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Are The Days Of Game-Only Mobile Devices Numbered?

The PlayStation Vita has been warmly received by both journalists and gamers alike, but the base $249 price tag may be cause for concern.

And according to Lyle Hall and Matthew Seymour at Heavy Iron Studios, the Vita is destined for hard times. They told GamesIndustry.biz that gamers aren't willing to shell out the big cash for a handheld game device.

"If people aren't willing to pay $249 for a Nintendo 3DS why would they pay $299 for Vita? People don't want to carry more than one thing in their pocket, that's why Android and iPhone have done so well, they are the devices of choice, they offers multiple functions outside of gaming."

Seymour, who has work experience at 2K Games and Microsoft Game Studios, took things a step further by simply saying the Vita launch will be a "car wreck." He also mentioned the Xperia Play, implying that it hasn't been successful. As of now, the Nintendo 3DS has fallen in price and has suffered from a lack of available titles, so everyone has concerns about the Vita. Hall says the biggest problem is that consumers just don't want a device that "only does games."

"The consumer has spoken. We wanted to see that world exist - more players, more opportunities for us, but at the same time people don't want that. Unless there's a super technology paradigm shift it's not going to shift back."

Tags: vita, playstation vita, sony, ps vita

8/15/2011 8:38:39 PM Ben Dutka

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Comments (71 posts)

ZettaiSeigi
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 9:50:06 PM
Reply

A few months ago, everybody was lauding Sony for revealing the $249 price for the Vita. Is it because Nintendo slashed the 3DS' price by 33% that almost everyone is panicking on Sony's behalf?

Personally, I would gladly pay $299 for the Vita and I wish I could get it now. Most of the games that would come exclusively to the Vita would never see the light of day in other "more popular" platforms, and that would justify purchasing the Vita (at least for me). And while there are a lot of nifty little games on smartphones that are getting popular, they are still going to take the backseat to the full-pledged games that I usually play.

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SolidFantasy
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:11:18 PM
Reply

Well I guess I'm part of the minority. I wan't specialization in my devises. This worries me because I want the best technology has to offer, not something cheap that will appeal to middle aged mothers and there kids to make them think the're real gamers *cough 3DS. No if I want to play games on the go I will use my PS Vita because I bought it for that purpose. I will call someone on my cell phone, b/c that's what I bought it for. Computer to email and so fourth. Anything else should only be there as a bonus. The multi function devises are fine as long as they don't drown out my demograph.

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Mamills
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:11:22 PM
Reply

yep, i agree totally.
sorry, but y carry more than 1 device, no time for that.
i just play my iphone.
got FF tactics and FF1 and FF3 streetfighter 4 etc.
andf not only that, the phones are getting more and more powerful.

Last edited by Mamills on 8/15/2011 10:14:29 PM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:20:27 PM

Not powerful enough to play something like Golden Abyss methinks.

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Mamills
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:39:00 PM

true but i dont care about golden abyss just yet.

plus you dont think Sony sees this coming?
why do you think they made playstation suite.
When the phones do get powerful enough, golden abyss will be right there along with everything else.

As i said nowadays ppl really don't want to carry around another device just to play games.
only the hardcore minority care about it. and yes its a minority.

Last edited by Mamills on 8/15/2011 10:43:24 PM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:50:16 PM

people may WANT to carry around one device, but they don't. They have a laptop, a cell phone, a tablet, an ipod, a Kindle, and whatever else they think they need. Do you know why? Batteries. If you have your smartphone jacked into all its internet features and you use it for all your emailing and tweeting and MP3 listening and also your gaming the battery won't last to lunch.

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Mamills
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:53:41 PM

lol, no 1 person carries all that crap.
plus do u not think battery technology will not get better?
lol, ur not thinking ahead

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WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 12:16:15 AM

Not until you get a mini-nuke in there, it's had time to get better but it can't and stay competitive. Even if people don't carry those to work with them every day they still have them all.

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sawao_yamanaka
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:23:48 AM

Ipad and the iphone are missing the most important aspect. 1st party developers. No buttons are really a big deal breaker for me and as far as those games mentioned even the 3ds has a better offering.
The Vita will not fail because of one "companies" prediction considering the games they made, please dont hold your breath. I would much rather carry my Vita around for a dedicated handheld than my phone and have to worry about my battery life. If you weren't sold on the Vita from the get-go then there is no selling you on the fact.
You wont find the same kind of gaming experiences on the iphone that you will find on the Vita.

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Mamills
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 6:57:35 AM

and in terms of graphics, they are getting there.

http://youtu.be/n1og1bg0FwI

as for buttons im the same way, but like i learned to play shooters with a controller i learned to play with touch controls

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Neo_Aeon666
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 7:40:10 AM

I think you fail to see the Vita might become the *true* extension to your home gaming. If they really push on that dual release of PS3/Vita titles then they will rule the UNIVERSE! :D And now with autocloud you don't even need to bother uploading your saves (if you are a plus member).

The mobile devices blow. I am using my phone for text/google maps/call people/agenda. Anymore than that is stupid and just drains the battery life too much. That is why a real second gaming device is needed. I have the 3DS at the moment but I feel its days are numbered as the Vita is coming closer. In the end my 3DS will be my pokemon/mario platform while I'll be able to play my *real* games on vita with full trophy support :D (yes I am a trophy hoar lol)

Not to mention the Vita will blow any phone away in specs when it comes out. We will probably have to wait till Iphone 7 for similar specs and still it won't be a dedicated gaming machine and won't have real *controls* (and anyone who says he will carry a bluetooth controller to play his iphone can go die cuz I will never put my iphone on my lap while holding a controller in public transit, thats the best way to get it stolen in 0.5 sec in montreal lol) (plus it looks stupid)

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Highlander
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:17:08 PM
Reply

Personally I think that the idea of smartphones is very nearly a painful one. It's a jack of all trades and a master of none. game only? Since when was Vita, or the PSP for that matter, a game only device? The 3G Vita has the potential to be everything that an iPad is, with a much smaller size.

