PS3 News: Sony Issues PSN Q&A, Confirms Law Enforcement Involvement - PS3 News

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Sony Issues PSN Q&A, Confirms Law Enforcement Involvement

If you have any questions about the PlayStation Network debacle, head over to the PlayStation Blog and check out the new Q&A.

Important questions such as "Was my personal data encrypted?" and "Was my credit card data taken?" are addressed, and right off the bat, Sony says they are "currently working with law enforcement on this matter." They've also enlisted the help of a recognized technology security firm for the sake of a "complete investigation." Obviously, Sony feels strongly about what happened, and they make it plain-

"This malicious attack against our system and against our customers is a criminal act and we are proceeding aggressively to find those responsible."

They also make it clear that in regards to personal data, "access was restricted both physically through the perimeter and security of the network." Then they give you some suggestions concerning steps you can take to protect your personal data; specifically, be on the lookout for "email, telephone, and postal scams that ask for personal or sensitive information." Sony will never contact you for this stuff, so ignore any "official" requests you might see.

Oh, and they do confirm that everyone has been notified, and they've "already taken several immediate steps to add protections for your personal data." Read up on that paragraph; it's a little comforting. ...a little.

Tags: psn, psn outage, playstation network, sony

4/27/2011 8:44:18 PM Ben Dutka

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Comments (151 posts)

THEVERDIN
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 9:39:32 PM
Reply

Back when the PS2 came out and they stated that you would be able to hook up and play MP and internet, I thought that probably isn't such a good idea. Years later it turns out like this.

Agree with this comment 2 up, 7 down Disagree with this comment

Killa Tequilla
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 9:55:28 PM

You should have said that way back before Ps2 was able to go into internet when internet itself was created.

Agree with this comment 3 up, 1 down Disagree with this comment

BikerSaint
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:27:04 PM

Sega's Dreamcast was the 1st online

Agree with this comment 6 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:46:07 AM

Dreamcast ftw.

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RadioHeader
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:32:05 AM

PS3 ftw

Greatest electrical appliance evar. F*ck you, hackers!

Agree with this comment 8 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

FatherSun
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 9:39:33 PM
Reply

Book 'em Dano!

Agree with this comment 5 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

tornado03
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:46:20 PM

Bad boys, whatcha want
Watcha want, whatcha gonna do?
When sheriff John Brown come for you
Tell me whatcha wanna do, whatcha gonna do?

Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?
Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?

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cLoudou
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 9:45:13 PM
Reply

They also stated that security codes of CC could not have been taken as they were not required of the PSN.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 9:52:16 PM
Reply

I hope they arrest those responsible... for this scroll bar.

They even gave this about 15 seconds of coverage on the regular news, lol.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:01:52 PM

I'm not diggin the scroll bar either. :(

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dkmrules
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:03:47 PM

This scroll bar is pretty annoying, please return the comments to beta!

edit: found the toggle scrolling switch, its all good now

Last edited by dkmrules on 4/27/2011 10:08:17 PM

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LimitedVertigo
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:04:53 PM

Ugh...ya....I can't get the scroll to disable. It's beyond annoying.

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FatherSun
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:10:27 PM

Ditto. Disable button not functioning.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:12:06 PM

Toggle ability non-functional in latest Firefox: Confirmed.

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tes37
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:17:38 PM

The scroll bar sucks, I can't toggle it off. Maybe it's the crap windows os I'm using.

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tes37
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:29:28 PM

It just started working for me. I think you have to toggle it before you do any scrolling.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:31:49 PM

Nice find TES.

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LimitedVertigo
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:01:22 PM

Still doesnt work for me Tes. :(

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tes37
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:08:26 PM

I reloaded the page using my web browser, not the reload comments button. I didn't scroll at all in the comments section, I hit the toggle button and waited a few seconds and the scroll bar disappeared and hasn't returned on subsequent reloads.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:08:49 PM

me either, it just jumps to the top. reload comments doesnt work either.

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LimitedVertigo
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:25:56 PM

Thanks Tes!!!

World try hitting the "Toggle Scrolling" button than refresh your page. Doing that worked for me.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:37:59 AM

okay its gone! Hallelujah, that thing is a piece of sh*t.

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Excelsior1
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:00:02 AM

ha!! great one world. scroll bar was pretty bad. toggle for it didn't work either.

Last edited by Excelsior1 on 4/28/2011 9:03:38 AM

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sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:00:17 PM
Reply

I just am worried about my password it's my main priority.

I just hope they didn't get a chance at anybody's personal information, but really people stoop this low for credit cards and people's information like this.

Just hope xbox live gets hacked to get even. For real, that would stir-up more problems like innocent people and stuff. You get my point? But xbots need a taste of this, and regardless of how many innocent people had their information compromised on XBOX LIVE there is, XBOX LIVE needs a taste of this, just to get even and so the little xbots can keep their mouths closed.

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Killa Tequilla
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:06:56 PM

Why would you want Xbox to get hacked, I mean c'mon...
It's 1 thing hating Xbox, but it's another thing when you want some sort of vengeance. It's only going to affect innocent people...

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FatherSun
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:11:16 PM

Lets not stoop to that level.

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sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:12:16 PM

I know, I clearly stated it, but the number of bashers and xbots is too high it out weighs the number innocent people. Sure we have some immature people on PSN too, but I just can't stand xbots.

