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Hey, Remember When Everyone Thought Cut-Scenes Were Cool?

Oh yes, I remember those days well.

The cut-scene started to really come to prominence during the original PlayStation days, fueled by amazing cut-scenes found in franchises like Final Fantasy and Metal Gear Solid.

That was when many gamers would "ooh" and "aah" over the latest amazing CGI sequence. I still remember working in an EB when Final Fantasy VIII came out. We were running a promo sequence on the TV that kept showing the dance scene between Squall and Rinoa near the start of the game. We had customers who didn't even know it was a video game. Some would just stand there, agape. It was pretty cool.

These days, though, anything non-interactive in a game seems to be automatically classified as "bad." I keeps seeing people complaining about the length of The Order: 1886 but more specifically, they're whining that there are probably too many cut-scenes. I know gamers who can't even sit through a 30-second scene where they're not pressing buttons; that's how far our attention spans have fallen.

I'm not saying cut-scenes are a universal good but I certainly understand their capability to tell a story. Most people these days apparently don't care. They want to "make their own story" or they quite simply aren't interested in the plot the developers created. They just want to play. I think if The Order had released back in the good ol' days, this backlash over cut-scenes wouldn't exist at all.

Related Game(s): The Order: 1886

Tags: video game cut scenes, gaming cutscenes, gaming industry, the order 1886

2/17/2015 9:59:06 PM Ben Dutka

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Legacy Comment System (76 posts)


Bio
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 10:26:42 PM
Reply

Cutscenes were a necessary evil 20 years ago. These days developers are finding new ways to tell a story within the game without having to cut away, and that is a good thing. At this point, cutscenes really are a hallmark of either lazy or incompetent narrative, for the most part. There are exceptions, of course, but in most cases they're not really needed anymore.

Agree with this comment 5 up, 14 down Disagree with this comment

Banky A
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 10:41:16 PM

Cutscenes are the shit.

Agree with this comment 13 up, 1 down Disagree with this comment

kokoro
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:12:48 PM

Cutscenes are the poo; so all the haters can take a big whiff.

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Bio
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:29:42 PM

Cutscenes are boring, for the most part. If you have to remove the game to tell your story, you're either telling the wrong kind of story or you're telling it with the wrong medium.

Metal Gear Solid is one example where cutscenes are worth it, but even then Kojima goes way overboard at times.

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duomaxwell007
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:41:58 PM

ok first you say:

"Cutscenes are boring, for the most part. If you have to remove the game to tell your story, you're either telling the wrong kind of story or you're telling it with the wrong medium."

Then you say MGS is an example where cutscenes are worth it... but doesnt the MGS cutscenes still remove the game to tell the story, which according to you mean that MGS is telling the wrong story or telling it with the wrong medium?

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:55:05 PM

Sorry, but I'm never immersed in any storyline when I'm controlling a character. That's because active interaction is wrong for all forms of storytelling and why the best stories are never found in open-world games. Storytelling involves passive attention; active participation means you're either not paying attention at all or you're attempting to change what the original writers created.

"Lazy" developers were the first ones who said: "Eh, we'll just tell players to create their own character and make their own stories as they go along. That way, we don't have to actually write...well, anything. Forget plot, character development, etc. Too hard."

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 2/17/2015 11:56:47 PM

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Bio
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:14:06 AM

@duo - I said "for the most part". There are exceptions to everything, including cutscenes in gammes. Even then I qualified that statement saying he goes way overboard.

@Ben - I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I think if you have to cut away from the game to tell your story, you're telling the wrong kind of story. Fact is MGS would work better as a movie, or a TV series with serious money behind it. Bioshock is a great example of how to tell a story without cutting away.

And letting the player tell their own story is the furthest thing from lazy. It takes WAY more time and effort to create something like Skyrim than it does a linear game with linear plot and cutscenes.

Last edited by Bio on 2/18/2015 12:18:02 AM

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kokoro
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:59:52 AM

But then Bio according to you all the final fantasy games, for example, have "told the wrong kind of stories" or have been told "with the wrong medium".