Honestly though, smartphones are to me the two bit hookers of the handheld world. Commodity devices, stack 'em high, sell 'em low, grab the consumer with the 'flash', and the dash their hopes. At the end of the day about the only thing that a Vita 3G can't do that any given smartphone can, is make a phone call.

I agree with Zettai on the price thing too. Just a short time ago people were concerned that the Vita would drop with a price in the $400+ range. Then it's announced with a $249.99/$299.99 price and people go nuts. Now here we are a few weeks later and Nintendo has slashed the price of the 3DS because it's been an abject failure by it's own standards, and suddenly the VIta is doomed and the entire handheld gaming market is doomed?

Who in the hell are we kidding here? Look at what people are prepared to drop on the iTurds from Apple. Look at how much an iTurd2 ir iFawn 4 actually costs a consumer. And yet we're supposed to think the sky is falling on the handheld gaming segment or that Vita is overpriced? Personally I smell a preemptive FUD campaign by messers Apple and Microsoft. Something that has become the hallmark of how those two companies drive their sales and market grown. Scare the consumer away from other products and clean up afterwards. I hate it.

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godsman
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 11:42:46 PM

I completely agree. The handhelds offer an experience unmatched by any phones. I can't even play a decent pinball game without worrying I might get excited and crack the screen.

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sawao_yamanaka
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:26:30 AM

Exactly!
Highlander you are my hero! :P
Well anyways people always complain about the pricing no matter what, especially since their competitor dropped the price on their overpriced system. And yet these same people go ahead and pay upwards to $600 on an Ipad?!? Please take your complaints elsewhere.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:01:52 AM

"The 3G Vita has the potential to be everything that an iPad is" -> Not while running a closed system, High. That is the core problem here, that is what's keeping both the PSP and the Vita from being used at their full potential.
The PSP is a game only device because Sony keep it that way. The browser suck. The camera suck. The internet radio feature is so bad it's embarrassing. And what else can you use it for? An mp3 player? Oh hooray...

I've always wanted something as simple as a notepad feature for my psp. I can't get it, cause Sony is not offering it. As things looks today, the Vita has the potential of being *nothing* that an iPad is, other than a gaming device. Unfortunately!

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 3:08:53 AM

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Dancemachine55
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:12:35 AM

Took the words right out of my mouth Highlander!

An iPhone outright here in Australia with no phone plan is $800.

A PS Vita (which can do as much as an iPhone but make phone calls) is only $350 AUD.

An iPhone is more convenient, yes, but for gamers (I mean people who play more than 2 games a year, CoD and Angry Birds), the PS Vita is a dream machine!!!

PS3 graphics?? check
Two analog sticks?? check check
Big name titles at or near launch?? check
Wifi and and optional 3G model?? check and check
Touch screen and touch pad (for the kids who hate buttons)?? check

What gamer in their right mind WOULDN'T want a PS Vita?!?!?

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:15:34 AM

Give this man a medal. He speaks TRUTH!

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WorldEndsWithMe
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:58:12 AM

lol @ Dance, my best friend only plays CoD and Angry Birds.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:58:30 AM

Dancemachine: Quoting, "A PS Vita (which can do as much as an iPhone but make phone calls)" -> Dude, what enormous fanboy shades must you wear to make such a claim? :D

An extraction of a few things a smart phone enables you to do:
- Get your laptop online while on the road
- Internet chat using msn/g+/gtalk/most other chat protocols
- Facebook/Google+ interactivity
- Podcast client
- Google map service
- Shoutcast internet radio
- Integration with your appointments calendar, contacts, email server
- Open/edit office documents
- ... Not to mention just about one MILLION applications of all shapes and sizes, a majority of them available as a *free* (ad-sponsored) version.

Please tell me, what of the above can or will the Vita enable you to do?


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 3:59:15 AM

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Fane1024
Saturday, August 20, 2011 @ 5:20:13 AM

PSV has Skype, so you can make phone calls...free phone calls (at least they should be free).

Facebook, yes. Also, Twitter and probably Google+ if it's successful.

*PSP* has RSS feeds; I don't know what else a "podcast client" does. It also has (crappy) internet radio. There's no reason PSV won't have better versions.

Every editor I've seen for iOS is pretty weak, but I agree that there should be one on PSP/PSV.

Last edited by Fane1024 on 8/20/2011 5:31:48 AM

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WorldEndsWithMe
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 10:18:38 PM
Reply

Heavy Iron Studios? Never heard of em. Go back to the kid's table, the grown ups are talking.

Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 8/15/2011 10:21:39 PM

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:33:30 AM

They did licensed games... and a UFC Trainer game. I agree with your assessment of them :)

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Xombito
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:32:45 AM

Scooby Doo games, they did the first Evil Dead game on PSone but it sucked. I guess they did some handhelds. They're a hack developer.

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Temjin001
Monday, August 15, 2011 @ 11:39:57 PM
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I think it's indisputable, the Vita will be the best handheld on the market for some time while it has support.