What's been done has been done, I just hope to get even I was innocent and got striked by this bad news.

AS JFK SAID: "Don't get mad, get even."

Simply doing what he said, that's it.

Just for the innocents of xbox live which there isn't much, blame it on the other loud potty mouths you have over there.

Last edited by sha4dowknight05 on 4/27/2011 10:13:59 PM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:13:47 PM

I share your concern that this atrocity fuels the console war and fanboyism, but nobody deserves to have their personal info stolen... or in Xbox Live's case their parent's personal info :)

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sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:17:42 PM

Hahha parent's info, NICE!!!

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Killa Tequilla
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:21:32 PM

lol @ World

Imagine if Xbox got hacked and parents saw 100$ worth of XBL marketplace downloads. Parents probably would think it was their kids purchasing CoD DLC when actually personal information was stolen.

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PANICinc
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:54:43 PM

If memory serves me correctly, XBOX Live was down for about 2 weeks a couple years back. 2008 I think.
Plus, about a month ago, there was an attack on the servers that process credit card purchases on the Marketplace. Subscribers were only allowed to make purchases using points bought at a store.
Due to network infrastructure, there was no interruption in service when this happened. That's why it wasn't a big news story and the PSN attack is.

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cLoudou
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:59:30 PM

MS is trying to get into the good graces of hackers by unbanning banned accounts. Or maybe its for some other reason(s). Conspiracy?

Last edited by cLoudou on 4/27/2011 10:59:53 PM

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:01:08 PM
Reply

I'm convinced this was Anonymous. This is exactly what they wanted. Yea they denied responsibility but who wouldn't? They are criminals. Criminals lie.

This guy thinks it was them too and he makes some good points.

http://www.nextgn.com/2011/04/23/anonymous-most-likely-behind-psn-attack/

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Bugzbunny109
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:01:23 PM
Reply

I guess I need to take Karate again. I need some practice for when they catch these assholes.

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Clamedeus
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:55:00 PM

I don't think you would need any kind of martial arts for these guys.

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kraygen
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:08:49 AM

nope, just a piece of steel and a dimly lit room with no camera.

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Underdog15
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:06:04 AM

I'm sure you could knock them out with a cold real life/unanimated stare.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:04:19 PM
Reply

So they notified everyone as in the people who's info was stolen/compromised, or every PSN account holder? I received no such email and I have not seen any suspicious activity on my bank account.

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Killa Tequilla
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:09:47 PM

Well, look at the FAQ's. I got the email, I only had like .10ยข in there so...

Anyway, in the FAQ's they do state it takes a long time to send 70+ million messages.

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FatherSun
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:13:53 PM

I have been getting emails for every update Sony has made.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:14:59 PM

They are notifying people by email only if they know for certain that their CC# was accessed.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:17:30 PM

I haven't gotten a single email from them. I had a charge that posted onto my account on the 21st but I checked my last PSN "Funds have been added to your wallet" email and it matches up with my a purchase I made on the 19th which was Tuesday so I know the charge was done by me. I wonder if they are only emailing people that they know were compromised.

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sha4dowknight05
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:19:29 PM

I got 1 email, nothing different from what they already stated already. Just your typical don't open any weird messages, answer weird phone calls, and they never ever send out emails unless you said they could.

Also buying something from the store would have been impossible after around 5 a.m EST April 21st. It was down by then.



Last edited by sha4dowknight05 on 4/27/2011 10:20:22 PM

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:22:49 PM

Yea, nothing was bought on the 21st. Charge from my purchase on the 19th just didn't know up on my bank statement until the 21st which isn't abnormal. Sometimes it can take a few days to a week for PSN charges to hit your bank statement.

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main_event05
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:06:30 AM

ohh crap. I got one of those and i trashed it. but I cancelled the card i 1st signed up with so i'm not too worried.

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___________
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 6:13:53 AM

thats not true, i got a email and i dont have my CC info on my US account only had it on my AU one.
there sending it to everyone, just takes a while to send so many emails.
i think it might have something to do with if you selected to recieve info from sony or not when you signed up.

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bigrailer19
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:39:09 AM

Jawknee-
I believe you will get an email no matter what. Sony stated that it's time consuming to send out 77 million emails! Prolly true! But that everyone should receive and email by the 28 (today)! Hopefully you do!

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Simcoe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:39:48 PM

I got one, but it sounds so suspicious as the domain name is playstation-email.com

Hopefully Sony will clarify the domains that these e-mails are being sent from, especially if they are relying on a mass-marketing company to push out 77 million e-mails in a couple of days.

The e-mail I got was specifically from PlayStation_Network@playstation-email.com (and if I can get some confirmation on the address from from Sony), the reason why some people may not have received their e-mail might be due to your e-mail provider or program flagging it as spam.

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PSTan
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:14:11 PM
Reply

This problem is just spiraling downward. People need to realize that it wasn't Sony's fault that their information was compromised; rather, it was those who infiltrated the network. In fact, we should be grateful that Sony is taking the necessary steps to deal with this situation. Any lesser company would have collapsed under the pressure.

Good thing is, I don't have my CC info on PSN (too poor to buy DLC lol). Let's hope everyone else won't be adversely affected.