There is absolutely no way mate.

Final fantasy has given me some of the greatest gaming experiences of my life.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:57:13 AM

"And letting the player tell their own story is the furthest thing from lazy. It takes WAY more time and effort to create something like Skyrim than it does a linear game with linear plot and cutscenes."

Completely wrong. The only thing that requires any talent whatsoever in such games is, as always, the part that is the underlying thread throughout; i.e., the main plot. And I'm sorry, but it's barely mediocre. Everything else is massive amounts of filler that don't have to be connected in any way. Just make up a bunch of random facts about the world to put into some books the player can find, and that's it.

If it was so difficult to do, and resulted in these amazing stories, why aren't any of the games in the series revered as having great stories? Nobody even remembers them. Nobody cares. Such games are about the gameplay, not the plot, and the reason for that is, as I said above, active participation, which works against any attempt at an effective story.

The parts in games people remember? Aeris being laid to rest. Snake visiting the grave at the end of MGSIII. Seifer and Squall battling it out at the start of FFVIII. These are enduring because we actually SAW them and ingested them. We weren't half paying attention while roving around. The only parts I really remember from any Bioshock? The end. When it actually becomes a real story.

Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 2/18/2015 1:58:26 AM

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Banky A
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:20:05 AM

Agreed Bio.

Na I lied.

Skyrim has a story? The lore, the world - that's why people play Bethesda games. Same case for the amazing Dark Souls.

20 MGS movies sounds cool though. Awesome high tech special effects to make flying gear cows, live action cyborg humans, Japanese humour for the world, easy to understand plot, cardboard boxes - all encompassed in a slow, amazing stealthy espionage action packed package.

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Kevin555
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:34:11 AM

@Banky A,

MGS: Easy to understand plot

:/

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EMax
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:37:41 AM

When I started gaming, there were people who complained that there was too much reading in the game. Now, people are complaining about the cutscenes. I think most developers purposefully include a skip option so that those who have a problem with the cutscenes could just move right along to the game. I fail to see how this affects the gameplay. Some may argue that it breaks momentum, but then so does a loading screen.
Also, there are different types of games for different types of gamers. Why hate on something that is obviously not geared towards your individual taste?

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Nynja
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 10:47:47 PM
Reply

I still enjoy them, especially Final Fantasy cut scenes. Still loved them in MGS. Cal me old fashioned I guess.

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Bio
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:30:22 PM

You're old fashioned (hey you asked :P )

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TomBradySucks
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 10:49:24 PM
Reply

Maybe it was because there were a larger gap between in game graphics and the CGI tech used for the cut scenes back then? Most games this gen use the in game engine for their cut scenese, so there isn't really a "wow" factor anymore. This is coming from someone who doesn't necessarily like a lot of cut scenes though

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Bio
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:16:34 AM

Pretty much this. Back in the day you kinda had to use cutscenes. Not so anymore.

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:23:13 AM

You still need to. Real time games while you control the characters can't show emotion well... heck, they can't even move their mouths properly.

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Bio
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:47:35 AM

No you don't, Underdog. Look at Human Revolution as an example. Yes they employ cuts but if you play the director's cut they are ALWAYS talking about 'show don't tell' in terms of storytelling and how they employ this or that tactic to deliver the world to you without you necessarily realizing it. They hate cutscenes and only used them when they had to.

Bioshock, as I pointed out earlier, is another example of world building through gameplay. Skyrim tells its story mostly through gameplay.

Cuts are no longer needed.

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 7:17:39 AM

Those cutscenes are super weak, though. You can't attain what you can through cutscene. You just can't employ every tool, period.

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bigrailer19
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 10:51:17 PM
Reply

I'm not sure. I love cut scenes in linear adventures. In open world games I'm not sure they are needed all the time.

With that said I was under the impression that people were upset about the supposed length of the game including cut scenes. Not the cut scenes themselves.