I do think some of these analyst concerns are valid. While I think the Vita is cool, I don't know if I care enough to invest into an extra $250, plus laying down $40 per game for that kind of entertainment. Suffice to say, I've never been a heavy portable gamer, but I love my iPhone for all the many cool things I can do with it on the go, games included. I can live without a dedicated mobile gaming platform a lot easier than without a multimedia mobile communications device. My phone has become intrinsically part of my every day life, and only having to worry about one electronic mobile device that does everything, actually more than I ever imagined, makes me plenty happy. I think, for now, I'll keep my premium gaming interests with the consoles and PC offerings and leave the mobile entertainment to affordable and pick-up and play in nature.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:50:52 AM

I believe you described how *many* think just there, Temjin. It's not a question if the Vita will be a good device. It's real problem is if it is needed.

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:39:10 AM

Beamboom, of course it's not needed, but 130 million DS sales, and 60-odd million PSP sales clearly state that there is a market for the device. Despite what people seem to think, even if lifetime sales barely exceed 50million, that is a damn good number, and more than enough to have made the project worthwhile for Sony.

Temjin, as I wrote below, everyone knows that hardcore gaming on the go is a niche market. Most people prefer the iPhone type games because they're easier and more accessible. So be it. Vita isn't designed for that market, but people who are easily bored with such piecemeal experiences (like myself), and want more depth on a consistent basis, along with the quality intrinsic in console games, rather than simply striving for accessibility. Different strokes for different folks.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 4:06:49 AM

Lawless, if they think of this as a niche product aimed at adult hardcore gamers with cash to spare, then it may serve a purpose. What do I know. But do this segment want to do hardcore gaming on a small handheld?

Also, judging from a majority of the games released for handhelds it looks like the industry more consider the handhelds to be for the young gamers, not the hardcore. And the young gamers today own a smartphone.

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 4:10:53 AM

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 5:09:10 AM

The problem I see is how many young gamers have the money to spend on the Vita? Sure, the same amount as the 3DS, realistically speaking, but even that was price prohibitive. Also, you have to consider the genealogy of the device: The PSP was *never* really a device for kids, and the Vita is following that trend. Sure, LBP, ModNation, SoundShapes and the like will appeal to children, but they also appeal to the older folk. Add to that games like Uncharted, WipEout, CoD, KZ, Resistance, Disgaea, Ridge Racer and Silent Hill, and you quickly see where the priorities of the device lay.

Of course, that won't necessarily be the majority of games, but the PSP had a VERY different library from the DS, and if the Vita were even seeming to be targetted at youth, I'd agree with you. Things being as they are, I can't. As for the smartphone comment, there are people that aren't satisfied with what they have to offer :)

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 5:47:15 AM

Yes I do agree that the PSP had a hugely different library from the DS. I could never have owned a DS, ever. Just looking at the wall'o'pink at the DS stand made me realize that the DS was not for me.

I follow your logic. Furthermore, even if they *did* try to reach the young gamers with Vita they would not succeed. Ergo 3rd party devs will probably not aim for the young gamers either, since there will be so few of them on the Vita.

So... That means Vita is mainly for the adult gamers. And will an adult gamer, especially those without any gaming relation to Sony (and that is, sad enough, a *huge* majority of the gamers out there), will they buy a Vita?
I am worried that they will not, from a purely logical reasoning (as mentioned in my other posts here).

But I may be wrong. Consumers are not driven by logic. Maybe the Vita will be a huge success.
I'd not put my money on it though. And I stand by my prediction: The Vita will be the last handheld gaming console from Sony.


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 5:52:29 AM

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 6:12:52 AM

Ah, logic. How I hate it... Looking at it that way, you're dead right. As for your prediction, I both agree and disagree. To illuminate why that is I'll post something that I wrote a little while back:

"However, if one looks into the future, they will quickly come to the realisation that the console model can’t last a whole lot longer. Not in its current form anyway. Not with digital distribution becoming the norm, the mass market drawing away from long-seated sessions and the reaching of a certain plateau in terms of graphics and processing power. The portables will inherit the future. This will allow the same range of experiences to be embedded, particularly if Sony’s consumer VR tech works out, at a cheaper development cost, and will also allow innovation for years to come as more emergent technologies begin to take shape. More importantly, the core gamers will not necessarily miss out, as the new universal gaming devices should, by all accounts, be able to be connected up to a new generation of televisions via wireless technology and stream graphics data. Perhaps they will even allow form-shifting into a more palatable shape when the on-board screen is not in use.

To date, the consoles have always paved the way to the future, but with the immediate future of these devices looking rather stagnant in terms of the evolutionary possibilities, it only makes sense to take note of their complimentary devices. Mobile processors are becoming far more powerful, and that trend will undoubtedly continue until they also reach the same plateau as those found in consoles. However, it is more than this. Each generation of video gaming has offered something new, something other than better graphics, which really is all that the promise that a ‘next-generation’ holds. It’s a sobering thought to realise that we have experienced the Renaissance, and are now in the Golden Age. There will be no Industrial Revolution. Not yet."

Blah, blah, blah. If you're interested in how I got to that point, the full write-up is here: http://www.velocitygamer.com/pt/Gaming-Technology-and-Trends-The-Future-of-Hardware/blog.htm

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StangMan80
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:21:34 AM
Reply

This is why the Sony's phone and the PSP should be brought together. I would pay 300 for that.. imagine.. The Vita and the X-peria as one gadget. (: That's why I didn't understand the X-peria play, I want a PlayStation phone!

