight of the heart of gaming because I swear, it still beats. Just focus on that and maybe the rest of it will just...go away.
Tags: games industry, video games, hacking, playstation 3
4/6/2011 9:16:05 PM Ben Dutka
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Comments (106 posts)
Underdog15
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:24:20 PM
7 up, 0 down
maxpontiac
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:01:33 AM
People need to learn that if they are unhappy with a product, move on from it.
This current generation of gaming, despite it's marvels, is one of "it's all about ME and what I want".
I must be getting old.
11 up, 4 down
Crabba
Sunday, April 10, 2011 @ 3:33:22 PM
0 up, 0 down
DirtySkillzHD
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 9:49:03 PM
Reply
Last edited by DirtySkillzHD on 4/6/2011 9:54:07 PM
2 up, 2 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:26:48 PM
5 up, 0 down
maxpontiac
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:57:22 AM
I for one will not play the classic modes often because re-spawning is where it is at!!
3 up, 0 down
Clamedeus
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:07:31 AM
3 up, 0 down
LittleBigMidget
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 9:56:42 PM
Reply
7 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:27:17 PM
6 up, 0 down
Excelsior1
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:01:19 PM
Reply
7 up, 1 down
Lord carlos
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:09:08 PM
Reply
Roman style
17 up, 2 down
sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:22:20 PM
4 up, 1 down
Underdog15
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:25:23 PM
7 up, 1 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:38:50 PM
10 up, 2 down
Dreno
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:10:49 PM
Reply
Nothing beats delving into a fantasy world where one can literally be anything or do anything they want. I know I can certianley speak for myself, but I think I can also speak for others when I say that.
Here's to letting you know that there are still atleast some gamers who game for the fun of it.
Here here.
8 up, 0 down
hehateme
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:16:47 PM
Reply
6 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:28:59 PM
2 up, 0 down
sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:21:19 PM
Reply
Last edited by sha4dowknight05 on 4/6/2011 10:21:29 PM
4 up, 1 down
main_event05
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 10:46:12 PM
Reply
5 up, 2 down
BIGRED15
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:20:46 PM
Reply
5 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:21:06 PM
Reply
4 up, 0 down
BikerSaint
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:43:00 PM
How's about a good game of "Snafu" on my Intellivision???
But since I've got a few more years on ya.....
Old school veteran of everything since the Tandy, Texas Instruments, & Commodore.
4 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:51:02 PM
4 up, 0 down
BikerSaint
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:04:52 AM
Well, I forget who I was talking too in an earlier thread(Damned CRS), but there's other gamer here that's 58 too, although I'm not sure if he's a collector too.
I_defenestrate,
Funny you should mention B-17 Bomber because I just bought that Intellivoice attachment & I had forgotten about that game, so "thanks".
Now I'll add that one to all the other Intellivoice games I'll be needing too.
2 up, 0 down
Qubex
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:22:38 AM
Q!
"play.experience.enjoy"
2 up, 0 down
SirLoin of Beef
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:22:57 AM
2 up, 0 down
BikerSaint
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:41:15 PM
I take it as you're meaning ALL games, right?
As of last Saturday, I just hit the "2,060 games" mark for ALL my games overall.
Also 21 consoles & 14 hand-helds(a few being doubles, as in my PS2 black fattie & White slim, plus different color schemes for my various GameBoy models & my 5 PSP's)
Last edited by BikerSaint on 4/7/2011 8:42:22 PM
1 up, 0 down
matt99
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:30:42 PM
Reply
7 up, 0 down
WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:37:23 PM
4 up, 1 down
Jed
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:07:16 AM
- Greedy bastards
Last edited by Jed on 4/7/2011 2:08:30 AM
6 up, 1 down
kraygen
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 11:54:53 PM
Reply
If you've hacked your ps3 to do weird and wonderful things get a job working with tech and when you need to vent your destructive feeling, go out into the country and break some stuff and set it on fire.
I play video games for the exact reasons Ben mentioned, I don't see the fun in trying to break a network. Play the game and let me play mine.
7 up, 1 down
frylock25
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 12:44:45 AM
Reply
5 up, 2 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 1:15:31 AM
Reply
Oh, but it's OK, Anonymous will 'protect' your consumer rights and freedoms by attacking Sony. And just how will these self proclaimed bastions of freedom and right do their work? By attacking PSN with a distributed denial of service attack, and going after the other SOny sites. Who suffers? Gamers. The same people that Anonymous claim to be protecting. Oh, but that's OK, according to Anonymous, we're just collateral damage, so they are protecting us by damaging us - logical right? Then there is their other tactic of attacking individual Sony employees *and* their families. Yes, these terrorists are targeting people such as Howard Stringer's kids. Now, what is it that you call people who attack innocent people and cause fear and terror? Oh, that's right terrorists, and criminals. That is all Anonymous are, terrorists. There was a time when they might have been something more, but now they are not. not they enable drive by script driven hacking which allows any yahoo with an ax to grind to become a nuisance.