I feel bad for this game. It's been the center stage for so much criticism and stories over the last few months. It's been used as an example for the reason gamers want open world games and now it's being set as an example of why gamers hate cut scenes. It's crazy. Never seen this before.

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Temjin001
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 10:40:13 AM

I'm so bored now of the Order drama and open worlds and linear this and that I'm done talking about it or reading about it until review day.

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bigrailer19
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 4:21:36 PM

I'm with you Temjin. I'm sick of hearing about this game. I want review day to come and go so we can move on.

BTW I bought The dark below expansion, and began playing Destiny again last night. My frustration towards the game wasn't enough to keep me away. I'm not going to lie I had fun with it last night. I will say I was disappointed in what it turned out to be, but it's a solid game. I realized that last night.

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Temjin001
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 5:46:03 PM

I'll probably come back to Destiny once the other expansion pack drops, or the one thereafter. That way there's some more meat for me to sink into when that time comes.

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Rachet_JC_FTW
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:04:25 PM
Reply

they've fallen very far in the last 10 years since i was a kid which is sad but thats partly due the fact of these mobile games that don't require the asme level of attention that games back in the did or maybe i'm wrong i'm merely suggest one reason for the lapse but i don't think they are a bad thing, i've had cases where sometimes they too short or too long. idk thats just me. also theya re partly for character developement i think.

and not they don't care anymore its just let me play,let me play,let me play and thats it.

and ur comment ben "They want to "make their own story" or they quite simply aren't interested in the plot the developers created" is quite true as is "I think if The Order had released back in the good ol' days, this backlash over cut-scenes wouldn't exist at all."

that'll be all

happy gaming

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duomaxwell007
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:12:55 PM
Reply

I dont know about everyone else but i STILL think cutscenes are good. If i wanted a game that was all gameplay and no small breaks inbetween to tell a GOOD story.... I still have an NES, SNES and Genesis

not to say that only games that had cutscenes told stories... as plenty of games pre 32bit era told stories without cutscenes or spoken dialog but every game that fit that description was an RPG.

As for them not being interested in the plot... thas the thing i AM interested in teh plot. I use em to show the "adult" naysayers that claim "video games are for kids" that a video game can tell a story thats just as good (or bad) as any book, movie or tv series theyre watchin on tv right now. If we kept making games like Mario then that would only further prove to "validate" their opinion

Last edited by duomaxwell007 on 2/17/2015 11:16:05 PM

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kokoro
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:15:23 PM
Reply

I shan't ever forget FFX's beautiful cut scenes.

Last edited by kokoro on 2/17/2015 11:15:50 PM

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Snaaaake
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:16:54 PM

My favourite is when Tidus was sleeping or mentally preparing for the Blitzball game.
Being my first PS2 game, I was literally in trance watching it.

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Banky A
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:28:58 PM

Dude.

Them using that for the adverts of the game was the best decision. We knew we had to have it. So fantasy yet so futuristic, so edgy, gritty. It was amazing.

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kokoro
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:01:30 AM

'twas magical

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Snaaaake
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:15:46 PM
Reply

Gaming has changed.
Time has changed.
War has changed by Old Snake :P

FFXIII has some beautiful CGI cut-scenes but the game itself was so ugly that it was ignored......

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kokoro
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:02:24 AM

Yeah~ too bad it was just a pretty shell.

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Ignitus
Tuesday, February 17, 2015 @ 11:17:08 PM
Reply

I remember when cut scenes were prerendered well beyond the graphical capabilities of the hardware and that made them really cool. Nowdays cut scenes are just rendered in engine using the regular game assets so there is nothing to get excited about them now.

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DemonNeno
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:15:46 AM

That's not entirely true. Using the in game engine is true, but the cutscenes still look better. Cutscenes are like a studio's take of any given game. Leave the point of view and there's nothing. All excess is crushed so all of the detail, focus, and post processing can be directed at the scene. In game cutscenes still look better than in game graphics.

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:24:18 AM
Reply

Even with the kill-tube linearity in the first FFXIII... you gotta admit.... them cutscenes were still very "wow".