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sawao_yamanaka
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:39:44 AM

Well if the Vita has skype like the psp does you can buy the 3G Vita version and use that to talk to other Vita players.

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 17, 2011 @ 10:40:57 AM

I thought that the point of Skype was to talk to telephone users everywhere?

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Claire C
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:14:33 AM
Reply

My first thought is.. how the hell do you know? It isn't even out yet. How can you say people don't want it? People on the internet seem to be getting pretty hyped for it from what I can tell. Why are developers trolling lately? lol

Last edited by Claire C on 8/16/2011 2:15:11 AM

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jimmyhandsome
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:31:17 AM

No one knows, but its probably this guys job to predict how well/poorly it will sell.

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Claire C
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 12:25:52 PM

That's not a developer's job.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:15:43 AM
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I think the Vita will be the last generation of dedicated gaming handhelds from Sony. I just can not help but seeing these gadgets as a dying breed.

Please note, I *love* my PSP, it has given me endless hours of fun while waiting at airports, on the train and during holidays.
But now, whenever I am about to leave for holidays I leave my PSP behind. Despite my love for it, I just can't be bothered bringing it along when I already got my Android phone with me. It's advantages no longer outweigh it's disadvantages.

See, it's not so much a question if the Vita will be a technically better product. The problem for Sony is that my Android phone is good *enough* for those fragmented moments during travel and holidays. How many Android generations is the Vita supposed to survive?

And it's not so much a question if the price of Vita is fair: I already own the phone, it's already bought and it's with me, always.
It's got a handful of simple, yet addictive and entertaining titles, and I hate to admit it, but they are *perfect* for their intended use.

The price for the Vita plus *one* game equals around one *hundred* games for Android - more if you aim for the cheap ones. If this matter to me then just imagine what it will matter to a poor student.


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 2:28:28 AM

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realmadpuppy
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:27:47 AM
Reply

already preordred my Vita(and paid most of it off), as much as I love all things android, I prefer a dedicated, powerful gaming handheld.

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Dancemachine55
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:03:14 AM
Reply

Typical journalistic bull!!!

These analysts and all the journalists listening to them are the biggest bunch of hypocrits I have ever come across! First they were applauding the price tag and launch lineup of the Vita at E3, NOW it's become a rocky road where it's being compared to the iPhone and Android devices where at first it was only compared with 3DS.

Here's how I see it.

The PS Vita will be a slow start but will grow to a big success over time, and the great launch lineup of games will give it a strong foothold in the portable gaming industry. It will appeal more to the travelling hardcore gamer (which is growing in numbers with some iPhone gamers wanting more than tap and swipe) and has a better lineup of launch games than the 3DS did at launch.

The PS Vita is being sold at a loss here people!!!! $249 is an excellent price for what you're getting, and $299 with 3G included? The tech savvies out there were salivating at E3!! Nothing has changed in price or model of the PS Vita, so why all the sudden fear towards it?

Journalism. Good for informing, bad for shaping public opinion.

PS Vita should not be compared to iPhone, as the iPhone does not have the capabilities to support high quality shooters or fast paced platformers and action titles, both graphically and in control scheme. The iPhone is good for making phone calls, surfing the net for a little info, and maybe playing a quick little game while in the waiting room or on a train or bus.

PS Vita is a dedicated gaming device for people who want more than Angry Birds, Doodle Jump or Cut the Rope. Sure, those games are fun, but there's no sense of satisfaction in finishing it, and online multiplayer is hardly popular on smartphones. No good stories, average graphics, barely playable or non-existant multiplayer, no buttons or solid controls, the iPhone has a lot to do to catch up with portable gaming devices like 3DS or PS Vita.

I honestly think the price will be a big hurdle at first for many of the casual gamers and non-fans of PS Vita. Fans of Playstation will definitely be getting this though, so I predict sales well over 2 million within the first few weeks.

As for longevity?

Games. PS Vita has got this in the bag with PSP and PSone games instantly playable, great AAA titles in development for the Vita, including a portable CoD for all the millions of fans out there, AND enough bells and whistles with the touch screen, rear touch pad and gyroscope to test developers' creativity with new ways to play. 3DS had a rocky start, but with Zelda, Mario, Kid Icarus, Star Fox, Mario Kart and Smash Bros confirmed for the little machine, (along with a big price drop recently) I think the 3DS and Vita are gonna be big competition next year and onwards.

I do hope journalists and analysts will lighten up. Bad press leads to bad sales, AND THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH VITA!!!! The price is perfect for tech you're getting, and it can do so much more than the 3DS anyway!!

I'm sick of all this unnecessary bad press. Wish those analysts would just shut up!!!

Dancemachine55 OUT!

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:14:56 AM

Unnecessary and seemingly cause-less bad press and a general "it's too expensive" or "no one needs that" vibe are remarkable similar to the year long dis-information campaign that greeted the PS3. Funny how the same thing is happening again eh? Almost as if someone is coordinating and staging the entire thing. But, who would stand to gain from hurting Sony's interests? Who would have the marketing muscle to engineer such a campaign without spending a penny to do it? I'm just saying that it's eerily similar to the crapstorm that was intentionally whipped up in the media prior to the launch of the PS3.

