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David Jaffe, Ready At Dawn Weigh In On The Order's Reviews

The controversy surrounding The Order: 1886 reaches far and wide.

Recently, industry icon David Jaffe and some of the Ready at Dawn members weighed in on the situation.

Check out the video below: I think one of the most important parts of the footage is when they wonder if people are simply posting super low review scores for the sake of attention; what Jaffe is basically calling "sensationalist scores." Furthermore, Jaffe makes the astute observation - one I've made many times before - that it seems a little weird that seemingly anyone can get labeled a "professional source" just because they're on Metacritic.

Bear in mind that Jaffe hasn't played the game in question; he's merely talking about reviews and the state of the industry in general and really, he's not far off. What do you think?

Related Game(s): The Order: 1886

Tags: the order 1886, david jaffe, ready at dawn, the order reviews

2/25/2015 9:43:13 PM Ben Dutka

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Legacy Comment System (30 posts)


shaytoon
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 10:31:38 PM
Reply

play the damn game first. even if ur trying to defend/deflect the negativity, at least know what youre getting involved with.

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Underdog15
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:07:20 PM

It would give him more clout, no doubt. But as many here pointed out, the reasons and examples reviewers gave just didn't line up with their scoring. A number of places, things just didn't make much sense.

I think he has enough to go on, combined with his knowledge of the industry, to have an opinion worth considering. Afterall, even amateur vg enthusiasts here said basically the same things he did and were right.

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Jawknee
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 10:46:44 PM
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The negative reviews are ridiculous. The Order has better gunplay than MGS4 and shorter cutscenes yet MGS4 got (deservedly) 10/10 everywhere. Of course The Order doesn't deserve a perfect score. It just doesn't simply because it doesn't have all the other things that make MGS4 great but these low scores, which I consider anything less than a 7 are idiotic and I would consider clickbait (kotaku). I personally give it a 8, maybe an 8.5.

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MRSUCCESS
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 11:23:26 PM

Better gun play than MGS4? Hard to believe there.

Hard to compare any MGS to The Order...why? Because MGS is an established franchise that came out when there was a vast majority of gamers and reviewers.

Agree with this comment 8 up, 1 down Disagree with this comment

WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 11:25:50 PM

It feels like what TPS gunplay might be in a better looking RAGE to me.

Agree with this comment 4 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

FAREEZ
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 11:51:50 PM

Lol, better than mgs4, really?

Last edited by FAREEZ on 2/25/2015 11:56:45 PM

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MyWorstNightmar
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 12:03:13 AM

He didn't say The Order was better than MGS4, he said the gunplay was better.

If anyone would have an opinion worth listening to on that front it would be Jawk. He's played through MGS4 at least 5 times.

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DIsmael85
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 12:07:00 AM

I've played MGS4 countless times. I don't know if I'd go as far as saying The Order has better gunplay though. Fun Gunplay? Yes. Better than MGS4? No.

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Jawknee
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 12:55:48 AM

Mr. Success Yes. Better gunplay. As in movement, aiming, recoil etc. I've played MGS4 more than 10 times. It was my favorite PS3 game and is my favorite installment of one of my favorite franchise so I take no pleasure in admitting the shooting mechanics in The Order are indeed better. If you guys could put aside your bias for a second you might understand what I am getting at.

Also I said, if you can can comprehend what I actually wrote(especially that troll Fareez) I said MGS4 is still a much better game overall I just found the shooting mechanics to be better in The Order. They feel more fluid and natural as opposed to MGS4.

10+ Myworst. :) I even got the Big Boss emblem which is no easy task.

Last edited by Jawknee on 2/26/2015 1:00:46 AM

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MyWorstNightmar
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:33:43 AM

Ha, yeah, well I almost said 10 times but I went conservative because if I would have said 10, it would have sounded like I was exaggerating.

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Jawknee
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:38:07 AM

Lol I wish I was exaggerating. I was obsessed with MGS4 when it came out.

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Axe99
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 4:10:35 PM

Totally agree Jawknee, and glad to hear you're enjoying it :). As you say, anything below a 7 is plain unprofessional clickbait, and a 7 would be a poor job done. I'd say it's an easy 8 from my angle, not a 9, but easily an 8 :).

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WorldEndsWithMe
Wednesday, February 25, 2015 @ 11:26:53 PM
Reply

I don't have 7 minutes but it's good someone is raising these questions now. Though it ain't easy getting on metacritic.

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Jawknee
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:01:09 AM

You didn't miss much.

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Beamboom
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 9:38:00 AM

In light of recent discussions I *could* now make a snide remark about attention span problems. But I won't. That's how nice a guy I am. :p

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Underdog15
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:10:43 PM

My issue is that my boss wouldn't have the attention span for me spending 7 minutes watching a video. ;)

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johnld
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 3:58:12 AM
Reply

i just want the right people reviewing different type of games. if youre type in games, isnt the type youre reviewing, you should pass it to someone else. if you have no choice, the least you could do is keep your own preferences away from the review. i just watched the beyond ign podcast. the guy who reviewed the order called the game boring mostly because of all the cutscenes. then he said himself that he was someone who played a call of duty multiplayer to max prestige then played campaign because he already beat multiplayer. i have nothing against this guy but hes not the type of person i want reviewing a single player game. it justdoesnt fit if the person thinks that the single player as an after thought and now hes reviewing a game like the order. i dont know other reviewer qualifications are but i dont like people judging things that they dont fit with. like how "critics" marking gran turismo and previous jrpgs down because theyre not their type of games.

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matt99
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:59:21 PM

That's what's supposed to set critics apart from the rest of the gaming community, they aren't supposed to allow personal preference to affect their reviews. The key words there being "supposed to", sadly many reviewers review games subjectively rather than objectively, which I think is one of the points Ben mentioned when he talked about the low scores it has received.