No one... NO ONE can accomplish that beauty in real time. Even on current gen. Even on PC.

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SaiyanSenpai
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:00:01 AM

Truth.

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FAREEZ
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 12:44:48 AM
Reply

I loved cutscenes, but if you interrupt the gameplay with cutscenes every 5 minutes that not cool. I pay to play not to watch...

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SaiyanSenpai
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:04:40 AM
Reply

Like in most things in life, balance is key. Cutscenes are awesome and are a great way to move the story forward, create character depth, or just pull off some cool, well choreographed fight sequences that would make John Woo jealous (the beginning of DMC4 comes to mind on this one).

Do too much and you risk turning people off. Too little and you risk not portraying the story you want to tell. Balance.

Last edited by SaiyanSenpai on 2/18/2015 1:06:00 AM

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Gordo
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:04:52 AM
Reply

Always love a good cut scene but they have to be integrated correctly into gameplay.

Don't mind if they are frequent but they need to be at least skippable. Nothing more infuriating that having to watch a cut scene 10 times in a row because of a badly placed check point.

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Shauneepeak
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:34:44 AM
Reply

I love cutscenes when they are done well as you mentioned Final Fantasy and MGS are perfect examples. For both FFXII and MGS3 on the PS2 it was about 15 minutes before you even gained control of a character at the beginning of the game.
I don't mind playing a game that is 50-60% cutscenes when it is actually a long enough game to have extended sequences of gameplay.

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Kevin555
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:53:11 AM
Reply

If the story is interesting and the game is good to play, then i don't mind a few cutscenes here and there to tie it altogether. Metal Gear Solid series has the best cutscenes in the industry imo. They're very long but most of them are just incredible to watch.

The first cutscenes that truly amazed me though was that train sequence in The Bouncer only to realize that it was actually in-game. Phenomenal for it's time, that game will always be special to me.

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kokoro
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:57:07 AM
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Does anyone remember how in FF8 you could move the character models during some of the cut scenes?

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Lawless SXE
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:03:12 AM
Reply

Honestly, no, I wasn't gaming then, but I will weigh in on the debate anyway. :)

If I'm being completely honest, I don't think, with the technology found in modern gaming consoles, that cutscenes are strictly necessary in the telling of a great story. And I'm not talking about a game like Gone Home where the narrative comes entirely from environmental storytelling, but in traditional AAA-oriented games, too.

It wouldn't be easy to tell a story such as The Last of Us without cutscenes, but that doesn't mean it's impossible. I mean, the opening scenes **SPOILERS** where you, playing as Joel, have to carry Sarah to the point where she's shot **END SPOILERS** is a fine example of how a developer can evoke emotion through the use of carefully controlled gameplay mechanics without delving into the use of QTEs. Uncharted is another example of this type of thing with the dynamism of some of the gameplay scenes that create tension to great effect. The Chateau, airplane and cruise ship from UC3 are all fine examples of that.
Furthermore, you have Mass Effect, Catherine, and Heavy Rain as examples of how you can "game-ify" dialogue, and then you have the implementation of novel game mechanics in the likes of Remember Me, Journey, and even GTAV that provide the ability to tell different stories in different ways without ever removing player control.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that cutscenes need to be excised from every game. I actually really enjoy seeing the way that developers use them to enhance the emotional and narrative quality of many games, but if they're nothing more than framing for one action scene after another, it's pretty easy to lose interest and see them as "lazy" game development. In general, though, I see them as an accompaniment to games, not a hindrance.

Anyway, I have stuff to do, so I'll leave it at that.

Peace.

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Banky A
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:37:09 AM

That's a really good testament to Naughty Dog and thatgamecompany's skills and their visions.

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Kevin555
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:07:02 AM
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One day i hope i get to play a Tekken that looks as good as the Tekken film Blood Vengeance.

One day....

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Vivi_Gamer
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 3:41:33 AM

Being fair, as much as I dislike the gameplay in modern Tekken (Juggling -_-) the graphics are phenominal and probably some of the best I've seen. TTT2 looks sensational.