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Excelsior1
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 6:17:33 AM

@highlander

ah the ps3's luanch. now that was a train wreck. lesson learned out of that would be if your going to offer an arguably overpriced system you better make damn sure you have some game offerings that look better than what the competition is offering or the consumer will turn real fast. there appeared to be some genuine sticker shock out there at the ps3's luanch. combine that with a the fact there was no software to justify that pricepoint and you get a real mess. hell, i remember the official playstation magazine drew that conclusion at the ps3's luanch and the editor in chief at the time john davidson expressed some real concern for sony becuase the games he was seeing simply just did look as good as the 360's.

the 3ds is suffering from some of the same problems the ps3 ran into in this regard. too high a pricepoint with no software to drive sales. i do give credit to nintendo for responding quickly and aggressively to this problem in an attempt to boost confidence in the platform. sony was a little slow to respond when they faced a similar situation imo. by time they did the 360 was too well entrenched.

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:17:04 AM

Excelsior,

No, you've utterly missed the point. In the year or more up to the actual launch of the PS3 there was a nearly literal tidal wave of stories questioning the need for HDMI, a standard HDD built in, BluRay, full HD graphics in games, some even questioned whether games would ever hit 1080p at all, built-in wireless networking was questioned, wireless controllers were questioned, motion sensing controllers were questioned, and on and on. Yes, the PS3's price was high, but apart from the bull crap excuse peddled by people ever since that the sticker shock was responsible (specifically in the US) for a lack luster performance, the absolute truth of the matter is that there was a wall of negativity thrown up around the PS3 long before it actually arrived in the market.

The complete majority of that negativity was utterly unmerited, and the remainder had a tiny, tiny kernel of near truth that was perhaps 1% of the inflated worry being written about. That campaign of negativity was a classic FUD campaign, and when you go back and look at the kinds of complaints in the the press (prior to launch) they exactly mirror the areas which Sony's principle competitor in HD gaming was trying to draw the PS3 into question.

So, no, this is nothing to do with price and everything to do with some in the industry desperate to slow Sony by creating a wall of negativity around what really is an incredible product from a price/performance standpoint. But don't let that fact get in the way of that campaign.

Last edited by Highlander on 8/16/2011 10:17:51 AM

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 3:30:52 AM
Reply

Of course it's not going to be popular. But everyone already knows that. The Vita is marketed at the hardcore gamers who want their experiences on the go, and that is a niche market. Sony knows that, and are basing their figures on that. It may not be a huge success, but it will not be DOA. Besides, it has an MP3/MP4 player built in, the ability to surf the web, talk to people through the web, you can view photos and play FULL console quality games. It's primarily a gaming console, but not purely one. Anyone who thinks that is a dolt.

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___________
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 4:10:25 AM
Reply

what a crock of sh*t!
i carry my iphone 4, HTC, PSP and god knows what other crap with me almost all the time!
god invented backpacks or even pockets for a reason!
hell, what about all the girl gamers out there?
a vita would be the perfect handbag accessory!
;)

"why you would put out a device that only does games?"
oh please!
thats a joke right?
one the 3Ds and vita dont do just games.
2 there certainly is a market for this, after all everyone this gen is a graphics whore, so who does not want to play ps3 graphics games on the train?
the reason the iphones so popular is not because it does everything, there were a billion smartphones that did everything it did, and more, and better, even before it released!
its done so well because look at the support apple are getting.
anything you can think of you can download off the apps store!
its not what the device does thats made it so popular, because simply well look at the HTC phones.
they can do MORE things, they can do things the iphone cant, and they can do things better then the iphone could ever dream of!
so why are the HTC phones not doing as well?
simple, they dont have every developer in there pocket.
every single day there are hundreds of new apps on the apps store.
how many does google get?
hell, how many does PSN, XBLA, steam and wiiware put together get!?
people underestimate how important support is.
you can do really well, even with a crap product, if you support it well.
but not even a device made by the gods could survive if it does not have the support!
take down the apps store, then lets see how popular the iphone is!

as long as the vita has the support, it will do fine!
REALLY need a price drop here though!
since when is 249 USD 400 AUD?
last time i checked the AUD was STRONGER not WEAKER then the USD!
sigh....... $ony ripping off their fans YET again!!!!!!
no way in hell is a vita worth only 100 bucks less then a ps3!
AND a 2nd controller.
AND 4 games of your choice!
AND a HDMI cable!
AND a bluray remote!
hell just in those items alone, you got over 200 bucks worth of kit!
hell, JB had a special on yesterday that was offering a 320GB ps3, 2 titanium blue controllers extra, a 3D certified monster 3000 series there top of the line HDMI cable, your pick of 4 games out of ACB, NFS hot pursuit, games around that release so it was not rubbish, and a playTV for only 600 bucks!
just the HDMI cable alone retails for 140!
yea............ they really need to drop the price of it if they think its going to sell here!
spend 248 on a 3DS and get a free game, or spend 400 on just a vita.
hmmmmmmmmmmmm, i think i know what most are gonna go for!


Last edited by ___________ on 8/16/2011 4:12:11 AM

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Lawless SXE
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 5:16:39 AM

HOLY CRAP! I agreed with most of what you just wrote... now I'm waiting for the world to come crashing down.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 5:53:57 AM

"the 3Ds and vita dont do just games." - what else do they do?

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___________
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:37:46 AM

web browsing for one.
watching movies, listening to music, basically everything their brothers can do they can do.
to say mobile phones are going to replace dedicated handheld units is just ridiculous!

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:37:46 AM

Let's see, my PSP does music, pictures, movies, and Internet, if I had the GPS add-on from Japan it would do satnav too.