The sooner this organization is investigated, identified and jailed the better. If they have consumer rights at heart, there are better ways to go about taking action. Targeting consumers as collateral damage and going after the children of the employees of a company is simple criminal activity and the acts of cowardly terrorists.
I keep remembering the line from Dune - the sleeper has awoken. Gamers are a relatively docile bunch, until you take our hobby down. Listen up Anonymous, you are not making friends, you are making enemies.
13 up, 1 down
Jed
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:16:09 AM
5 up, 1 down
Lawless SXE
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:23:39 AM
Peace.
4 up, 0 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:28:34 AM
The saddest part of this is that the small fry running the LOIC attack tool are the ones that get traced and generally have their IP service terminated. These same small fry could easily be prosecuted for computer misuse, but the 'leaders' behind the action take no such chance.
Last edited by Highlander on 4/7/2011 2:31:36 AM
3 up, 1 down
Lawless SXE
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:43:47 AM
5 up, 1 down
Clamedeus
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:24:52 AM
3 up, 1 down
Qubex
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:27:36 AM
How do you negotiate with that, and with a monster that has an ideology of sorts that is like a multi-headed hydra... it is a problem that will probably never go away... to be honest... I think it will get worse.
Q!
"play.experience.enjoy"
2 up, 0 down
Clamedeus
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:42:16 AM
My little brother for example thinks he knows everything and i keep proving him wrong but he still argues with me on things that he doesn't even know about and still insists he is right about it.
3 up, 0 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:35:46 AM
I agree, it's not a problem (in general) that will go away. the anonymity of the Internet enables all sorts of action that individuals would never take if they had to stand up for what they do.
Regarding negotiating, I have two problems there, 1) you never negotiate with terrorists, that legitimizes them, their aims and their conduct, and 2) who negotiates with who and under what boundaries? How do you know that you're negotiating in good faith with an organization that clearly acts beyond and above the law?
More generally (not replying to Qubex here)...
In all of this about Sony and GeoHot there are several aspects to it that I feel are completely neglected and ignored. The action against GeoHot and others is happening in a court of law. That means that every party to the case, or cases, has the ability to respond with legal action of their own. Sony as a corporation is subject to the same laws that we are, and can (and frequently are) sued by individuals, organizations and other corporations. Once again, in a court of law. There are legal remedies available. The problem is that the legal remedies do not always satisfy the sometimes selfish personal views of those involved - such as hackers like GeoHot, or the folks behind Anonymous. The fact that the law is inconvenient, or does not meet your preference does not entitle you to act beyond or outside of it. If we accept that the rule of law can be overridden because someone feels it's 'wrong' - as in this case, then we are implicitly saying that no law matters so long as one or more people think it's wrong.
Now, let that sink in for a minute. If we accept that because one or more people think a law is wrong, we can safely ignore it; what are we saying about the rule of law in general? What of people who don't think they should have to pay tax? What about those sick individuals that have (I'll be polite) deviant tastes that extend to very underage partners? If enough of them think that the law is wrong, does that mean it can be ignored? It's the same principle.
Not a nice thought huh?
Anyway, I agree with Qubex, in a general context this kind of action (so called hack-tivism) will get worse before it get's better. I personally see this kind of action in a different light because I no longer see it as a form of civil disobedience, it has crossed into cyber-war, or cyber-terrorism. But until people in general, governments, courts and organizations take it seriously, it will continue as is.
3 up, 1 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 11:02:21 AM
"It's more like a cult of stupidity. And the poor mindless sheep are the ones sent to the slaughteryard for the actions..."
I often call the mindless negative group-think and entitlement attitude that Internet anonymity enables - and the net users that are part of that group-think - the Eye of Moron. I think that anonymous is simply a slightly more concrete and dangerous realization of that same phenomenon. Anonymity enabled people to act in ways they never would in reality, it enabled thinking that does not survive scrutiny in reality, and the power of the 'net magnifies the ability to 'act' on that. On forums the Eye or moron takes the form of floods of negative posters who simply destroy the posting community by swamping it, and trolling it out of existence. In the form of Anonymous, the Eye of Moron has gained the ability to reach beyond the Internet into other areas of out lives. But at the end of the day, it is still a form of the collected stupidity, ignorance, immaturity, anger, entitlement, negativity, hate and anonymity of the Internet. This is, at the end of the day, the Eye of Moron, in action.
4 up, 1 down
BikerSaint
Friday, April 08, 2011 @ 12:19:25 AM
Anonymous Suspends Attacks on PlayStation Network
April 7, 2011
PSX-Scene offers a run-down of the ongoing war between Anonymous and Sony. The group had taken responsibility for attacks on PSN, which caused some users an "80710D36 error code." The group has reportedly suspended that operation. Sony has been saying that this is due to "maintenance."
In its latest public statement Anonymous claims that while it may have attacked the PlayStation Network earlier in the week, the group realizes that this affects Sony customers. Full statement below, taken from AnonNews:
"Greetings, Sony Customers And PS3 Users. We are Anonymous........