My main problem with PSN down is that it may affect the development of the rest of this year's games. Think about it, especially big games with multiplayer. How are developers going to develop their multiplayers? My assumption is that they have their own private networks that are independent from PSN (example: ND probably has their own network for U3's multi). However, the game I see most directly impacted is Infamous 2. If PSN doesn't start up again soon, Sucker Punch is going to have to go through some crunch time to make sure UGC is stable enough before release, and they need to use the beta for data collection. Downloadable games could cost profits for companies as well.

Let's hope that this all gets resolved soon.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:16:09 PM

Don't you need a CC to be on PSN in the first place?

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LimitedVertigo
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:23:02 PM

Of course not World.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:25:26 PM

World, no, you aren't forced to input a CC to sigh up for PSN. I have a European and a Japanese account. Neither forced me to input a card number.

This stunt reminds me of the woman who sued McDonald's because she spilled hot coffee on her lap.

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Killa Tequilla
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:27:29 PM

Gives developers time to polish up that Single Player :)

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:34:03 PM

I couldn't remember, seems like I had to for it to confirm my identity. Maybe that was for the store or something.

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PANICinc
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:57:51 PM

@world

the only reason Sony would require a CC would be for a subscription service like +PLUS or Qore

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Clamedeus
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:03:11 PM

Yeah, you don't need a CC to sign up for PSN, but what you do need is either a credit card or PS Network card/Prepaid card to buy stuff off the PS Store that's basically it.

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Simcoe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:43:16 PM

@TanthePSDood
Developers do have their own private and local playstation network, to test out multiplayer games they're developing.

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DirtySkillzHD
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:16:25 PM
Reply

Come on sony get with the program omg ! Xbox is calling me but I say hell no f u xbox

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:34:52 PM

easy tiger

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booze925
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:29:48 PM
Reply

as long as sony gets these sons a bitches, i don't mind PSN staying down a while longer.
like u stated in ur previous article ben... its given me time to focus on more important matters.

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jdt1981
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:34:28 PM
Reply

I'm not taking any chances so I called my bank and ordered a new check card and I'm also changing my passwords for most of the websites I visit. I'm wondering if I should do more like change my email address, I'm not sure what these people can do with my name, address and email address. I'm hesitant to use my CC over the internet anymore this whole thing has me a little paranoid.

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:51:49 AM

I hear ya.

I did the exact same thing. Changed all my passwords associated with Dancemachine55 and have cancelled my auto-renewal for Xbox Live Gold. Once I've got my remaining points refunded and my subscription runs out in June, I'm fine to remove my credit card details.

Live sucks when it comes to removing info. Had to call them and get someone to do it over the phone.

I've changed all my passwords, removed private information that's not required and will remove my credit card once PSN is back up and running.

Poor Sony. What a mess. The company only provides entertainment and super happy fun times, and this is how they are treated.

Why don't hackers attack BP servers, or medical companies who use innocent poor or impoverished people as lab rats to test products?

Sony doesn't deserve this, nor MS or Nintendo for that matter.

Last edited by Dancemachine55 on 4/28/2011 8:52:26 AM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:36:37 PM
Reply

No worries guys, I gotcha covered with World's Top 5 Things To Do While PSN Is Down:

http://www.titanreviews.com/#/top-5-things-while-psn-is-down/4550896852

Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 4/27/2011 10:37:07 PM

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cLoudou
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:55:46 PM

No 1 thing to do is to play with your Wii...wii.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:10:31 PM

I'd put that at about 10th

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Qubex
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:18:28 PM

Lol World, that was quite low :)

Let me play with my Wii Wii!

Q!

"play.experience.enjoy"

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cLoudou
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 11:19:50 PM

BTW I can't seem to do anything on that site on my droid. I click an article it just redirects me back to home.

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kraygen
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:14:19 AM

3 & 4 are pretty much the same thing, just stated differently.

So I'd replace it with either spend some extra time with the lady in your life or if you don't have one, good time to look.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:46:51 AM

I have no idea.

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totozero18
Monday, May 02, 2011 @ 1:57:36 PM

Multiplayer parties for the win, love me some PES or FIFA right next to your rival so you can shout GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAL right on his face, rock band anyone?

*Dusts off PS1 Army Men*

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tornado03
Wednesday, April 27, 2011 @ 10:42:09 PM
Reply

Righteous Justice!

Last edited by tornado03 on 4/27/2011 10:45:05 PM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:01:50 AM
Reply

So, All the column inches and paranoia that let otherwise reputable tech and gaming journalists to screech that the data was unprotected was - as anticipated - just a bunch of paranoid drivel.

CC details were/are encrypted, personal data (your name and date of birth and the like) were not. But, I'm certain that your password was hashed - even though it's not addressed in the posting. Of course there were multiple layers of security in addition to the encryption, so Sony was hardly slacking or leaving the information out in the open.

Since it's very unlikely that anyone's CC information has been compromised - as in there's no evidence it was - perhaps the shrill cries of complain about that can quiet down for now?

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:49:11 AM

unlikely, the internets are exploding with claims. You know how those beat out facts.

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:57:11 AM

What about LimitedVertigo?

He claimed on several posts that a few purchases were made using his card on the 21st of April that he did not make.

I have a feeling some credit card information was retrieved, but perhaps not all.

Hopefully not everyone will be affected by this. So far, nothing purchased on my card and I've been checking everyday for the last week.