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MrAnonymity
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:13:04 AM
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I still love cutscenes.

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Breadlover
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:38:05 AM
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So ironic that you would post this article Ben. I've been watching a 3-hour long YouTube video on Dead Space 3. Basically all the cutscenes, and gameplay rolled into 1 to make it look like a CG movie. Why would I do this you ask? I'm scared sh*t of thriller/horror games.. but I do love watching them.

I agree with your points. Thank goodness for cutscenes (thumbsup)

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JackieBoy
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:40:11 AM
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I always was a fan of cutscenes and I still love them but only in certain games and certain amount, when not taking like 80% of playtime. C'mon we all know that TloU, MGS, FF and GoW couldn't be what they are without those beautifull cutscenes.

Sigh...FFVIII intro was "the shit", I watched it like 100 times:)

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Banky A
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 2:44:12 AM

About 102 times here.

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Vivi_Gamer
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 3:40:18 AM

I still regard that Final Fantasy VIII introduction as the best within the industry - That or Tekken 2's. It's pure class and I remember just watching it again and again on the PS1 official demo :P

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 7:20:13 AM

The symbolism in it was what impressed me the most. I was surprised at how much attention they paid to subtle theatrical tools. Up to that point in video games, it was head and shoulders above anything else in terms of it's literary maturity.

In fact, it still probably ranks near the top. (Probably still number one for many)

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 11:09:05 AM

"when not taking like 80% of playtime."

No game in the history of the world has 80 percent cut-scenes.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 3:19:04 AM
Reply

Haha - this is "geek clickbait" if I ever saw one: *Everyone* have an opinion about cut-scenes. :)

On topic: They have a valid point, those who say that cutscenes had a more important role back in the days when gameplay graphics were quite primitive. Today there are more than one way to tell a story, and they should embrace that.

I think they did the cut-scenes *perfectly* in Mass Effect 3. The camera glided seamlessly from gameplay over to pre-scripted cut-scenes and back to gameplay. Perfection.


Last edited by Beamboom on 2/18/2015 3:22:01 AM

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 9:22:44 AM

Sorry for the long post, but I think I genuinely have some insight to offer.

I won't comment on what stories you and others like the best, nor will I comment on what medium of storytelling people like the best, because that's purely subjective.

What I can say is this... And I don't mean to sound high and mighty, btw... I just have some legitimate expertise in this area that I can share.

One of my degrees is a double major in physical education and theatre arts for a 4 year general BA. I didn't take a performance stream of theatre arts because I used to think I wanted to be a teacher, so I took the technical side of theatre. This included set design, production, stage management, directing, props and other technical forms of theatre, many english courses, etc.

If there were 2 major things I learned, one was about character development to the point that I think it's helped me in my current career in social services in being able to put myself in other people's shoes and understand an entire story of their life and how they got to where they are. The other is in HOW to tell a story.

Story is so much more than just a plot. It's far more than dialogue, emotion, or events. A great story uses a multitude of literary tools and, in theatre, a ton of unspoken communication and subtle cues. (At least in good productions) A good example that most know would be in A Christmas Carol, during the 3rd spirit section of the story, would be the small chair with Tiny Tim's cane, hat, and scarf draped around it. That prop alone says a lot, but what says even MORE is how the characters, in a well directed play, interact with it (or avoid it) and are generally aware of it and where it is.

In anything animated, we have the added tools of giving things visual beauty on a grand scale, as opposed to the limitations of a set. We can create completely new worlds. That allows us to give incredible detail to our subtleties that can be used in storytelling, both in unspoken communication and in visual, active props. (Such as the lone white feather that flies from a hope-filled rinoa into a sky so unusual it could only be unnatural, such as a time anomaly :p, only to turn into Squall's iconic weapon falling and sticking into a barren earth only to be visually overshadowed by a character that is both his protection and nemesis.)