Read the whole article here:
http://www.gamepolitics.com/2011/04/07/anonymous-suspends-attacks-playstation-network
0 up, 1 down
richfiles
Monday, April 11, 2011 @ 3:01:09 PM
There were already rumors of Other OS being ditched, and even for the empty promises that Sony would keep Other OS, they intentionally crippled the power available to the user in Other OS to prevent people from being able to have access to the PS3's full graphic capabilities in a PC OS environment. Bypassing the Hypervisor allowed, among many things, the capacity to utilize the full power of the PS3 hardware when running Linux under Other OS. This massively boosted the power available for PC software, including opening up entirely new avenues of CREATION capability to content creators that wanted to play with the PS3 hardware, but don't have the distribution and dev kits of large developers. These are not pirates. These are hobbyists that want to use the hardware they bought for the purpose they bought it for.
Have you used Sony's browser. Have you used their video player. They are trash. Come on now! The dedicated hacker hacks to enhance, to improve. The hacks I hate the little DBs that hack games for an unfair online advantage. In all honesty, companies should always be checking the data from players online to make sure they aren't doing impossible things. You hate cheaters online, but off line, you pump restore health and no stars codes into GTA4 to have unsettling levels of fun wreaking havoc on Liberty City. No one complains about that, cause it's offline. Online hacks cheat people. People who do such idiotic things should be banned. No one gives a rats as$ about the offline cheater. Why do people not realize that there are those who want to "cheat" by using their own choice of browser, or media player, or their own choice of homebrewed games. Is piracy possible, yeah, I'm certain it is, but it's lame. I buy my games used at GameStop. Sometimes, I find them online for cheap. I find a way to own them legit. What many people want, quite frankly, is a jailbreak for the the PS3. It's about more than piracy, more than cheating online, and more than showboating by hackers. Jailbreaking is serious business.
The word hacker has been tarnished by the idiots who download a script and use it for online cheating, or who ride the coat tails of creators to use it as an in to piracy. That gaming industry you love so much was built on the backs of the hackers you now hate Those "homebrew" games you hear about are what the entire world of video games once was. A few programmers creating titles either on their own, and eventually for companies. A scientist in a lab creating "Tennis for Two" using analog circuitry, and an oscilloscope. Setting up a "PONG" arcade in a bar and becoming overnight millionaires over it. Developing a compact personal computer that could display color graphics, in a garage... That eventually became the company that put 10000 songs in your pocket. iHope you can guess who they are!
Another thing I hate, is when I hear people say Sony removed Other OS because it was used to hack the PS3. People, GeoHot didn't need Other OS to acquire the data for his exploit. It just was the simpler route. GeoHot used an FPGA chip with code to intercept internal signal inside his PS3. He had to solder the chip onto his PS3 motherboard. That's how he got the information to get access beyond what the hypervisor allowed. Using that technology, he would have cracked it eventually, even without Linux or Other OS.
Sony was simply tired of supporting and bug testing for compatibility, a feature that it had made the public and the buyers aware of before sale, but that made them no money and competes for your time against the services and products they sell or profit from. If you use Linux to play games, browse the web, watch videos, etc, you aren't using Sony's licensed games, you aren't renting video from PSN, and you're not only browsing where Sony's crippled browser lets you. None of these things are illegal, but Sony whipped out the old ban hammer on Other OS under generic security and piracy threats. Notice that Slim models, which NEVER had Other OS, as well as updated, NO OTHER OS phat models both seem to mysteriously be hackable, despite the removal of Other OS. Sony even backed away from the statement that OTher OS was removed to combat piracy or even as a security concern. Sony knew what they were doing. They saw an out, and they took it... Took it from those of use that USED that feature.
Sony wanted an excuse to take the feature away and focus on it's pay services. You can alter your user agent in a browser running under Linux, and with some tricks restore things like the free HuLu service is possible, if you know what you're doing. HuLu watches for those key identifiers in the PS3 browser's user agent data to prevent you from accessing the FREE HuLu site, and suddenly Sony and HuLu are offering premium services at a cost. This is the type of anti consumer garbage that Sony thrives on. They cut access that PC users have for free, so they could make a premium service more palatable. The same premium service that competes with free service on OPEN PS hardware. This is why a PS3 Jailbreak is so important. Sony has complete control over how you use a product you purchased. Sony says that just because you bought it, it doesn't mean you really own it. They want to make the claim that since it runs their software, they still own all aspects of the software and you have no rights to change it or even remove it if you don't care for it.
At least here in America, the government has ACKNOWLEDGED the legitimacy and need for cellphone jailbreaking. Computers are typically sold completely open for a user to install and delete software as they see fit. The PS3 WAS a powerful computer, but Sony was crippling it, and GeoHot was trying to uncripple the system. Sony's response... amputation!