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:12:57 AM

As I have pointed out, there are far more likely routes for card abuse than a potential PSN hack, not to mention the fact that PSN transactions can take a week or longer to appear in your bank account. for whatever reason some transactions just seem to take an age to go through, and then when you see them on your account you don't recognize them. It's happened several times to me ad after tracing back though my purchase confirmations I've eventually found the transaction count is correct, it's just that the ones I didn't recognize were from a week or so before. It's easily done, especially of you don't have access to your email account where notifications are sent (LV says he can't access that email any longer, so....)

In other words, I actually think LV mistook a couple of late transactions for illegitimate transactions and it is, as they say, a false positive. No malicious intent, just a simple mistake caused by the delay in his bank processing the charges.

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bigrailer19
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:29:53 PM

This may offer more relief as well...

"Speaking to Bloomberg, spokesmen for Wells Fargo & Co., American Express Co. and MasterCard Inc. said they were monitoring cardholder accounts and hadn't seen unauthorized activity relating to Sony." "[Bloomberg]" - Kotaku


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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:33:33 PM

I agree with highlander, nobody steals a credit card number off PSN and then buys themselves some PSN games with it. The man just freaked too early.

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Jawknee
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:21:03 PM

Yea, I added some funds to my wallet on the 19th and the charge didn't show up on my bank statement until the 21st. At first glance it looked like some one had used my card especially with all this insanity in the news but after doing some investigating, it was indeed from the funds I added to my wallet on the 19th.

Last edited by Jawknee on 4/28/2011 2:21:32 PM

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kraygen
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:16:16 AM
Reply

I'm really not that worried as I know they were most likely doing all they could to protect our data. In the end, the world we live in hacking is a possibility so you either take the chance and utilize services such as these or you build a bunker and go off the grid.

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mid10smaradoarg
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 1:38:19 AM
Reply

Nice i want BLOOD

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BikerSaint
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:20:33 AM

You want blood, huh?


OK, just give a great big bear-hug to any spiny cactus.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:50:52 AM

Play some Splatterhouse

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Mog
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 5:13:00 AM

Order some of ebay *looks around suspiciously*

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firehahahahaha
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:07:43 AM

If you want blood...You got it

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frylock25
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 1:45:56 AM
Reply

i cancelled my debt card and got a new one coming in the mail. i dont really care, how hard is it to get a new card and learn new numbers.

i never doubted that sony would be taking legal action on this. they just got done suing someone for hacking. i am also sure that the governments want to catch hackers just as much as sony does.

i generally dont put to much of my information out there for people to see. i think i have less than 30 people on my facebook mostly all family that would know some of my personal info any way.

in the coming months i hope to see someone caught for this and put in jail.

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Mog
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:00:31 AM

Are you sure that they will *just* go to jail. They are going to have to pay an epic fine with an epic amount of money, right?

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frylock25
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:34:16 AM

i couldnt really say what will happen. but i know another hacker got 110 years just recently. as for fines im sure sony will sue for all the down time and the cost of resecuring the network.

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 1:57:15 AM
Reply

One thing I would ask everyone to consider about the whole personal data being unencrypted bit. Have you ever googled yourself? Go do it, just for fun, see how much you can find out in a matter of a few clicks. If you're on Facebook and any other social sites an astounding amount of personal information is available on you and your identity already. Virtually none of the 'personal' information held on PSN is unavailable through simply public searches. the biggest exception to that of course is your password. But then that's not normally included with your personal data, and is normally not held except in a hashed form.

The point is that at the end of the day, unless CC information has in fact been stolen - although Sony continues to be very definite that it hasn't, the thieves really got little more than the information already available online about people.

As annoying and inconvenient as this is, the more I think about it the less remarkable it becomes.

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Mog
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:03:47 AM

Hey your right. I typed up my real name and there were a decent amount of things that came up (mainly to do with school but also other stuff).

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:20:00 AM

They got my username and password to log onto psn and theoretically act as me in that network. You do not find that info *anywhere* else.
Info about where I worked and posts on messageboards just isn't the same thing.

But at least things rhyme now ;)

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 2:21:18 AM

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jdt1981
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:46:13 AM

Didn't Sony say they can't yet rule out that CC numbers may have been compromised? Also LimitedVirtigo claims his CC # was stolen and had fraudulent PSN charges. I guess you're right about the other info such as names, addresses and emails there's really not much they can do with that stuff. People just need to be careful and watch out for phishing emails and phone calls.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:52:43 AM

With my name it would be hard to separate me from the other billion people who have it.

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RadioHeader
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:49:58 AM

I googled me and it said exactly what my parents would say... Never heard of him.

Now I'm even more depressed. Thanks Highlander :(

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Roach721
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 5:42:19 AM

LV is full of it...enough said

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:21:41 AM

They didn't get your password, they got the hash for your password. No where has Sony said your password was stored in an unencrypted, unhashed form. they have said that your personal information was unencrypted, but your password is pretty much never stored with your personal information. However the hash of your password is and depending on the strength of their hashing, and the resources available to the hackers, short and simple passwords are open to a relatively simple attack. I don't believe for a moment that the passwords were stored in plain text, but I do believe that the attackers obtained the password hash values for the PSN accounts they stole information on. That's why Sony is telling people to change passwords.