The Vita will do all of that, and lots more besides, just because it doesn't function as a 3G/wireless data router for your PC, doesn't make it a game only devices Beamboom.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 11:17:54 AM

Lol - that's one of *ten* items on my list, High! What about the other 9? I can easily come up with another list of ten things too, if you like? ;)
I mean: Web, pics, mp3, video, that's *nothing* compared to what todays smart phones can do. It's just... nothing. Sorry.

What I got a feeling you guys do here, and please don't take this offensive, but I get a feeling that you are describing how you *want* things to be. You *want* the Vita to succeed. You *want* people to want it. You *want* it to beat the iPad/Android based gadgets.

And I'll tell you what: So do I! Sure, I would love to see Vita become an awesome, fun packed new gadget that everyone wants. I know that I myself will get it at some stage, probably after the first price drop or the first game from BioWare, whatever comes first. :)

It's just, I am afraid that this is wishful thinking. I do not think the market will be that impressed by a gadget that can browse pictures and the web, play music, movies and games. Everything can do that now. Heck, you even got bloody picture frames that can display images and movie clips while playing music. It's gross!

But even worse: Everyone already *owns* an item that can do those things. That's the *major* difference between earlier and now.


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 11:28:37 AM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 12:56:18 PM

I listed only the things that a PSP could do.

If you want a list here goes,

PS1 games
PS Suite Games
PSP Games
PS Vita Games
Web browsing
Video playback
photo display
take pictures
take video
functions as a PS3 controller
GPS - navigation
music playback
function as USB drive
Augmented reality applications and social networking through PSN and Vita specific features.

Your list includes numerous items that are handled within the browser on the various smartphone and tablet devices. There's no reason to suppose that they cannot be done within the browser on the Vita, we simply have no specific confirmation either way. So much of your list is predicated on browser functionality, that we won't know until we see the browser on the Vita.

One thing we also don't know yet about the Vita is whether it might include a virtual machine running Android to allow Vita to make use of all that Android content. It will certainly have the hardware to handle that, but we have no idea whether Sony has the will to do that.

The point though is that the Vita will do much of what you're talking about, although a lot of that will be done through the browser instead of discrete applications. I was reading an article only to day about how consumers prefer to use tablet sized devices for many of the things that might be used as examples of what Vita may, or may not be capable of doing. In truth. Smartphones are running into a problem that they cannot easily overcome. As they grow to incorporate bigger screens and other features, they become unwieldy as phones. There is an upper limit on what is a truly pocket sized smartphone device, and the PSV is about twice that size. It's not intended to take the place of that smartphone.

The flip side is the tablet sized devices, with their 10-inch or bigger screens and large touch panels, they are very capable of lots of uses that smartphones can functionally do, but thanks to their size, not well suited to, such as browsing products, web sites, high res graphics or reading. The larger screens also make much better viewing for movies and they can include pretty big batteries, to handle the pretty big screen power requirements. their drawback is of course their size. Gaming on a tablet is a bit awkward because of the size of the device, even if it includes motion sensing controls, it's a bit like playing a game while holding a magazine flat between your hands. Tablets include cameras, but again, their size is a liability in many situations. Finally, a tablet needs to be carried around in a case, it's almost as big as a netbook or small laptop. but it fills it's niche.

Neither the smartphone nor the tablet includes two things that games need. Analog sticks and buttons. Vita does include those. Vita's size is in that middle area between smartphone size and tablet size. The screen is big, bright and sharp enough for most media to be used. Although it's not as big and convenient as a tablet, it outclasses most pocket sized smartphones because of that size advantage. For functions such as web browsing, gaming, video, pictures and even taking pictures, Vita is sized well enough to work in most regards. It's small enough for convenient photography, but large enough to make video viewing something other than an exercise in squinting. But the point it that Vita is a gaming device and it's targeted at gaming. But because of the hardware, the size, and the inclusion of features like the cameras, touch panels, GPS, 3G and browser functionality, the Vita has the potential to be useful in many more ways. It might not take the place of a larger tablet device, but for someone on the move, the combination of a packet sized smartphone with a 3G Vita would be pretty difficult to beat for flexibility, capability and portability.

In my opinion, of course.

The biggest question with Vita, is whether it will feature the kinds of discrete applications that are commonplace on i-devices and Android devices. If Sony can sandbox an Android instance on the Vita, it could potentially have access to the complete Android repertoire. However even without that, there is the potential and possibility of some productivity applications appearing on Vita from Sony or other Vita developers via PSN. To me that is a logical extension of what we already know.

Last edited by Highlander on 8/16/2011 12:59:15 PM

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:12:02 PM

*If* they include a usable browser that support modern standard technologies (including html5 and flash) as well as a virtual machine running Android, well then we definitely are starting to talk here. But this is one major parade of IFs.

Also, I'm not convinced that the market will be persuaded even if what we sketch here becomes reality. Cause even then it's still not much they can't already do on their current mobile phone.

I guess all we can do is wait and see!


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 1:19:18 PM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:26:56 PM

But, beamboom, you're still talking about Vita as if it has to be a smartphone device. There is a whole laundry list of things it can do whether it has Android capability or not. Some things may depend on the capability of the browser, but there's still that long list of things it can do without the browser. There was a statement that the Vita is game only, when it clearly is not. It's a viable media player, camera and gaming device that is more convenient and functional than a pad or tablet in many ways and with a better screen size than smartphones. Everything else is gravy.