There is a reason I hate Sony with all the hate I can muster. All their previous legal and privacy shenanigans have killed any trust or faith I might have ever have once mustered for them. "GTL-Balad of Gay Sony" Is my PSN comment. "Grand Theft Linux; The Ballad of Gay Sony" is my parody of the similar sounding Rockstar GTA DLC "Grand Theft Auto: The Ballad of Gay Tony". It will remain that way a long as Sony continues to STEAL features I paid for. I have also already made my protest in CASH. I have purchased a Nintendo 3DS, and will not put one penny toward the NGP. Deep down in my heart, I'm hoping the NGP fails as hard as the PSP did. I don't care HOW powerful their system is. I don't trust Sony anymore. I don't trust them enough for me to feel safe in buying an NGP. As a GameStop employee, I make an active effort to buy my games used. I get an employee discount, and my purchase does not send any additional revenue to Sony. I guide customers to the 360 and Wii sections when ever I have the opportunity.
As for the Anonymous attacks, once they realized their attack was impacting the PSN, they quickly withdrew to regroup their attack to focus on Sony corporate, and not harm the gaming community. Anonymous is dynamic enough to know when to back down. People like to FORGET that little fact. They are heroes to me, though they would say they're just doing it for the lulz. Truth is, they are pissed at Sony for their douchebagery. They repeatedly try to use the law as a tool for the invasion of privacy.
Screw Sony.
I'm sick of Sony.
Sony can sink into the ocean for all I care... Then wat do?
1 up, 1 down
Underdog15
Monday, April 11, 2011 @ 4:52:35 PM
For someone who has yet to prove their intellectual prowess on this site, I refuse to read such an incredibly long post.
I read the last 3 lines though. Afterwards, I'm glad I avoided the rest.
0 up, 1 down
Lawless SXE
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:21:13 AM
Reply
You know, I do play games to relax, and I try to ignore all of the big business surrounding it. yes, I've announced here before my utter contempt for Activision and their practices, but that's only because I know about all of that. I know about the GeoHot debacle, and I think he's in the wrong. The only thing that he managed to do was pirate games, not improve the functionality of the system. I know about the Anonymous attack. I thought they were right to take on the Church of Scientology (not wanting to bring up a religious debate, so please don't start), but to say they're trying to protect the rights of people, when the people are in the wrong is ridiculous.
I wish that I could ignore all of this. I wish that I could just forget about it all, but as long as I want gaming information, I will continue to come across this underbelly. It's unavoidable and unfortunate, but we must take the good with the bad in this life. For me, gaming is an escape. It's something I do for pleasure, and I hope that it stays that way forevermore, and that I don't get too bogged down in the seedy affairs of business that I lose sight of the simple enjoyment that I receive as I play through a great game.
Thank you Ben for writing this editorial.
Peace.
2 up, 1 down
FxTales
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:53:47 AM
Reply
3 up, 4 down
___________
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 4:18:07 AM
the problem is other OS was a ADVERTISED FEATURE!
heaps of people like me bought a ps3 partly because of that, i was using it every day to complete my OS1 and OS2 course.
once it was removed i had a choice loose PSN and the ability to play recent games and movies.
or loose linux.
so sony are forcing you to choose between 3 advertised features, and giving you the choice which ones to loose.
thats why there still getting sued in the other OS court case!
that is why the ps3 got jailbroken!
that is why there having all these DOS attacks on there domains.
sony brought this on themselves!
they did the right thing in protecting there property, but that does not give them the right to remove a advertised feature!
what they should of and easily could of done is make the FW update forceable but not required for PSN and game access like they have done for a few others.
they did that for a few updates, so why not do it for that?
ill tell you why, it was not to plug a security hole, it was to keep IBM happy!
IBM had the sh*tts because the air force was sending sony there money instead of IBM.
just a little coincidental the time the other OS was removed, sony denied the last request from the air force?
just coincidental that was the last time the air force asked to buy more?
sorry, but thats too coincidental to just be a coincidence!
1 up, 10 down
sawao_yamanaka
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 4:36:32 AM
9 up, 1 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:40:19 AM
Who removed it? Did Sony push an auto-installing update to your system and force it's removal? Or did *you* take the decision to download and install the update in the knowledge that it would disable the OtherOS feature?
You were the one thsat removed OtherOS from your system, you ran the update, you gave your agreement twice at least to the removal of OtherOS during that process because as I remember it it clearly stated that OtherOS would be disabled and you had to agree and then it double checked at least once before the update was performed.
Sony supplied an update that was mandatory for continued access to their (emphasis on THEIR) network, but not mandatory for your PS3 to continue functioning. They gave you the option of not installing it. You were free to purchase another PS3 which could be kept up to date for PSN access, and nothing you'd purchased on PSN was removed or deleted or restricted.
At the end of the day, anyone who wanted to, *really* wanted to, could have kept OtherOS.
4 up, 1 down
___________
Friday, April 08, 2011 @ 8:46:20 AM
of course you could of, but as i said you have to choose between linux, or PSN, games and movies.
all 3 which were advertised features!
if toshiba sold you a laptop, then found out there were vulnerabilities in the DVD drive does that give them the right to disable it?
you can use the system, just buy a external one.