It's an uinavoidable element of having passwords that are usable on any system. I've explained it multiple times in multiple threads and I'm not going through it again here.

My point was that the personal information that many are worried about is actually a relatively small subset of the kind of information people put up on Facebook for all and sundry to see. The two pieces of information that are the most sensitive are your password and your CC details. Your CC detail was encrypted and Sony doesn't have any evidence to suggest it was obtained. Even if it was it's encrypted in a stronger manner than the hashing used for passwords. Your password was stored in a hashed form. I simply do not believe that PSN passwords were stored in plain text. But since hashing processes are defeatable within a reasonable time, especially for a well resourced attack and if the hashing isn't particularly strong, hackers having the hashes is the same as hackers having access to passwords.

None of the infers a lack of care or attention to security.

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BikerSaint
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:42:06 AM

Nope, I'm not listed in Google anywhere, thank goodness!


But there is one fellow listed, a well known burlesque comedian who starred in the movie, Citizen Kane.

So I guess I would've been in pretty good company.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:50:14 AM

@HighLander: No the passwords were *not* hashed - that's how I understood it at least? If not then I stand majorly corrected here - I have based all my critics in this case on the assumption that passwords were available unscrambled in any way.
I have to get back to you on this, cause I am 100% sure I read somewhere that this was the case.
What's your source that it wasn't?

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 11:52:14 AM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:09:25 PM

Sony has never answered directly on whether the passwords are hashed or not.

It's such standard procedure and has been for a long time before PSN was built. Until Sony states categorically that passwords were stored on PSN and not hashed, I'll continue to believe that they were hashed, if for no other reasons than it being standard procedure to hash passwords and because the whole PSN "I forgot my password" procedure indicates that passwords are not recoverable.

If *someone* (Ben, that's a hint...) would like to ask Patrick Seybold whether the passwords were stored or only the hashes were stored on PSN, I'd love to hear the answer. Some would say that sony would be crazy to answer that if in fact they did hold actual passwords on PSN. However, since law enforcement are already involved, the way in which passwords were handled on PSN will be a specific point of any action against the hackers. So Sony would be well advised to be truthful on that point, if asked. It's really the only point of contention that remains though.

Last edited by Highlander on 4/28/2011 12:15:36 PM

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Jawknee
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:23:55 PM

Beamboom, they were hashed out. They are even hashed out on the login screen. There's no reason to believe they just had everyone's password posted in plain text. The simple security system I use for my home business even hashes out our customers passwords.

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Fane1024
Friday, April 29, 2011 @ 4:53:07 AM

Beamboom,

That, I believe, is why you were downvoted in the other thread (and below): your unfounded assumption that Sony didn't protect the data to industry standards despite many comments from Highlander stating the opposite.

Sony hasn't been 100% clear on the security measures in place, but there also has been no clear evidence of negligence on Sony's part.



Last edited by Fane1024 on 4/29/2011 4:56:00 AM

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:18:53 AM
Reply

Well at least Sony seem to be honest in their Q&A. I'll give'em that.

And dang I look forward to get my psn back. Portal 2 is just laying here, waiting to provide hours of coop fun.
All this serious business has made me itch!

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 2:22:25 AM

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The Iron Jedi
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 2:57:24 AM
Reply

Just one comment I wanted to leave. Sony have been hacked, we know this. However when people say 'Oh, XBOX Live is secure', do we honestly know?

Is Amazon secure, Is Apple secure, eBay?

Sony were a big prize to hit, I keep wondering if it was a hack to show that the Hackers could do it, but they didn't intend to cause any harm to the users?

Was data actually stolen, or just looked at?

Will another big company be next?

Don't get me wrong, I am not taking sides, just making a comment.

I had almost considered trading my PS3, but then I thought 'No, that would be giving in to the Hackers'

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:07:29 AM

Don't trade in your ps3, but you are in every right to expect and demand that Sony provide an as secure solution as practically possible. They did not do that up until now. That's why psn is down for two weeks or more.

Regarding the others, well both Apple and Xbox has been "jailbreaked" for a long time now without this happening, so it's reasonably safe to assume they got a better system behind it.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 3:08:25 AM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:54:36 AM

nothing is ever safe. bet on it.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:07:05 AM

No, true of course. Should be specified in all such conversations. *Nothing* is 100% safe.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 4:08:55 AM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:22:31 AM

Xbox live has been hacked before, none of the things you mentioned are secure, no online service is 100% secure. None.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:55:13 AM
Reply

That would be cool if I got the opportunity to change my PSN handle out of all this.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:08:28 AM

You know, I really wonder how Sony are going to solve this: If all our usernames and passwords are to be considered unsafe, then how will we be able to log on to change password once it's up and running again?

Everyone creating a new account is one obvious way, but then we will lose all history with our current account, ergo all psn games have to be shopped over again, preorder codes are lost, etc...! That would... Suck.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 4:13:55 AM

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johnld
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:51:38 AM

its in the blog, it said that sony is going to release a firmware update that requires us to change our passwords.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:55:04 AM

But if I sat here with a list of usernames and passwords, what's keeping me from just logging on as a different user? And to push it even further, what's keeping me from writing a script that parsed the entire list and logged on psn as fast as the bandwidth allowed me to, creating random new passwords and thus messed up for hundred, if not thousands of users!