I think it's just laziness, a professional critic should be able to review any game objectively. Granted, I'm not a critic so I don't know what the "industry standard" way of approaching a review is, but in my opinion in order to review a game objectively you can't just pick up the game and play. You need to do a bit of prep and find out what genre the game is, who the target audience is, what the developer's objectives were in making the game etc. If you lay out this foundation then you aren't just going by "feel" which is what most reviewers seem to have done.

Perhaps I'm entirely wrong, and Ben can correct me if I am, but I doubt he just reviews a game without some sort of prep or methodology to stay objective.

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Ben Dutka PSXE [Administrator]
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 6:52:01 PM

Depends on the game. Most games I don't need to do much prep but others (like in the case of fighting or RTS), I do have to do some research. Mostly, I look for what fans really like and want from their games, and I read other reviews from respected sources on past series installments.

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JackDillinger89
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 11:56:51 AM
Reply

The order 1886 is getting bashed simply because its short and no replayability. I think its the main culprit for its negativity. The experience may deserve a high score but nowadays value also factors in reviews.

You pay $50 a year for psn and what good does that do for a game like the order a ps4 exclusive?

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sawao_yamanaka
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 1:43:37 PM

It isn't short. It is short on a speed run. My first time through it was 10 hours. My second time it was 6. Don't spout crap you don't know.

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matt99
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 2:01:43 PM

Just because you pay $50 a year for PSN doesn't mean every game HAS to have multiplayer.

Agree with this comment 2 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

Jawknee
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 2:16:55 PM

"You pay $50 a year for psn and what good does that do for a game like the order a ps4 exclusive?"

lol, one has nothing to do with the other.

Agree with this comment 3 up, 0 down Disagree with this comment

johnld
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 4:15:57 PM

guess this idiot missed the part where paying for plus gives you more than just multiplayer. its kinda hard to miss the free games and discounts THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE YEAR which more than PAYS FOR ITSELF AT LEAST TENFOLD of what you paid for it initially. i mean i got games i would never get that i liked playing like rogue legacy for free.

also replayable to me is subjective. i call bs on no replayability for my case. i play my games on normal first to enjoy the ride then play on harder mode again after that. thats replayability to me. if you play a game just once then thats on you. it has no bearing on my gameplay at all.

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PC_Max
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 2:32:47 PM
Reply

I found the vid a bit... a WTF experience. It really did not have any order to it as if it was just a couple of friends meeting somewhere and just making conversation. Some of what Jaffe said and others such as shock review to get people to hit their sites and such and then they veered off in various other directions. It would be nice have them actually go point by point as opposed to jumping around in the conversation.

That said I liked the laid back walk through he did, just wished it was more structured.

That said I hear people here going on about the game being unreplayable and such. I can't believe people still don't realize how subjective that is. I had to force myself to finish Borderlands and its sequel and have absolutely no interest in ... replaying them. There is no replay value in either game.

AND thats because its not really the best example of a game I really enjoy. Does the game suck, no of course not. It was predictable, nothing innovative about it, side missions were repetitive and boring, DLC not worth purchasing, and being I do not like leaving a game unfinished I had to force myself to finish them after about half way through.

So I did not get my moneys worth because 1. not replayable value as each area just seems the same both in look and mission, 2. simple predictable story with no twist or surprise , 3. very repetitive from beginning to end 4. the sequel just seemed to be the same thing over again but with some minor changes.

Does the game such, no, just not on the top of my list. I am sure many others out there would disagree with me, but its subjective. If I was a reviewer and would break things down in greater detail BUT I would also say if you love FPS games in open world its a game for you, because I think it was designed specifically for them. Nothing wrong with that, but its not on top of my list.

This community needs to mature more and see things as the game industry is there for everyones enjoyment regardless of your game genre tastes. When I say mature I mean in regards to experience with games and the gaming community/industry whether in the industry professionally or as just a gamer. Age is one thing but experience is key and with it I would have hoped appreciation for it.

We are gamers, we love it as entertainment, I specifically love it for its variety that it shares although I think these days is starting to dwindle due to others telling the industry it needs to stop being creative and dare I say... artistic (if you can define that).

Look what happend to Mirror's Edge. Thank god the nay sayers did not kill it or a potential sequel. Mind you I worry the sequel is going to fall to so called popular vision of what games should be in their eyes.

For the real gamers...
Keep playing to your tastes and don't let... no don't allow others to dictate to you what you should be playing and how to play it.

Peace!

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Rachet_JC_FTW
Saturday, February 28, 2015 @ 2:13:57 AM

yeah for sure won't ever let anyone deter me from playing a game that i think i will enjoy alot. and i'd like to think i've been around games long enough and that i'm mature enough to be objectice ben a talk about games and related things. i really hope all this doesn't stop things from being made that would suck big time i reckon

happy gaming

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Banky A
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 4:53:25 PM
Reply

I have just discovered that David Jaffe sounds exactly like Mike Ross and vice versa.

Mike Ross is a Afrimerican loved by the fighting game community. Look him up. Gonna' tweet him now before it's too late.

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Bio
Thursday, February 26, 2015 @ 5:14:46 PM
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lol "industry icon" David Jaffe.

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Rachet_JC_FTW
Friday, February 27, 2015 @ 6:57:16 PM
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i think that they have been harsh and i think there was an agenda of some sort or a smear campaign cos people just want to hate for the sake of it atleast thats the way i see it. and that most of these seem to be done by people who probably haven't and are hating for the sake of it

happy gaming

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Rachet_JC_FTW
Friday, February 27, 2015 @ 6:59:41 PM
Reply

but they had some good points including the ones david made

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