1 up, 0 down
Highlander
Friday, April 08, 2011 @ 2:12:25 PM
You have no name, so what else should we do than make one up? At least mine is consistent. Would you prefer I called you Anonymous Coward - as most anonymous commenters are elsewhere? Pick a name and live by it, don't pick a name and live with multiple interpretations on how to handle the lack of name.
OtherOS was a) never a core component of the PS3, b) not required for it's primary or secondary uses, c) not advertized as a feature, it was always pitched as an optional extra, d) as was pointed out, Sony did not remove it, they gave you the option of removing it.
Had Sony unilaterally removed OtherOS without making it an optional update, I would agree with the point you are making. The key point here is that at the time the new firmware omitting OtherOS capability was launched, installing it did not interrupt the use of any of your existing PS3 functions. What happened was that your ability to use the PlayStation Network was curtailed. Retail games continued to work, so long as they did not rely on any new feature in any newer firmware. Games already purchase continued to work, and BluRays continued to play. You could even go on to the internet without PSN.
Yes, the impact of not installing the newer firmware was that the Playstation Network service, a service you do not pay for, became unavailable. However that was not a direct impact, it is an indirect one because it is the terms of service of PSN that require the use of the most up to date firmware. The PS3 itself will quite happily continue working without updating.
I've had this discussion before with others, and at the end of the day, you cannot escape the simple fact that you elected to install the new firmware for your own reasons.
At the same time as the modification to the firmware to remove OtherOS, the PS3 slim arrived without OtherOS. New product, new price, free extra feature no longer present, owners of Slim systems knew it would not handle OtherOS when they bought them.
You can choose to accept Sony's reasons for removing OtherOS. Reasons of security and cost have been given. the truth is that it's probably a bit of both.
However, your consumer rights were not trampled on, as I said in my previous post, you lost nothing, you had a choice and exercised it. You could always have kept OtherOS and purchased a separate system for gaming.
The catalyst for removing OtherOS from older systems was GeoHot. The catalyst for removing OtherOS from Slim systems and beyond was cost. Anyone who had OtherOS and lost it can truly lay the blame at the feet of Mr EgoHot. Anyone who bought a Slim knew it did not come with OtherOS - no loss/no blame there.
0 up, 1 down
___________
Saturday, April 09, 2011 @ 9:46:38 AM
BS i lost nothing!
thanks to sony i had to go out and spend 1500 bucks on a laptop so i could continue my OS1 and OS2 courses.
1 up, 1 down
Mornelithe
Monday, April 11, 2011 @ 2:36:10 PM
You could've also, spent....$300 and bought a new PS3, leaving the one you were using for educational purposes untouched, right? I'm sorry, but you had choices, and chose differently. That's hardly Sonys fault.
1 up, 1 down
richfiles
Monday, April 11, 2011 @ 8:08:24 PM
OK, So what if you want to shut OFF the included software? Does Sony have the right to refuse to allow you to shut down the software that is pre installed. That's what the original GeoHot hack was reaching for, and that is what is at stake. Completely shutting down the hypervisor, to unlock all the restrictions that Sony placed to interfere with Linux was the original goal of accessing hypervisor.
As I said in my tl:dr post, This is all about JAILBREAKING, and the cheats and pirates do need to be dealt with, but at least here in the USA, the government HAS established that there is a legitimate need for jailbreaking cellphones. They have authorized exceptions to the DMCA to make it LEGAL to jailbreak many models of cellphone, and to allow users to install 3rd party apps, remove unwanted components, and access features that cellular providers may have blocked.
Tell me why it is OK for cellphones, but not OK for Game consoles? Dirtbags have already made spyware and viruses on the android platform. Does that mean that Android shouldn't be open? There have been examples of malware making it's way onto jailbroken iPhones. Does that mean the iPhones should all be re-locked? NO!
This is a jailbreaking issue, not a piracy or cheating issue. Yes, those are potential consequences, but Sony needs to go after pirates and cheaters, not the jailbreakers, because the positive benefits of jailbreaking are equally legitimate to game consoles as they are to cell phones.
Sony also needs to cut out the obscene invasion of privacy they are so well known for.
---
and
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@Mornelithe
So... you're blaming the customer, who bought a system, knowing it had a capability shipped with it, because the company made it public knowledge.... You're blaming him for having to spend money to solve the problem caused by Sony's update. That's just simply stupid. Sony forced him to spend money. Whether it was $1500 or $300, they took a feature they publicized away, and it cost consumers.
Sony, by definition, has removed at least $300 in functionality from those who choose to retain older firmware, as that is the cost to recover their gaming.
Sony offers NO RECOURSE to any individual who suffers a hardware failure. All repaired systems are updated without any option to refuse.
Sony has removed at least $100 in additional functionality from some older consoles, as NO NEW REPLACEMENT console can offer PS2 backwards compatibility. If an older console is dedicated to computing, then even if it features backwards compatibility, it may become inconvenient to use as the machine for that purpose, as it is no longer considered a gaming console and may not be set up for convenient gaming based play. A New PS2 is $100.