I know you don't have the answer to that and obviously Sony has a solution for this, I'm just curious how they will solve that.
If they have client IP ranges associated with user accounts that would be a way of at least limiting the potential damage, but it's nowhere failsafe.


Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 4:57:27 AM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:23:57 AM

Perimeter security will detect and block that kind of scripted dictionary based attack Beamboom.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:44:27 AM

Yeah I know, I was pushing it a tad too far there. But if you got a botnet at hand it could quite possibly be done to a certain level at least, unless other cleverness is at work here - and I suspect that there is, with the system upgrade.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 11:46:40 AM

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johnld
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:54:27 AM
Reply

wait, are they sending the email to all the accounts or just the ones affected? because i got an email and i may have bad news for my brother since its his credit card thats on file. he lost/destroyed his card though, would the bank send him a card with the same number of a completely different one?

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:58:51 AM

Despite their claims I've not yet seen any mails, I've checked in the spam folders of all my accounts.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 4:58:58 AM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:25:28 AM

They stated in their Q&A that sending all the emails took time and would be complete by the 28th - today. so some may still be waiting. They are probably sending them in the order in which users registered for PSN, but who knows, it might simply be alphabetic order based on PSN ID, or some other random selection method.

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BikerSaint
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 5:21:22 PM

No email from Sony either, but I've never bought anything on the PSN, or used any credit card..


But I still think that either way, Sony should STILL email every single PSN account holder, credit card or no credit card, just for the plain simple fact that all of our email data was hacked.

Sony, you can send me one of those notices.
And don't worry, I'm not going to sue.

Now on the other hand, the USPS will be facing a lawsuit from me if I don't get another 60 Gigger from my $500 insurance claim.

And believe me, I will be suing for a hell of a lot more than just my insurance claim, seeing how I can show proof of the USPS's ineptness concerning more of my dealings over over the last 2 years.


UPDATED:, The saga of my "smashed PS3 continues...

I just got my Phat 60 Princess back this afternoon from that repair shop that reported the USPS damages to me.

And the gorilla at the USPS package-bungling department damaged it even worse than I thought.
Not only is it dead, I can very well see why it's dead.

The whole right side where the vents are is ripped off, there's about 7 cracked & loose broken pieces underneath the right side that starts from the "BluRay disc & DVD" insignias & goes all the way across the whole area underneath where the air vents are under the disc opening. Plus that hard hit my PS3 took also caused the 2 halves of the case on the opposite side to become misaligned, bulge outward & causing them to open up a gap between them.

My PS3 had been extremely well packed by me & I had bubble-wrapped it 4 times around diagonally, & then another 4 times around horizontally too so no part was exposed. Then I crumpled up a roll & 1/2 of thick brown heavy Kraft & forced it in there so tight, that Fort Knox should have been easier to penetrate. But of course my package just had to find itself in the of slippery paws a f*cking 10-thumbs imbecile who had to be pretending he was King Kong on top of the Empire State Building & swatting my PS3 box down on it's right-front edge, like it was just another one of those pesky old-time bi-winged aero-planes circling his head.

I'll be starting my claim process on-line, tomorrow.


I will have my revenge!


Last edited by BikerSaint on 4/28/2011 5:22:21 PM

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Mog
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 5:08:32 AM
Reply

Hackers...... What a pathetic life to live since their lives are based on ruining other peoples lives..... So low, so shallow.

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___________
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 6:08:28 AM
Reply

and waiting so long to let your customers know is also a criminal act!
hopefully this will be $onys wake up call and get them to finally encrypt our personal information!
they encrypt our HDDs but they wont encrypt our user info.
there more worried about people accessing game files, then people accessing personal and account info?
WTF?
get your priorities stright $ony!

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RadioHeader
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:34:43 AM

Please apply for day release so Sony can hire you to alleviate all their woes.

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Wissam
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 7:02:48 AM
Reply

The bad news just keep pouring in :\

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HUSO
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:58:43 AM
Reply

Now we should watch and wait for the guys that hacked PSN to come up with a lawsuit against SONY for negligence.

Back to the hackers i think sony already have an idea who did it but don't want to give too much away yet.

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dbyzforce
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:16:19 AM
Reply

I agree with you 100% Dancemachine55

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:29:01 AM
Reply

I heard from my old manager at EB Games that the head company managers were discussing PSN becoming a paid service like Xbox Live to compensate for extra security costs and features introduced to secure user information even further.

I hope it isn't true. Playstation have built up a reputation of providing free online entertainment and services, but with this hack problem, it may possibly be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

I have a feeling that PSN will attempt to match or beat Xbox Live in terms of security and service after this debacle, but the only way to maintain it is to charge a small fee to use it.

My Dad sent me a newspaper article via email regarding the PSN invasion. Nearly 77 million accounts affected with enough credit card info stolen to take out a loan on the victim's behalf.

http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/playstation-hacking-scandal-police-chief-says-contact-your-bank-now-20110427-1dvts.html

It's even hit the news on Australian television. A popular news broadcaster too.

I'm never placing my real name or date of birth on anything except government or bank related sites ever again. This has been a big wake up call to me.

I've removed a lot of info from my Facebook, removed my address from everything I can, changed all my passwords for anything Dancemachine55 related and only have PSN left to change.