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:34:39 PM

It is a big difference in accessing something via a browser interface and a native app. Not so much technically as to how the public perceive things. I'd almost say it doesn't count.
You could say that with Vita - if a decent browser is included - you got an encyclopedia via Wikipedia, an office suite through Google Documents, a calendar app through Google Calendar, your email through your employers webmail interface etc. But it just aint the same. neither will the general public think it is the same.

Regarding the rest of your laundry ;) let's right away exclude everything that has to do with gaming. There is not a shadow of doubt in my mind that the Vita will be an *amazing* game console. My worry is if that is enough for todays market.

If we look at the PSP I'd say that is a device only usable for gaming. Sure, it had the technical capability of being more, but in reality those capabilities were so poorly executed that it made the device what I'd call a pure gaming device.
A few years ago you could find me at a cafe using the psp to check out my employers message board. It did happen once or twice. But that was before Android - and it was a friggin' hazzle. It would never happen today.

I am *worried* that the same will be the case with the Vita. I may be wrong! Noone knows yet. Maybe Sony has really made a killer environment on the Vita. But I do have my serious doubts.


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 2:54:19 PM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:49:21 PM

I completely disagree with you about the notion that browser based apps are somehow perceived as not as good as discrete apps. More and more people are using their browser as the primary tool for basic tasks. When your data is already online, and you are working on it online, you use a browser based app, not a discrete app. Think the photo editors for online photo sites as an example, or Google's Office apps. These things are browser based. Obviously it depends on the capability of the browser. But I refute the notion that because an app is browser based it somehow counts for less.

I also disagree with you about that PSP being only for games. I use mine on the move for games, pictures and music. The smartphone is used to browse because it's obviously a more powerful devices than the 6 year old PSP. But that 6 year old device destroys the smartphone for games.

Last edited by Highlander on 8/16/2011 2:51:02 PM

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Beamboom
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 2:56:51 PM

"using their browser as the primary tool" -> on their PCs/tablets, yes, but not on their small handheld devices with a screen comparable to the Vita - in effect iPhone, SE Arc & co! That is a *significant* difference. I am however worried that Sony think the exact same way as you do. And if so, they will fail. That is my prediction.

But yes, I love my PSP games and I fully expect the Vita to be an *amazing* games machine - just like the PSP has been. All I say is that I doubt it is enough for the mass market. I'd love to be proven wrong though.

... But dude... If you use your PSP as a mp3 player then you are a more serious case of nerd than I expected. ;)


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/16/2011 3:06:04 PM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 4:11:50 PM

I have my PSP with me for my games, I'm not going to kill my phone's battery by making it play music, so the PSP handles it, plus it doesn't need speakers or headphones. Great for relaxation music overnight and such.

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Beamboom
Wednesday, August 17, 2011 @ 7:06:41 AM

Man it warms my heart to see you still use the PSP that much. I used to do the same. I really did love that little buddy. Before a holiday I would fill it up with new episodes of a favourite radio panel game series of mine, "Just A Minute" from BBC and listen to them underneath an exotic sun.

Today, wherever I am I just use my mobile and connect to the streamcast sent from my apartment (stream beatradar com:8007). Not as cosy. Just a lot easier. :)

Here's hoping that prior to launch something about the Vita is revealed that will make me go "omfg, *THAT* is pretty darn awesome!1!111!!".


Last edited by Beamboom on 8/17/2011 7:18:37 AM

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___________
Wednesday, August 17, 2011 @ 9:07:54 AM

one thing sony could do to make the vita really solid is allow access to the android store and make it compatible with the apps.
have good cross compatibility support between the playstation phone.
that way the playstation phone would be what it should of been!
id buy it in a heartbeat if it had the hardware a iphone 4 had!
add android capability, then your basically opening up the device to endless capabilities!
one thing we REALLY need is a find my vita app.
thats the best thing about the iphone, and is why its so popular, simply because its limits are only set by the apps store.
open the vita up to the android market and your opening it up to a whole new world, and a whole new use!
not only is it now a gaming device, but its now also like a mini tablet.
i doubt they would do that, but if they did, it would literally cement the vita for the next few years!
allot of people are saying dedicated handheld devices are dead, they cant compete with smartphones.
well, what better way to deal with that, then to work with them?

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 17, 2011 @ 10:44:44 AM

You'd have to pry my PSP from my cold dead hand before I'd give it up....until I get my Vita of course...LOL!

Mr. Underline,

There's one thing I hope that Sony does, but after the issues with the PS3 I heavily doubt they will do, and that is allow Android to run in a virtual machine so that it can do exactly as you're suggesting. That's one of the things that BeamBoom and I are talking about, but I honestly think that the impact of the hacking on the PS3 will limit the possibility of that happening to about a 0.1% chance.

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Beamboom
Thursday, August 18, 2011 @ 3:42:46 AM

Yeah with the news that the Vita will have Facebook accessibility via a PSN store app the chances of an Android engine just dropped to *zero*.
It ain't gonna happen.

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Neo_Aeon666
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 7:28:43 AM
Reply

I think they fail to see the Vita might become the *true* extension to your home gaming. If they really push on that dual release of PS3/Vita titles then they will rule the UNIVERSE! :D And now with autocloud you don't even need to bother uploading your saves (if you are a plus member).