Does Chrysler warning you ahead of time make it any more ethical, if they announced that they are going to update all their cars ECMs to disable navigation features, because they don't want to support it anymore? I see NO difference. Sony sold me a feature, then removed it. It would cost me $300 to replace that feature. That's theft in my eyes, a bait and switch. I will never trust Sony again. I really do hate that company with a passion.
Last edited by richfiles on 4/11/2011 8:32:49 PM
0 up, 0 down
Mornelithe
Tuesday, April 12, 2011 @ 11:14:05 PM
I thought it was pretty clear what I blamed. Blank specifically stated he needed the functionality for OS1 and OS2 courses. If that were the case, updating firmware really shouldn't have been a priority, right? Even further, knowing exactly how frequent Blank is on this page, it's not just unlikely but outright impossible he wasn't aware of the update prior to it going live. I'm neither condoning, nor condemning what Sony has done. I'm saying he had the choice, and he chose games, movies and a $1500 alternative to...spending $300 on a new PS3.
You can go ahead and cite any enconomic example you desire, I really don't care. I never used OtherOS, and I think everyone complaining conveniently forgets every thing Sony has added to the PS3 and PSN since the PS3 launched...for free. It sucks, but them's the breaks. Sony lost a ton of money on the PS3, not only R/D, but years of selling the console at a loss, and people still complain that Sony doesn't do anything positive. Well, sorry Son, I have no sympathy for him, or anyone who willingly makes a silly decision when the choice to avoid it is staring them right in the face. It is not a sign of intelligence, to pay 5x the amount of money necessary to fix a problem.
EDIT: Btw, just to avoid any confusion, I have the original 60g CECHA-01 Model, and I'm not only 100% satisfied with my interaction with Sony thus far this generation, I'm most certainly purchasing their next home system and likely the NGP.
Last edited by Mornelithe on 4/12/2011 11:21:02 PM
0 up, 1 down
spiderboi
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:59:48 AM
Reply
7 up, 2 down
BikerSaint
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:10:40 AM
Reply
7 up, 0 down
Clamedeus
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:34:26 AM
But i think pirates are still cool though. =(
1 up, 0 down
RX78Zero
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:23:43 AM
Reply
4 up, 0 down
RX78Zero
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:53:58 AM
Reply
And now we have hackers who broke the sercurity of the PS3 and others who are attacking PSN networks, Sony sites, and their familes too.
Sony seems to have the roughest obstacle of any company i know of.
1 up, 3 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:53:06 AM
In the end, it will all be settled out of court, but if it goes on long enough, LG will find their claims about BluRay dismissed.
4 up, 0 down
___________
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 4:10:48 AM
Reply
its all about living in a fantasy doing things we would never be able to do.
so why do developers have to come in and burst that bubble?
oh noooooooo you cant go over that jump in your car that would be faaaaaaaaar too unrealistic!
oh nooooooooooo you cant go bumper cars off people that would be faaaaaaaaaar too unrealistic!
WHO GIVES A GOD DAM CRAP, GAMES ARE SUPPOSE TO BE UNREALISTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thats the problem with games these days!
instead of developers letting us live out our fantasys, there trying to bring the fantasy into a reality, into real life thus destroying it!
tis why i always say i can see this gen being my last gen of gaming because were heading in the direction of all flashy effects and no real fun factor.
its all about seriousness, and and flashy effects, when it should be about quirkiness and living a fantasy.
games like bulletstorm are a dying breed!
fun for funs sake, stupid perverse jokes, silly weapons, perverse humor.
thats what games are suppose to be about, not this serious suit BS!
honestly i feel like games are done by army drill sargents at times, your not allowed to have a smile on your face otherwise its 250 push ups!
thats why i got a wii, simply because its the only console which lets you go back to the old days the way games use to be like!
super mario brothers wii is the most fun i have had playing a game released this gen, ever!
give me scarface, the older GTAs, mario, zelda, crash, duke, doom, over the new GOWs, COD, GTA, any day of the week!
why is duke nukem so popular?
its a gaming icon not because it was so ahead of its time, or it was a amazing game.
its because of its humor!
nothing is taking a joke too far, nothing is unjokeable and nothing is taken seriously!
2 up, 16 down
Lawless SXE
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 5:35:26 AM
Sure, things may seem to be on a downhill slope, but that doesn't mean it'll continue. Seriously... here's your project for when you log on and write your posts tomorrow: No negativity whatsoever. You write positive, hopeful responses to whatever articles you choose to respond to, and we all see how it feels. What says PSXE? More importantly, what say you?
P.S. Watch Bad Boys 2 and "Woo-sah" along with Marcus and Mike.
8 up, 1 down
Lord carlos
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:01:52 AM
12 up, 2 down
Qubex
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:29:32 AM
From what I have experienced many titles are far out and unrealistic so I don't know why he is having such an identity crisis this time around...
Q!