I hope I don't have to create a new PSN account. I've spent so much money on additional songs for Singstar and Rock Band, not to mention the odd downloadable title.

I agree that it was bad on Sony's behalf to take so long telling users about what happened, but if you look at their statements Sony explain that it took several days just to figure out what exactly happened, how the hackers got in and what they did while in there. Don't blame Sony. They are doing the best they can.

So far so good, no credit card purchases made on my card. I hope it's still secure. So paranoid about my online information now.

The firmware update is a good move, and making it compulsory to change passwords is a good move too. I just hope that some sort of encryption is used this time to match PSN data to the machine being used to change passwords so in case it's a hacker changing it, they can be caught red-handed.

And this, ladies and gentlemen of PSXextreme, is why I am a single player offline gamer who loves a good campaign and does not need online for anything.

I just hope Sony can recover from this and will hopefully teach them about creating better systems and services for the PS4. The tell of a truly great person or company is their ability to learn from their mistakes, and while I love anything Playstation related, there's no denying many mistakes have been made this generation.

The creepy baby commercial was the start. :P

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:29:30 AM

The reason they took time to tell everyone is that unlike most corporations that get hacked and rarely come forward, Sony came forward immediately, while they were still investigating. You only hear of hacks like this after the dust has settled with other organizations. Sony could hardly come out with the Q&A they have before they had information to give, could they? You seem to be under several mis-conceptions about how you deal with a data breach.

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:40:11 AM
Reply

Seeing as MS has had 15 more years experience at online data security than Sony, I honestly feel more secure using Live than PSN.

However, hackers can do almost anything with a computer these days, so I'm not taking any chances.

Hotmail, PSN, Live, Facebook, anything I use online is getting frequent password changes from now on and having critical info like address and date of birth removed.

Call me paranoid, but I agree with Ben's article from yesterday. I miss the simplicity of the early and mid-90's. Credit cards were around, but never used on computers. People used phones to pay their bills or check up on anything important in life, and newspapers and television gave you access to world news to keep you in the loop.

I agree, the gift of free information at your fingertips is also a curse. We must teach our youth how to use it wisely.

Hackers can only obtain what you put in. The less personal info you give the internet, the less they can steal from you.

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 9:52:37 AM

You don't have to change password on everything so often (although it's not a bad idea doing it) but at least don't use the same password on several different places, especially not on common services like gmail, facebook, hotmail/msn and large merchants like amazon, play and ebay.

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:27:22 AM

Dream Machine, your faith in Microsoft and Xbox Live is amusing.

Fact : Microsoft's record on security in Windows and Internet Explorer is - to put it mildly - appalling.

Fact : Xbox Live is not impervious to hacking.

You might want to re-think that Xbox live propaganda you're pushing.

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CrusaderForever
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:43:20 AM

You know, I know I will probably get some flak for this, but I am wondering if this hack was done to SLOW Sony down! With the 2011 line up and the Xbot hurting! I wouldn't be surprised if this hack was actually done by Microsoft indirectly! Or by some hackers that are Xbot fanboys. If they find no evidence to link this hack to anyone then I would go to Vegas to bet that it was Microsoft indirectly. It could happen! (Raising Shield)

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:16:48 AM

Oh, don't worry. I know xbox live is hardly safer than PSN or any other personal info holding website. I guess I just wrongly assumed MS' security would be better since MS has had years with Windows to work on online security. Longer than Sony, that is.

Either way, with the PSN scare, I'm not taking chances with anything anymore and am altering everything using the dancemachine55 username and removing credit card info from any service I've bought stuff from. Better to be safe than sorry I reckon. First stop is canceling my auto-renewal of Live Gold and removing my credit card details, which I successfully achieved today.

Also, I do apologize. I'd just come from a conversation with a friend who is highly pro- xbox, as many of my friends are, and he connected the paid subscription to Live Gold to additional security that far exceeds anything PSN could do. Utter rubbish!! Just mentioned the FBI and other big online databases getting hacked and he tried to change the subject. I hate being the only playstation appreciator in my group of 360 gaming friends. (sigh)

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Beamboom
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:41:11 AM

HighLander is 100% correct in Microsoft's record on security - may I also add "ignorant" to describe MS in these matters.

That being said, how much experience Sony has on these matters up until the PS3 I know little about. And my impression is that they've developed most of psn inhouse (just an impression or gut feeling, I know nothing about this). At least, with all MS blunders over the years they must have learnt *something*... :D
But no - MS is *not* a good example of anything, really. Including security.

Last edited by Beamboom on 4/28/2011 11:42:54 AM

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:43:15 AM

For all online services the rules I follow are;

Above all do not give out your social security (or National Insurance or whatever local equivalent) number - ever. Do not give out your driving license number - ever. Banks like to request this kind of information, personally, I'm more comfortable visiting a bank in person than entering this all online. But social security (or the equivalent) numbers are like the keys to the kingdom. Protect them at all costs.

Other than that....

1) use as little personally identifying information as possible.
2) do not register your debit or credit card number unless it's a prepaid card, or a secondary account with limited scope for damage.
3) Don't use a short password, don't use a common name for a password. Use a password with at least 8 characters and use both letters and numbers in the password. Ideally, use a password longer than 10 characters, it makes the process of generating hash values for an attack extremely time consuming.
4) On facebook and other services, consider using fake, or abbreviated information.
5) unless it's absolutely necessary do not give your real date of birth to anyone.
6) do not enter your real address, or any address for that matter, unless it is a mandatory field, such as with a delivery address or billing address.
7) do not use the same password for your account as you do for the email registered with that account.
8) do not use a security question/answer like your mother's maiden name or your pet's name, much of this information can be found on line for most people, usually through things like Facebook.