The mobile devices blow. I am using my phone for text/google maps/call people/agenda. Anymore than that is stupid and just drains the battery life too much. That is why a real second gaming device is needed. I have the 3DS at the moment but I feel its days are numbered as the Vita is coming closer. In the end my 3DS will be my pokemon/mario platform while I'll be able to play my *real* games on vita with full trophy support :D (yes I am a trophy hoar lol)

Not to mention the Vita will blow any phone away in specs when it comes out. We will probably have to wait till Iphone 7 for similar specs and still it won't be a dedicated gaming machine and won't have real *controls* (and anyone who says he will carry a bluetooth controller to play his iphone can go die cuz I will never put my iphone on my lap while holding a controller in public transit, thats the best way to get it stolen in 0.5 sec in montreal lol) (plus it looks stupid)

Last edited by Neo_Aeon666 on 8/16/2011 7:34:46 AM

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gumbi
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 8:40:51 AM
Reply

Well, I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said, but I still gotta say it.

I really, really don't understand this sudden backlash. It seems like just yesterday we were all applauding Sony for their slick new handheld and $250 launch price. WTF?

The iSheeple are willing to drop $400+ on an MP3 player, or $750 on a godam phone just because it has a lowercase 'i' in front of it. But a full featured powerhouse of a gaming console with touch and hardware controls priced at a fraction of that is too much? GTFO!

"My phone plays games" ... Seriously, we've all tried to play games with touch controls. They work great for small gimmicky games like angry birds but real games, real games need REAL controls.

I eagerly await my first encounter with a phone gamer who thinks the Vita is an overpriced flop after I get my Vita. They can stumble around their crumby racing game, or awkwardly controlled mediocre adventure game. I'll bust out some Uncharted, or LittleBigPlanet, or Mortal Kombat. Lets see your 3x more expensive super device play games like THIS!

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention the 3DS...

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XENOS
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:05:10 AM
Reply

I disagree. I think mobile gaming will continue to push more innovative ways to make the experience more interesting. Cell phones will continue to have simplicity games but I for one want something alot more

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BlinkBoy
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:14:04 AM
Reply

Personally i will be carrying Xperia Play and the PS Vita at the same time!

No one can stop me! When Vita battery runs out I can play a game on my phone, don't see whats the big deal is.

Haha, $299 for Vita doesn't scare me one bit. Getting 3G version for sure.

Last edited by BlinkBoy on 8/16/2011 10:14:49 AM

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 10:40:25 AM
Reply

The thing is, all the gnashing of teeth about single use devices, what good is a phone for gaming? It has no analog sticks and no buttons. I can't begin to tell you how many column inches were squandered complaining about the PSP's lack of a second analog input. Well, iPhone and other smartphones have no analog input and no control buttons, just a big, flat touch surface. Personally, I think that the design of smartphones limits their use for anything other than being a phone/PDA-lite.

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BikerSaint
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 1:39:43 PM
Reply

And now Crytek is crying the "Woe is me" hand-held blues too...

Crytek: Dedicated handheld consoles "losing ground" to tablets

Crysis developer Crytek has said that dedicated handheld games consoles are losing ground to multifunctional tablet devices in the portable space.

Speaking to GamesIndustry.biz, the developer of hardcore shooting games said that it has no immediate interest in Sony's PlayStation Vita, despite the team's willingness to adopt and experiment with new, high-end technology.

Full story here:

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2011-08-16-crytek-dedicated-handheld-consoles-losing-ground-to-tablets

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Highlander
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 4:12:24 PM

Crytek like Microsoft, what does anyone expect?

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Beamboom
Thursday, August 18, 2011 @ 3:33:19 AM

There is an Unreal engine for iPhone now... Oh man what if Crytek made an engine for the Vita. How awsome wouldnt that be...!

Last edited by Beamboom on 8/18/2011 3:33:52 AM

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amonte
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 6:03:18 PM
Reply

The fact is, people would much rather carry one do it all device than multiple one devices, it's a fact, that is why I want Vita to be able to make/receive at least simple calls and texts even if it's only with headphones or a bluetooth headset, have apps for everything and all the other handy things smartphones can do. But if Sony does a good job with Vita not just on quality hardcore games, but with everything, than Vita will fine because for hardcore gamers that want a portable device, Vita is their only choice, Vita is fine because of that fact until smartphones or maybe even tablets have dual analog sticks.

A way Vita can be completely good and have guaranteed success is if you can play your PS3 games on Vita and vice-verse without the PS3 or Vita being connected to the internet or the disc having to be in the PS3 or either device being in a "stuck" mode which means you can't do anything like how the PS3 is currently when you use Remote Play. That is a dream and like someone said, PlayStation would rule the universe.

Another way is if Vita can make/receive calls and texts and all the other things I mentioned above.

Of course having both the last two paragraphs is a 100% guaranteed SUPER success.

EDIT: You could even have one SKU with no phone capabilities and another with phone capalities, etc. Sony also needs to have casual titles to get non hardcore gamers and match the price of titles that are on other devices even the ones priced at free.

Last edited by amonte on 8/16/2011 6:06:37 PM

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Cesar_ser_4
Tuesday, August 16, 2011 @ 6:27:13 PM
Reply

I say the reason why people don't want to buy the 3ds at 249.99 was because of the lack of support from devs. I've said this before and I'll say it again, it's not the price that sells the device, is the support behind it that does, well that and the features it carries. I just don't get why people keep comparing the vita with the 3ds, as if they were in the same category. Vita is in a category of its own.

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Highlander
Wednesday, August 17, 2011 @ 10:46:06 AM

The original PSP is actually a great demonstration of exactly what you say. Dev support and software matters more than price for these things. The PSP suffered particularly badly from an extended game drought. Sony has to ensure that Vita launches well and has a continued supply of good, high profile, games.

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