My point is, even if you enjoy the immersive nature of something like Mass Effect 3, while well done and kinda cool, it lacks the ability cut to visual cues with the detail and grace that even an old PS1 game, like Final Fantasy 8, could have done (and has done without even a single syllable of verbal communication).

Actually, I recommend watching the FFVIII intro to see what I mean. It's hard to know what all the symbolism means at first, as is the case with any well done foreshadowing, but if you remember that everything means something, it's thick with symbolism, foreshadowing, and other literary tools.

And that kind of story telling is not something -ANY- game is able to accomplish in real time. Not on this gen. Not on PC. Not anywhere other than cutscenes.

Sure, ME3 might do some things in real time better than some games accomplish in cutscene, but that doesn't change the fact that the opportunities for storytelling in real time are no where near as great as they are in cutscenes. At least now they aren't. And they won't be for quite some time.

Last edited by Underdog15 on 2/18/2015 9:23:35 AM

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Beamboom
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 1:47:15 PM

There's cut-scenes in all the Mass Effect games? Full scenes with different perspectives, locations, facial expressions, jumps in timeline - just like regular scenes using traditional storytelling tools from the movies.
What they did so masterly in the third entry was the seamless transitions to/from. They became embedded in the game, as opposed to a break from it.

It's also worth stating something that's really very obvious: Some stories are better told in movies. Or books. And there have been attempts in the past of telling a story via a game that would have been better off being told in a monologue/non-interactive way.


Last edited by Beamboom on 2/18/2015 1:50:41 PM

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Underdog15
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 9:41:25 PM

I -definitely- disagree on that last sentiment. But it'd take way too long to explain why.

Also, I apologize for making my post too long for you to bother to read.

I've played the Mass Effect games, brother. Very good games with a relatively good story, no doubt. But just decent. Not great. And no where near as many literary tools used as games even 10-15 years were doing. I think the biggest problem here is that you don't really understand story-telling beyond the mediums that typically entertain you... which puts you at a severe disadvantage.

Last edited by Underdog15 on 2/18/2015 9:45:40 PM

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Beamboom
Thursday, February 19, 2015 @ 4:26:33 AM

Please accept my apologies for just browsing through your first reply. You were right in that assumption. I'll excuse myself with the fact that I was at work :)

I guess you may be right. For me, gaming is an activity. It's an option to participate. But I don't see that as a disadvantage.

I'd put it like this: If a game *requires* long non-interactive segments to tell a story, that story is not suitable for this medium. It's a bit simplified, but in essence that is how I see it. Games will never - and should not - replace books or movies. They were never meant to be.


Last edited by Beamboom on 2/19/2015 4:40:30 AM

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Underdog15
Thursday, February 19, 2015 @ 9:08:55 AM

But why are you assuming the need to be long-drawn out cutscenes? Or maybe our definitions of "long" are contrary to one another, as well...

And why are you assuming anyone thinks they should replace them? Movies shouldn't replace theatre, either. But they still share a tremendous amount of qualities. A good production should effectively use -EVERY- tool at it's disposal. Not segregate itself from other mediums entirely.

I don't think cutscenes need to be long to accomplish something. Aside from the ending after you beat the game, the longest cutscene in FFVIII is the opening, which isn't that long (3 minutes, and by far the longest cutscene aside from the ending).

But to illustrate my point, just watch it real quick. (It's not that long) You don't need to know what the symbolism represents to see how much is going on, although admittedly, it's hard to catch everything there first time around as well. Even small things, like black feathers vs. white feathers, enemies who are also brothers through conflict sharing scars of similar wounds... anyways, yeah.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9IkmZLFkFw

Keep in mind, it's a 1998 production... which makes it that much more impressive.

What this game accomplishes in that one single cutscene is not something you can do in a real-time event.

Last edited by Underdog15 on 2/19/2015 9:16:30 AM

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Beamboom
Thursday, February 19, 2015 @ 3:45:28 PM

Just for the record, I don't mind cut-scenes. They are necessary for many reasons in order to tell a story, in particular when you need to move the view away from the player (both in regards to time and location).