Finally, *never* click a link in an email, even if you recognize the site. always enter the address manually and navigate to the specific page yourself, and always be on your guard against phishing schemes.

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:20:58 PM

Thanks for the handy tips there Highlander.

I've already changed my passwords for Facebook and Hotmail. Since Xbox Live is tied to my Hotmail and MSN account, makes it a little easier to remember, or a little easier to hack, I dunno.

Anyways, I've changed my real date of birth from all entertainment related sites and plan on doing the same the moment PSN is back online.

One more handy tip:

Only give your real date of birth for your bank or government related source when you seek it. They will not contact you, so only give out your details IF YOU contact them first.

For things like Facebook, Xbox Live, PSN, Twitter, etc change your birth year and maybe the day for extra security, and if the option is there, do not enter your birth year at all, day and month alone should suffice.

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:26:10 PM

Good tips DanceMachine, if nothign else, perhaps we can all learn or be reminded of the guidelines we need to use online.

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CrusaderForever
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:39:52 AM
Reply

Cool, I knew they were moving the datacenter. PSN should be good to go after this is over. Only 1 week to go, hopefully.

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Simcoe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:02:28 PM

I found it odd that they said that they were moving the data centre to a "more secure" location. Could this attack, not have been outside the network (ex. using a hacked PS3) but from within the data centre where the PSN servers were located!

Cue dramatic chipmunk!

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Mornelithe
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 10:47:30 AM
Reply

I vote for the death penalty to everyone involved in the intrusion, then post the videos on PSN for $5/ea. You could make some good money there Sony!

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Underdog15
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:27:31 AM

$1.99 for PS+Subscribers

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Highlander
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 11:44:21 AM

Underdog, Plus users should have early access...

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:23:43 PM

PS Plus members get a free live feed.

For everyone else, $2.50 for the video.

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BikerSaint
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:20:18 PM
Reply

Since Geo the J.O. is basically walking free with only a slap on the wrist for all the shite he's caused gamers & Sony, & because he's "STILL" f*cking mouthing off & gloating over it, my only wish is that they send the most sadistic LEO MF'ers they can find to go after all of these hackers a$$-hats from now on.

And that they tack those warrants directly to the hackers testicles in 187 different places, using a industrial sized pneumatic 10penny nail gun.

Also, once inside the prison walls, all these "NEW FISH" need to get gang-hacked daily, just like they've been literally doing to us all.


Last edited by BikerSaint on 4/28/2011 12:21:36 PM

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jimmyhandsome
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 12:43:28 PM

lol you're so angry

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BikerSaint
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 5:39:19 PM

jimmyhandsome,

Aha, I got that nickname "Saint" by my biker buds as sarcasm, LOL


Anyways....The Saint kneels on one bended knee, dips his fingers in Holy Water, and then reaches out to motion the sign of the X.....& says

"Bless you my child"

(See? I do have my good moments, as rare & fleeting as they may be)

Last edited by BikerSaint on 4/28/2011 5:40:29 PM

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:26:35 PM

You could send your needle-wielding chihuaha after the hackers. They'll never see it coming, MUA HA HA HA HAAAAA!!!!

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BikerSaint
Friday, April 29, 2011 @ 9:35:03 PM

Dancemachine55,
Demon Dog wouldn't even need to bite them with that "Liquid Drano" syringe.

Just one stare-down from his Helghast death-ray eyeballs, is enough to make them melt into a steaming pile of goo that would gag even the most hungriest of maggots.

Last edited by BikerSaint on 4/29/2011 9:35:45 PM

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johnld
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 1:23:22 PM
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hey, look at the bright side. hearing those immature/idiots saying they're going to switch to the 360 because of this means psn is finally going back to being mature network like before it attracted these idiots because of the price drop. although if the ps3 drops another 50 or 100 i bet they'll come crawling back anyway because they're sick of gears and halo.... wait, nevermind bots usually have a high tolerance for not having new games to play. sony exclusives really help with building that up.

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CrusaderForever
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 1:31:11 PM
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For these Hackers, what we really need is a Live Free or Die Hard scenario without John McClane!! Now that would be even better movie!! :)

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Jawknee
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 3:41:23 PM

Why without John McClane? The Bruce is awesome sauce. :)

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Clamedeus
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 4:38:09 PM

What about the Stay Puft Marshmallow man? That would be awesome!

/sarc

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Dancemachine55
Thursday, April 28, 2011 @ 8:28:21 PM

"If there's something strange in your neighbourhood,

who you gonna call?"

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Veitsknight
Friday, April 29, 2011 @ 1:31:03 AM
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I hope that my comment will not anger other members on this site, but i really want them to catch those people responsible for the attack and host a Public castration.

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phade2blaq
Sunday, May 01, 2011 @ 7:22:57 PM
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While I'll commend Sony for finally taking this matter for the serious situation that is, they still made some huge errors in dealing with this matter and this has been Sony's MO since they started their gaming division !

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