"play.experience.enjoy"
Last edited by Qubex on 4/7/2011 8:31:15 AM
5 up, 0 down
___________
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:36:56 AM
thinking games will go back to the way they were, is like thinking aliens are going to come and take over the world tomorrow!
not going to happen!
im just sick of having to go to my older systems to enjoy playing games, why cant i do that on the ps3 and PC?
games these days are so freaking boring mostly because they take themselves so seriously, and have absolutely no sense of humor what so ever!
as i said before they feel like they were made by a army sargent, you cant have a smile on your face otherwise its 250 push ups for you!
everything has to be so god dam serious!
just like what mark rein said just before bulletstorm released.
games are like Audis when i want them to be like lambos.
there suits, instead of outrages looking things with freaking flamethrowers and rocket launchers hanging off the sides!
thats why people hate Audis, because there such a boring typical business car, so plain, so boring, so conforms.
thats what todays games are like, the boring suit, instead of the exciting outrages bull!
there so restrictive too, cant do this, cant do that, cant go there, cant do that.
why?
why cant i just go wherever i want, and do whatever i want?
if i had a buck for every millionth game that suffered from severe invisible wall syndrome id be a multimillionaire by now!
2 up, 8 down
Lotusflow3r
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:40:42 AM
Back then, things didn't have to make sense ala floating platform, today, there has to be an explanation for it. Today's games may be unrealistic in nature, say, alien invasion, but it tries to be realistic in the approach, say, how we actually might act, realistic blood etc, etc.
Back then, it wasn't like that, you actually had huds, lives, score, funny sound fx...or like in Zelda, pull a switch and a chest appears from no where to an iconic jingle sound. MGS had a perfect balance, it was semi-serious, but always reminded you it was a game with it's emoticon icons above heads, huds, funny sfx for e.g. if you didn't have the right key you'd hear a buzz, talk of the controler in cut scenes etc.
Think of a Mario 64 and then a platformer of today, the latter just wants to be a pixar movie most of the time. There's no magic, no charm.
It's not entirely absent today, but it's increasingly dying in favour of movie scripts.
It's hard to explain the difference without being face to face instead of text, but the magic defined by gaming is not favoured today.
The core Japanese industry are still intact, they still release games...and not movie wannabe's all the time.
Personally, i like a bit of both, BUT only if the more realistic side offered me something new like Heavy Rain, or was inbetween and reminded you its a game like MGS or a RDR.
I'm happy with the industry, but less enthusiastic about it when i don't want to be. I just crave the game formulas we had when the industry wasn't as mainstream. I do find a lot of enjoyment out of PSN titles now or throwback titles like 3D Dot.
You can like what you like, it doesn't bother me, but this is just from someone who's a little concerned about something we all have in common.
:)
Last edited by Lotusflow3r on 4/7/2011 9:43:08 AM
6 up, 0 down
Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:35:04 AM
15 up, 3 down
sha4dowknight05
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 1:59:32 PM
Do everyone a favour and don't post anymore. You could of chosen a better name to go by then a big line.
4 up, 2 down
DazeOfWar
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:03:01 PM
He reminds me of Napolean Dynamite's brother who was still living in the past in a van out in the field. Still thinks he's going to be a big football star or Al Bundy always talking about how he got 4 touchdowns in HS football. The 80's are over buddy time to cut the hair and move on.
5 up, 0 down
Underdog15
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 5:40:30 PM
5 up, 0 down
leatherface
Friday, April 08, 2011 @ 1:35:33 PM
if i had a buck for every thumbs down you've gotten, i'd be a multimillionaire by now!
2 up, 1 down
Wissam
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 5:13:02 AM
Reply
are just what ben described them. (look at me)
I just play my game and that's it. best of luck
to everyone.and I hope no gamer will be effected
by the attacks of these morons.
Last edited by Wissam on 4/7/2011 5:14:38 AM
2 up, 1 down
Lotusflow3r
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 6:27:55 AM
Reply
It's why i'm so big on Duke atm. He is needed. He represents THAT time and a game that doesn't give a fack about anything, but pure FUN.
Eventually, we ALL gotta come back home.
4 up, 2 down
Qubex
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:32:12 AM
Q!
"play.experience.enjoy"
Last edited by Qubex on 4/7/2011 8:32:40 AM
3 up, 2 down
Lotusflow3r
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:19:14 AM
Reading it, he makes good points, especially towards the end.
I've been playing PS1 games more lately, i'm growing tired of today's logic. Not entirely, but the mainstream is growing tired, despite what looks like a spike in quality this year.
I got Doom on the go atm, absolutely refreshing. Not one FPS game can rival that today....and that was '93. Not a good sign.
On the by, i heard it said that Doom 4 will be closer to the original than Doom 3.....we'll see.
0 up, 1 down
Lotusflow3r
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 11:04:26 AM
0 up, 1 down
Scarecrow
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:53:22 AM
Reply
That will forever go down in the books of history as fact.