But when the entire story is told in the cut-scenes *today* (as opposed to back when there was no computing power to speak of), I think something is wrong. Today they should use the medium better. Like you say, they should use *every* tool at disposal. 100% agreed.

Like when some use MGS4 as an example of a great way to tell a story in a game: That story were told in it's *entirely* via cut-scenes. Nothing story-related happened in the actual game *at all*, at least not for as far as I got into that game (never finished it).
That's a movie! That is a movie split out in segments, with a game thrown in between the movie clips.

In regards to games replacing other medium: I am of the impression many gamers have games as their prime source of storytelling, thinking games can be just an as good a vehicle for a good story as any. In many cases that's not the case. And in many cases, what they are *really* enjoying (related to story) is in fact the movie within those games.

So that clip you showed me was a nice *film*. Cause that's what it is. It's a short film used as an introduction to a game. And that's fine, of course. And I agree, you can't do something like that in a real-time cut-scene. So it's a good use of cut-scene minutes indeed. :)

But judged as an animated FILM, most cut-scenes are really bad (not talking about your clip now, but in general). Poorly directed, lips totally out of sync, unnatural movements, plastic faces... It's catastrophically *bad* work. As a film, that is. It's just "good... for a game" kind of good.
So when a gamer insist that *this* is as good as any movie gets, they've replaced movies with something that's almost indescribably much worse.

But I don't think we disagree much. A story centric movie should of course have cut-scenes, and use them right. As one of many tools as you say, to tell a story in this very unique medium.


Last edited by Beamboom on 2/19/2015 3:56:04 PM

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Vivi_Gamer
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 3:38:55 AM
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The problem here is that it is very VERY difficult to expand on character development through in-game interactivity. There are times in Uncharted where Nate and Sully are bantering to one another but that's as far as you can go, just delivering backdrop content. The reason being that if you are in a firefight, you focus is more on staying alive rather than focusing on the delicacy of the drama. Having a more passive moment through cutscenes allows you to focus more on the subtleties of whats going on, which you can't do during an action frenzy.

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Deleted User
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 5:06:14 AM
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I remember when I managed the EB at White Marsh Mall and we were inundated with returns after the release of FF7 (back when you could return games before the onset of the cd burner) and the reason was that the game looked nowhere near the same as the advertised cutscenes. Hell, even back then there was a bit of pushback.

I think every gamer is ok with cutscenes. Alot of people play GTA and Assassins Creed and those games are littered with them. The problem is that The Order seems to have a cutscene to gameplay ratio that is just damn obscene in this era of gaming. Even if it's a 2:1 ratio, that's ridiculous and an absolute failure on Ready At Dawn's part to make a great game not some half assed Hollywood and game amalgamation. And let's be real: how compelling can the story actually be? A bunch of old mutton chopped English dudes and a broad yapping about werewolves? I'm sure a 50 minute episode of Torchwood could get the job done in less time and be more compelling.

Last edited by n/a on 2/18/2015 5:07:55 AM

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sawao_yamanaka
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 10:43:44 AM

Yes when all the characters are established sure. You complain about the order but have you actually played it? I have, and it is a good game with great gameplay. "2:1" is small in comparison to mgs. As much as I enjoyed the game. You could finish the game in under 2 and 1/2 hours and have over 15 hours of cutscenes. Mgs4 has over 40 hours of cutscenes.

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Broady
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 6:11:20 AM
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I would say it depends on the type of game. A story driven rpg (i.e. final fantasy) - cut scenes required. Non-story driven rpg (i.e. skyrim) - cut scenes not required.
In fact, thinking about it, any complex story driven game pretty much requires cut scenes to get a lot of points across.

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DemonNeno
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:21:00 AM
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We need cutscenes. The purpose isn't to just "look prettier". There's a story unfolding and should be allowed the proper amount of background. It's a great way to enhance the urgency of situations, help understand what going on, and builds on your knowledge of how everyone's role affects one another.

It's like saying that we don't need stories in action movies because the CGI is good enough to replace the dialogue.

No. No it isn't.

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Solid Fantasy
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:38:18 AM
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Maybe I'm part of a small demograph but I fully support cut scenes. They make for the best break from a long or difficult gameplay stretch. To me they are as good as finding that perfect weapon on Borderlands or finally defeating Cerberus on GoWIII on the hard setting. It's just something to look forward to.

I wouldn't even mind it if Guns of the Patriots had ten hrs of cutscenes instead of the already seven plus.

It's hard not to have cutscenes with out a reasonably attempt for good story telling and I think we can all agree that some better story telling in the game industry would be a nice boon.

Also, the cutscenes in FFVIII were monumental. All three of the PS1 FFs were up there. But VIII really blew my mind. Does anyone remember the semi cutscene when Squall is punching the other Galbadian solider while clinging to a rope in the middle of a massive battle scene. The amount of detail and chaos in that one part of the game was sure signature of the days of SquareSoft.

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MRSUCCESS
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:55:47 AM
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To those complaining about cut scenes in MGS -- let's not forget that MGS does the best story telling out of any franchise. It may be complicated if you jumped mid series and you're trying to understand the whole series from one game.

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Solid Fantasy
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 9:15:29 AM

YES! What Big Boss said. The MG franchise needs more competition in the story complexity category.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 9:32:11 AM
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Still love em, I wish Final Fantasy hadn't stopped having them.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 10:16:32 AM
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I saw that video setup at The Mall of America, after having beaten Final Fantasy VII and reading about VIII in magazines I just stood in awe.

Ohhh the days of cut scenes and Final Fantasy greatness...

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 11:11:42 AM
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One telling point: The games that are most widely recognized as having the best stories also seem to have the most cut-scenes. MGS is a great example of that.

I will absolutely guarantee that because MGSV is more open now, it will not be viewed as having the same quality story as the plots in the earlier installments. Whether that story is of an equal quality or not is irrelevant; HOW it's delivered and how we experience it will be different, and that will put the story on the back burner more often than not.

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 5:56:55 PM

i think how affects the quality

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Nynja
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 10:08:20 PM

Excellent point.

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xenris
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 11:23:20 AM
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Drakengard 1 and 2 have some of best CGI I have ever seen to this day, and I remember the weird crazy haunting world that they created.

That being said I like a balance, if there are too many cutscenes it feels like why didn't they make a movie. Unless the gameplay is crazy unique and awesome I will always wonder why these guys made a game.

Story telling can be done around gameplay, but it is the most difficult way to do it, I think the only games that did it are the original Bioshock, and Half life 1 and 2.

Those games had no cutscenes and were able to have the story unfold while you were inside of it.

However this is a challenging feat and very few devs have done this correctly.

Also Shadow of the Colossus, has a really awesome narrative, but the story and details the player makes up, which I think is really awesome and memorable for me, but I wouldn't say that it means it has a good story exactly.

I personally like cutscenes, if the game in question I am playing because I want the story, like if its MGS, FF, etc. Some games I just want to play because the story is garbage so I skip their cutscenes.



Last edited by xenris on 2/18/2015 11:27:39 AM

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trumpetmon65
Wednesday, February 18, 2015 @ 8:58:33 PM
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As long as they advance the story well, I don't mind then at all. What I do not like is lots of crap dialogue. Lots of good dialogue is fine. I guess you could say I enjoy things done well. So do that developers.

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berserk
Thursday, February 19, 2015 @ 9:57:52 AM
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When there is as much cut-scene as their is gameplay , yes , it s a problem .

I don t know why there is anyone that can defend this .

When a game is like a movie with rarely a time to actually play the game yourself , something is wrong in my opinion .

At least in heavy rain , your decision had a big impact on the game .

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TheOldOne
Thursday, February 19, 2015 @ 6:12:49 PM
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Cutscenes are cool. As long that they add to the plot. If they put them just to make the game look longer I would notice rightaway and just stand up and get something to drink or eat while looking from afar so i get the point of that video and not necesarilly enjoy it. Must of them I do.

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