-bad hardware that burns up in a few months
-exploiting genres just to make money (FPS)
-Talking trash about the competition
-Not innovating gaming at all (holding gaming back. 360 is just a powered up xbox with DVDs)
Well documented.
Last edited by Scarecrow on 4/7/2011 9:54:38 AM
7 up, 2 down
SirLoin of Beef
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:35:29 AM
4 up, 4 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:42:29 AM
Wonder how many of the small fry running LOIC are also Xbox 360 fans....
Raging against Sony would fit their world view nicely.
Last edited by Highlander on 4/7/2011 10:42:48 AM
7 up, 0 down
SirLoin of Beef
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:48:17 AM
4 up, 1 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:55:30 AM
Still I do wonder why Sony managed to enrage Anonymous by suing GeoHot, but Microsoft were not attacked by the same group despite banning about a million Xbox 360s and accounts in one pass last year - for modding their consoles. It would seem that Microsoft took far more concrete and injuring action against a huge number of people than Sony has ever thought of doing. Yet Anonymous was strangely silent in the face of an attack on a million gamers consumer rights...
Makes you wonder huh?
4 up, 1 down
SirLoin of Beef
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 11:03:58 AM
4 up, 0 down
Highlander
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 11:18:08 AM
6 up, 0 down
sha4dowknight05
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 2:08:21 PM
Microsoft is holding back the industry? I thought the WII was? The 360 can push out good graphics that are even better than the ps3 in some games. When it comes to exclusives the only best are Gears of War, Halo Reach (notice on reach not the entire series) and forza 3. Crysis 2 is an exception as it's better on 360 then ps3.
We have a more powerful processor but a weaker graphics card than the 360. I just wish Nividia did a uniformed like the 360 so more pixels or whatever could be pushed out on the ps3 so we get better framerates.
I thought the heat sink for the older 360 was a joke. No wonder why they rrod. The newer slim has a good heat sink with both chips combined in 1 so that solves quite a bit of problems in ways.
Last edited by sha4dowknight05 on 4/7/2011 2:08:31 PM
0 up, 6 down
Mornelithe
Monday, April 11, 2011 @ 12:45:36 PM
Basically DX9-11, while it shows us some great things, restricts access to the hardware greatly. To the point where it actually hinders developers abilities to squeeze more and more out of the hardware they're working on. This is more of a PC Issue, however, as consoles simply lack the hardware for it to be a big deal. But, the added access would make for much more finely designed games.
2 up, 0 down
Mornelithe
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 10:55:34 AM
Reply
Yes, I do believe gaming was much better 10 years ago. Because honestly, I think catering to the biggest demographic possible is simply a way to crush ingenuity, and creativity. Why bother, when you can simply make another on-rails shooter, and force feed it to those who don't know any better?
Back in the day, shitty games tanked. Now? A good marketing strategy can still shift 2+ million units of a crappy title, just because the consumer has really lost their interest in researching their purchases.
7 up, 0 down
DazeOfWar
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 3:07:53 PM
Reply
I love looking at the collection of games I have and thinking about the devolpers that worked hard to put the entertainment into my hands.
2 up, 0 down
sha4dowknight05
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 6:55:54 PM
3 up, 0 down
Lairfan
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 8:22:26 PM
Reply
And sadly, when I do hear all these ridiculous stories about corporate stupidity and hacker personal rights BS, I see the beginnings of the scumminess that is commonly found in the movie and music industries today. A different form of it to be sure, but its definitely similar. Its only going to get worse from here though.
Good editorial Ben. Actually, you always make great editorials that make us think about things, so thank you for that.
0 up, 0 down
AnonWTF
Thursday, April 07, 2011 @ 9:35:30 PM
Reply
0 up, 0 down
Banky A
Sunday, April 10, 2011 @ 1:47:01 PM
Reply
0 up, 0 down
smythe86
Sunday, April 10, 2011 @ 5:01:29 PM
Reply
I would have to attribute the decline in gaming to the same things that have led to a decline in television programming. Children. The next generation of gamers if you will. More and more I get on Black-Ops, and am annoyed by children, and childish behavior. In one match a 12 year old ran behind me the whole game firing his pistol to give away my position (i had ghost-pro). New gamers want mindlessly attractive fun. They want something that looks awesome and is easy to play, but requires no actual skill level. I am tired of seeing .18 KDR ratios in online shooters. And the dumbing down of button mapping to make it easier for people. There are certainly games that should cater to younger crowds and less hardcore gamers... but when EVERY game begins to do that... that is a huge issue. The original MotorStorm was a huge favorite of mine, because if you didnt take time to master the game, and the tracks, you wouldn't win the races.
My point being is that the new generation wants pretty and simple... not good and compelling, and that seems to be where all publishers are going these days.
1 up, 0 down
Excelsior1
Reply
Wednesday, April 06, 2011 @ 9:37:16 PM
the big business side of gaming can be somewhat of a turnoff especially when companies start boasting how their games will be all that, and they don't deliver.
Last edited by Excelsior1 on 4/6/2011 9:41:53 PM